Who among Ramsey/Özil/Cazorla should be dropped?

Discussion in 'Arsenal Talk' started by sammy89, Aug 9, 2015.

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Who among Ramsey/Özil/Cazorla should be dropped?

  1. Özil

  2. Ramsey

  3. Cazorla

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Rain Dance

    Rain Dance Well-Known Member Trusted

    I gave you the match reports, Ramsey was CM !

    You reasoning for your post is Ramsey provided goal threat on the wings.....which I already rebutted but you deliberately snip out as usual tactic of your debate
     
  2. MrBump

    MrBump Active Member

    Still can't believe the love in on Ramsey ?

    His goal threat ?? His biggest tally was 10 goals in that season where everything that could go right did go right. Outside those 5 months he has been poor.
    Oh but wait............ He runs a lot !!!!!

    Now he's playing as a #10 ? He is slow, he moves the ball slow, he's just not good enough !
    But it's obvious AW would love 10 Ramsey's. Just kaos on the pitch.

    I. Looking forward to the day we move him on
     
    Stoneh likes this.
  3. Gooner n Proud

    Gooner n Proud a.k.a. nasri_8 and Voice of Flamini

    Your making yourself look a bit ridiculous now and contradicting yourself as usual.

    This was ''your'' first response to one of my posts on page 26:


    Nasri 8: It's not just about our possession game as a style more of just having the ability to keep the ball when progressing in the final third trying to build an attack, Walcott and Sanchez unfortunately both struggle with this. You talk about balance but in actual fact those two flanking a striker like Giroud would likely imbalance us immensely, its the reason Wenger rarely played Walcott-Giroud- Podolski together 3 years ago.

    Rain Dance: ''Don't you love it when people forgot Podolski was replaced with Gervinho and Wenger did try Gervinho Giroud Ramsey and cost us lots of points, just to prove their opinion?
    FOX news would proud about these posts''

    All Im saying here is that I strongly believe a front 3 of Theo-Giroud-Sanchez isnt viable enough for a club of our aspirations making a comparision with the Theo-Giroud-Podolski partnership which Wenger quickly halted 3 years ago as he saw the two wingers were not productive enough in possession. Even though Sanchez is 5 times the player Podolski ever was I still think he is sloppy in possession. You then respond with your nonsense claiming Arsène fielded an attack of Gervinho-Giroud -Ramsey which was never the case as I showed in my previous post.

    The next interaction:

    Nasri 8:
    Give me one game when Ramsey-Giroud-Gervinho were the front 3?

    Rain Dance:
    Replace Gervinho with Cazorla, I mistakenly remembered the wrong name.

    Nasri 8:
    I think you meant Ramsey-Gervinho-Podolksi which I actually thought was a decent combination at first with Cazorla as the playmaker and Arteta partnering Diaby in the deeplying midfield positions but overall Gervinhos finishing was just too woeful and we lost Diaby to injury 6 games into the season causing us to tweak the team for months until we found a suitable balance again which wasn't until March 2013 after that defeat at white hart lane which saw us drop Sceszney, Vermalaen and Wilshere for Fabianski, koscielny and Rosicky.

    Rain Dance:
    it was mostly Podolski-Giroud-Gervinho or Podolski/Cazorla-Gervinho-Theo.

    And here is a thread from 2012, on A-M reminding you how woeful Ramsey in RW was
    https://arsenal-mania.com/forum/threads/aaron-ramsey-on-the-right-track.26644/page-9

    In this interaction you are trying to say that Giroud-Gervinho-Cazorla was the front 3 which was only the case in one match very late in the season, the 4-0 victory at home to Reading. I have said in my opinion that I thought Ramsey-Gervinho-Podolski backed up by Cazorla at the time was a balanced unit until Diaby got injured that season which lead to a lot of swapping and changing as Abou was key to our performances defensively and offensively at the beginning of that campaign, he had a monstrous performance against Liverpool I recall. You then respond by randomly posting a link about Ramsey in RW in 2012 when I already have given my opinion on that.

    Next interaction:

    Nasri 8:

    No rain dance.

    Podolski-Giroud-Gervinho only started together once and a front three of Cazorla-Gervinho-Walcott never occurred do check your facts.

    Rain Dance:I wrote Cazorla/Podolski - Gervinho -Walcott. Here is the team sheethttp://www.theguardian.com/football/2012/aug/24/squad-sheets-stoke-city-arsenal

    Nasri 8:Ramsey only began to look terrible on the right that year when Giroud became our main starting striker and with Podolski on the left hand side our attack was too predictable and static with these three it was never going to work.

    Rain Dance:
    You know why it is suddenly become terrible? Who did Ramsey replaced? Theo.
    And Giroud was our main striker from the beginning that season although he didn't play all games.
    Ramsey was terrible on the wings again last season, we were static and Ramsey played without understanding his role. Guess who was injured? Theo

    One thing I am really confused is : Why the heck can't you guys understand HE IS NOT A WINGER? Of course, he can become one if given 3-5 years on the wing but at what COST? He doesn't even play as a right midfielder, he crowded the center area.

    Square peg in a round hole is the problem we've been pointing out in our squad for years, and now we are advocating it?
    All our players must play based on FORM not based on favoritism, that include Alexis, Cech, Per, Giroud, Cazorla, Ramsey and Jack.

    In this interaction you say Our attack and ramsey on the right began to look terrible because he replaced Theo? Okay. With the exception of the very first game of that season, Sunderland at home,when else up till november did Theo start a 'league' match for us on the right hand ?
    Wenger played Aaron on the RW because he had better ball skills than Podolski, complimented our passing game, put in a defensive shift and because Gervinho was our no.9 his lack of pace wasnt an issue for the team in terms of balance, Podolski was also never a slouch and had decent pace. So what exactly do you mean he looked terrible because he replaced Theo when he was preferred over him for months?

    Next Interaction:
    Nasri :If you actually read the article fully you'll see that was a pre match guide. The starting line up was a probable/predicted starters not the actual set for that game as I remember Giroud started his first game for us at the Britannia.

    Giroud was our main striker from the beginning that season? Okay so why did he only start 2 of our first 6 league games? You say Ramsey replaced Theo but again if you actually did your homework properly you'll see your wrong again as Theo only started once in the first 9 matches before Arsène eventually bought him back in the team for Ramsey in an attempt to balance out the attack due to Gervinho's injury which lead to Giroud becoming our main centre forward generating a problem in our forward line because you couldn't play a system and expect to succeed back then with Ramsey-Giroud-Podolski as it was too static so Arsène selected Theo over Ramsey around November time when Ramsey was benched but guess what? Arsène soon started to see that the new trio of Walcott,-Giroud-Podolski wasn't adequate itself as none of them were good enough on the ball. In fact it took us until March of that season to find a well organised-balanced offensive and defensive side which consisted of a forward line with Santi-Giroud-Walcott with Rosicky in behind them.

    Rain Dance:
    False, if you did your research you would notice Cazorla/Gervinho started as the winger in most of those first 9 games with Ramsey either playing as CM or mostly as subtitution in the 70th minute.
    http://www.arsenal.com/fixtures/first-team/results?season=2012/13 check for yourself

    We started using 1 midfielder in our wings starting from Schalke loss in October, in narrow win against QPR and culminated in loss against Man U.
    We went back to 3 attackers with Giroud-Podolski-Theo and scored 10 goals in 3 matches including 5-2 vs Toothnumb (the other were 2-2 & 3-3 draws) but Theo got injured.
    Without Theo, in the next 6 matches we can only score 2 goals maximum

    do your own research after this....

    In this interaction I am trying to show you that the link you posted in a previous post is nothing but a match preview report which consists of a ''predicted lineup'' not the actual team that was selected, it was the second game of the season, Theo did not start and didnt start a league match for us until the 10th November against Fulham at home where we drew 3-3 therefore that link you submitted does not reflect anything you claim making you look like the clown.
    You then respond by saying Cazorla started as a winger in the first 9 games which I know isnt true because his first match on the flanks was against Swansea at home in the FA Cup, January 2013, during the first half of the season he was a permanent no.10 for us. The inevitable link you post subsequently to try and help you win the debate proves nothing in relation to starting line ups, formations, tactics etc as it is just a fixtures and results list? So what proof have you got that Cazorla was positioned on the flanks before January 2013?

    Your wrong again as the first game we started utilizing Ramsey on the RW was City away where he was accompanied with ''Podolski and Gervinho'' and performed very well in that match which lead to Wenger retaining him in the line up for that game againsT ''Chelsea'' at home when Diaby got injured and where all the issues arised from that season as Wenger didnt bring in anyone to replace Alex Song to sit alongside Arteta as you inevitably know as an Arsenal fan Diaby will succumb to injury at some point. Ironically it was Ramsey in the end whom gave us that defensive balance towards the end of the season when Wenger started instructing him to do the basics and contribute more in possession
     
  4. Jaywood Mac

    Jaywood Mac Well-Known Member

    Mod edit:
    Understand the sentiment .... but just don't express in those words .
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 30, 2015
  5. celestis

    celestis Arsenal-Mania Veteran Moderator

    No way we let our best midfielder leave .
     
  6. Bould14

    Bould14 Well-Known Member

    I know Wenger doesn't like to tinker but I think the team he has assembled he has to. Against teams that leave space behind that want to press us play Theo/OX. Teams that want to defend 10 men behind the ball play Ramsey on right, and he can move between the line's and disrupt.

    If he get's it wrong he needs to sub the right personal in the 60-70 minutes.
     
  7. Rain Dance

    Rain Dance Well-Known Member Trusted

    GOD!!! HOW HARD IT IS TO MAKE YOU UNDERSTAND !!!
    Match reports, I gave you match reports from Arsenal.com. Theo started as RW/SS with Giroud upfront and Podolski LW.

    Aaron played CM for those period of time or riding the bench
    check the bloody match reports, the line up is full of Gervinho/Chamberlain/Theo-Giroud/Gervinho/Podolski-Podolski/Cazorla
    Aaron is playing as CM alongside of Arteta, he is only playing RW as a sub.
    The only time he played RW in the beginning is versus Man City (he was horrible) and Chelsea (horrible and we lost)
    , Since you insist the line up changes, I gave match you reports from Arsenal.com, and the line up is exactly the same

    AND since you insist Giroud wasn't our main striker from the the start of season, it turns out the first 6 games he was rotating with the other 3. So semantically, YES he is our main striker from the start of the season.
    Bulshit, you as usual only nitpicking on things favouring yourself. The links provided that Ramsey was CM alongside Arteta
    And suddenly you changed to, it was the 2nd game of the season while first it was Giroud started 2 in the first 6 games

    PS about Theo: so you omitted the fact Theo coming in from the bench and scored a couple of games after the first game against Sunderland? Theos regularly playing as RW as starter or coming from the bench

    http://www.arsenal.com/match/report/1213/post/first-team/arsenal-6-1-southampton-match-report
    http://www.arsenal.com/match/report/1213/post/first-team/west-ham-united-1-3-arsenal-report

    For God's sake, look at the match reports.... click it and see the line up.....you wanted match reports I gave you match reports...
    Are you new to computers? there's that tiny link that say "match news" and click on the subsequent page"match reports" which has everything from starting line to formation to how the game goes.... it's a simple thing....

    You suggested Ramsey-Gervinho-Giroud combination were playing in the flanks LOTS of time and WORKS, they didn't.

    I pretty much wrote Cazorla/Podolski for a reason.... if you can't fathom why it is written that way, keep nitpicking

    Hahahahaha Ramsey was horrible in that match, Garcia owned him, I remember cursing Wenger on this site afterward. We were toothless, our zone marking from corner was crap and Koscielny saved us http://www.arsenal.com/match/report/1213/post/first-team/manchester-city-1-1-arsenal-match-report

    We were also crap against Chelsea... not because of Diaby, but we are toothless
    in 2012, we were cursing Wenger for playing Ramsey as RW I gave you the link already
    It wasn't Walcott's 20th goal, Rosicky re-insurgence, defensive balance between Mertesacker and Koscielny, but it had to be Ramsey....
     
  8. Rain Dance

    Rain Dance Well-Known Member Trusted

    Question for public :
    What season did Wenger shoehorn Ramsey to no.10 ? I can't pinpoint the year
     
  9. MrBump

    MrBump Active Member

    Probably the same year he played at RB.

    Said it before, wengers best 11 is

    Cech
    Ramsey, Ramsey, kos, Ramsey
    Ramsey, Ramsey
    Ramsey, Özil, Alexis
    Ramsey

    Ramsey, Ramsey, Ramsey, Ramsey, arteta
     
    Gooner n Proud and Rimaal like this.
  10. Kwaku

    Kwaku Member

    2011/12 season.
     
  11. Tir Na Nog

    Tir Na Nog In Big Trouble If He Speaks

    Wasn't really shoehorning, was more to do with the fact we lost Cesc and Nasri in August and Wilshere to injury. Pretty much played there due to lack of options. Rosicky took over from January onwards and was superb.
     
    James Bond and Gooner n Proud like this.
  12. Gooner n Proud

    Gooner n Proud a.k.a. nasri_8 and Voice of Flamini

    Lol that was the worse Arsenal team of I've watched in 11-12 yet we still finished 3rd above Liverpool & Sp**s whom had both spent a fortune the summer preceeding that season, how did Arsène manage that? I know the man has his faults but he's a genius!
     
  13. Taylor Gang Gunners

    Taylor Gang Gunners Shame is a dish best served cold Trusted

    We had RVJudas who was probably the best striker in the world at that point. Insane numbers, scoring braces more or less every game. Won us game after game throughout the entire season, including a hat-trick away at Chelski.

    But yeah, that was a poor team. Andre Santos and Sebastien Squillaci in the same defence FFS.
     
    blaze_of_glory likes this.
  14. OzMadrid

    OzMadrid New Member

    You should drop Özil and hopefully he realizes Wenger isn't fulfiling what he promised him and goes to a club where he can play at his best, the media doesn't have an agenda against him and most fans actually rate him. :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2015
  15. US_Gooner

    US_Gooner Well-Known Member

    No.
     
    Hegemony likes this.
  16. MrBump

    MrBump Active Member

    Unfortunately I think Özil and especially Alexis will grow frustrated and want to leave.
    Wenger not only letting fans down, but also players.
     
    salvat, Triniboy and OzMadrid like this.
  17. Triniboy

    Triniboy Active Member

    This is what I think, after playing with Ronaldo Messi etc those two are going to get fed up with the mediocrity, Wenger sold them a dream and has not delivered this summer.
     
  18. My_Two_Cents

    My_Two_Cents Active Member

    You could see it with Sanchez on Saturday when he passed to Ramsey who tried to bring the ball forward and made a pigs ear of it. Sanchez just looked to the skies and puffed his cheeks in frustration - was very unlike him
     
  19. Gooner n Proud

    Gooner n Proud a.k.a. nasri_8 and Voice of Flamini

    We have just been immensely unlucky with injuries these last 24 months that's why the team has deviated every week pretty much which leads to a lack of cohesiveness in our play. Our best patches of form during these periods actually came when the boss could select the same team consecutively; autumn 2013 and the second half of last season.
     
  20. Bould14

    Bould14 Well-Known Member

    I bet Wenger sells dreams very well. He get's half our fan base to believe his farce every year.
     

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