Squad Analysis 2011/12

As for the squad = I want an entertainer, a flair player, a show pony with end product, someone who makes the crowd sit up & take notice any time they are on the ball, someone who makes them go AAhhhh & takes the breath away with pace, control, touch, vision, audacity, outrageous skill & finesse, and goals.

In other words, you want a Ryo Miyaichi.

Does anyone think that maybe Jack will start the season on the bench and come on as a substitute for a couple games, then slowly return into the starting eleven? Maybe Arsène might want to go easy on him, unless he can come back this year and do the whole substitute thing this season, so next season he can be fresh and ready to go.

Why do you want a circus clown?

Trust me, watching a team with Wilshere, Chamberlain and Robin in next season will be anything but boring.

Lol - I wouldn't call any of CR7, Aguero, Silva etc circus clowns as they have end product & same with guys like Cruyff, Maradonna, Garrincha, Eder, Laudrup.

Agreed that the prospects of the team display will not be boring, just as the Invinvibles were not boring in their pomp & swagger.
But I'm greedy & want an individual that will torment the opposition with the ball at feet & capable of breaking open the deep set defences by getting amongst them rather than trying to pass around them as a team. I feel that this is often a Plan B that we lack as AW builds around the collective display = the endless passing around the area.

As for the squad = I want an entertainer, a flair player, a show pony with end product, someone who makes the crowd sit up & take notice any time they are on the ball, someone who makes them go AAhhhh & takes the breath away with pace, control, touch, vision, audacity, outrageous skill & finesse, and goals.

In other words, you want a Ryo Miyaichi.

Lol - I think I may have mentioned that name.
I hope he doesn't have that enthusiasm of youth trained out of him by the serious business of football.

Does anyone think that maybe Jack will start the season on the bench and come on as a substitute for a couple games, then slowly return into the starting eleven? Maybe Arsène might want to go easy on him, unless he can come back this year and do the whole substitute thing this season, so next season he can be fresh and ready to go.

I hope this is the case to be honest as for all his talent Jack is still very young and shouldn't be put under so much pressure. We all know he is good enough to start but that doesn't mean he has to and the same applies for Chamberlain.

One good thing i see now is that we have senior players to compliment our youngguns. Arteta and Wilshere, Rosicky and Ramsey, Santos and Gibbs, Walcott and Ox. People to be the more experienced head and allow our exciting young stars to grow up properly, instead of the previous years wherewe were completely dependant on the younger generation to perform. I think we're definitely moving in the right direction by concentrating as much on the old heads as much as the exciting young stars.

**** that. Sign that kid up to as long a contract as you can get him to agree to.

We'd all be spitting feathers if we waited even a day to long to offer him a new contract and it resulted in any sort of bad feeling between him and the club. He joined from a League One side on only 20K a week - if you go by the figures in the paper - there's a decent chance he'll be in the England squad in the summer and he has been outstanding at times this season - happy to give players like Alex a new contract.

No way is he the sort of kid to kick back his heels because he's got a new contract - he wants to be the best player in the world.

He's already on a long term contract and 20k a week is more than enough for an 18y old kid with potential. If we're starting to give players big contract at this age they'll demand silly money when they're 25.

You give new contracts when progress is made on a consistent basis throughout the season not after a couple of eye catching performances.

I disagree. Chamberlain has shown this season he's one of the biggest talents in the game - as an Arsenal fan all I care about is him being tied down to as long a contract as is possible. The club will pay him what they think they can afford to pay him.

According to transfer market he's on a contract until 2017 and even if the info is not accurate I think it's safe to say he's on a longterm contract, so what's the rush?

He didn't sign a 6 year contract when he joined, 5 years is the maximum length allowed for a start.

I just don't have any problem at all with the club paying a player like that what he's worth. And what he's worth is what he's able to earn elsewhere. And that's a lot more than 20k a week. Pay him what he's worth and keep him signed up to long-term contract.

Not bothered about chambos wages, the important thing is we get to add another year to his contract. If his contract runs out 2016 it's just 3 years until we got another Robin/Nasri situation so adding another year already is cool for me.

Wilshere got a similar bumper didn't he? Chambo has done well for us. I don't see it as a case of showering him with him cheddar but just reward.

He didn't sign a 6 year contract when he joined, 5 years is the maximum length allowed for a start.

I just don't have any problem at all with the club paying a player like that what he's worth. And what he's worth is what he's able to earn elsewhere. And that's a lot more than 20k a week. Pay him what he's worth and keep him signed up to long-term contract.

''Pay him what he's worth'' is a very relative argument IMO. If we go by this logic we'll never be able to offer him the same amount of money as Man City would so I don't agree with the bolded part. We can try and compete with the likes of Man City, Chelsea and other clubs with bigger wage structure, and offer young players bigger wages but we'll stumble to a brick wall when the player hits his prime at the age of 26/27. Our sustainable model doesn't allow 200k a week wages and that's exactly what you have to pay for a 27y old English international with a ''Rooney'' potential.

Actually don't think the problem comes with the players who fulfil their potential (Fabregas/Vieira before him etc.) The much bigger problem is when players don't, and then they're on your wage bill and clogging up spaces in the squad for players who would be worth those wages and squad places.

I disagree. Chamberlain has shown this season he's one of the biggest talents in the game - as an Arsenal fan all I care about is him being tied down to as long a contract as is possible. The club will pay him what they think they can afford to pay him.

Yeah, but he's already on a long term contract, though. We can offer him one next season, without even remotely putting us in danger of losing him, and that will also give us time to better assess how much he should earn, and how far he has developed.

And I hate to compare them with Ox but the reason we can't shift the likes of Diaby, Bendtner, Vela and Denilson is because of Ricky's way of thinking. The precedence was set and anything can happen in terms of Ox's development.

We need to make drastic improvements across the attack, if we are to challenge for anything next season. We cannot rely on Robin as heavily again, nor should we expect him to produce the numbers he has done over the past 2 years. To put it simply, he seriously needs support. Look at the respective contributions (in the PL) from the attackers within the top 5;

Man Utd; Rooney (21 goals + 5 assists), Hernandez (10 goals + 2 assists), Valencia (4 goals + 12 assists), Nani (6 goals + 8 assists), Welbeck (7 goals + 2 assists), Young (4 goals + 7 assists), Berbatov (7 goals)
Total: 59 goals + 36 assists

Man City; Aguero (17 goals + 5 assists), Balotelli (13 goals), Dzeko (13 goals + 3 assists), Silva (5 goals + 12 assists), Nasri (4 goals + 7 assists), A. Johnson (5 goals + 2 assists), Milner (3 goals + 5 assists)
Total: 60 goals + 34 assists

Arsenal; van Persie (26 goals + 9 assists), Walcott (7 goals + 8 assists), Rosicky (1 goals + 1 assist), Ramsey (2 goals + 4 assists), Gervinho (4 goals + 6 assists), Chamakh (1 goal), Oxlade (2 goals + 1 assist), Arshavin (1 goals + 3 assists)
Total: 44 goals + 32 assists

Tottenham; Adebayor (13 goals + 11 assists), Bale (9 goals + 8 assists), Lennon (3 goals + 4 assists), Van der Vaart (9 goals + 5 assists), Defoe (9 goals + 1 assist), Saha (3 goals + 1 assist), Pienaar (1 goal + 2 assists)
Total: 47 goals + 32 assists

Chelsea; Torres (3 goals + 4 assists), Drogba (5 goals + 1 assist), Lampard (10 goals + 5 assists), Mata (5 goals + 11 assists), Malouda (1 goal + 2 assists), Sturridge (10 goals + 3 assists), Kalou (1 goal), Lukaku (0 goals)
Total: 35 goals + 26 assists

No surprise that both City and United have a wide array of decent contributers supporting the main striker. Tottenham and Arsenal have fewer goals within their frontmen, and their positions in the table reflects that. The stats make for interesting reading when you look at the total of the teams, excluding the most prolific attacker.

Man Utd(minus Rooney): 38 goals + 31 assists
Man City(minus Aguero): 43 goals + 29 assists
Arsenal(minus van Persie): 18 goals + 23 assists
Tottenham(minus Adebayor): 34 goals + 21 assists
Chelsea(minus Lampard): 25 goals + 21 assists

He didn't sign a 6 year contract when he joined, 5 years is the maximum length allowed for a start.

I just don't have any problem at all with the club paying a player like that what he's worth. And what he's worth is what he's able to earn elsewhere. And that's a lot more than 20k a week. Pay him what he's worth and keep him signed up to long-term contract.

I agree with Beksl and Ibby. It's all well and good saying pay him what he's worth, but it is a very basic statement fraught with potential problems.

A summary of the problems as I see it are:

- Who decides how much the said player is worth? It's all subjective. We already have a squad of difficult to shift players, because one man decided that they were worth those wages at one moment in time. Denilson, Bendtner and Almunia have proved very difficult to offload, with our financial investment in them unlikely to be repaid by even a transfer fee. This trend may continue with players like 4th choice Djourou on a wage in excess of most first team starters at other smaller PL clubs. The FFP along with the general financial health of most clubs in Europe will see a much smaller demand for these players meaning a much smaller chance of offloading them.

- No matter how much a club can afford, any "wastage" of funds impacts on ability to spend in other areas. It is commonly held that Wenger determines the allocation of the transfer budget which includes wages. Our investment in players like Park and Diaby etc are not generating a return on the pitch for us and have hampered the club's ability to compete at the highest level.

- Decisions on the level of a single player's wages will affect the whole squad as they re-evaluate their own remuneration in comparison. Our wage costs have increased dramatically under Wenger. It was a trend in football that may have happened anyway, but one in which Wenger probably did as much to fuel as anyone. In contrast Man City's two seasons of splashing the cash has IMO not and will not have a massive impact on player wages in the PL and in Europe.

Man City spent heavily on relatively experienced players in the PL who had shown more than average ability. They paid over the odds to attract players under Mark Hughes who could accelerate their progress up the PL. They have achieved their aim and now have the status to compete with big clubs without having to pay a premium. Those "average" players will either see out their contracts or will be sold when they cease to be of use. It has obviously cost City a lot, but they could afford it. Now that they can go for quality, the going price for the average players should fall again. They will have a higher wage bill than ours, but their overall wage structure will still see a bigger gap between their top and bottom earners. The club is going for the top prizes and will not splash the cash on too many promising individuals without significant experience behind them as the expected returned is likely to be far more variable than going for more proven performers.

Arsenal under Wenger, decided to go for a youth orientated strategy which has been underway for several years in addition to exploiting the French leagues to secure players at less than their true worth. Young players are are signed on mass every season and on big contracts with the promise of first team opportunities. Since we have had some success out of it, others have copied it and either price their young players at unreasonable levels when selling or offer vast amounts when buying.

We have not matched Wenger's early success at the club, while our wage bill has grown dramatically. With the players now starting in the first team in their teens or early 20s, Wenger's propensity to reward every player with improved contracts every season under the guise of "protecting value", will see our future wage bill likely balloon further as they get older. This is all without the club achieving any tangible success. Song at 24 is reportedly going to be offered £75k a week. He already splits opinions on this forum and we have never come close to winning anything with him in the side. With our current means, we probably won't be able to sustain the wages of players like him unless we dramatically improve our revenues which will be dependent on our marketability which in turn will be affected by our success. This approach worked by selling our top players before we ever needed to pay them the going rate and replacing them with more young talent. If we keep them, at best we have a winning team, but are paying the going rates and at worst a team that is too expensive to maintain and is unsuccesful. IMO, Wenger's model is only suitable in the short term for a "big" club and thus is not a long-term option.

Chamberlain is unlikely to ask for a move so soon if we don't improve his wages immediately. If someone offers to buy him, then we should "protect or value" to keep him, but we should continually upgrade contracts significantly to reward promise without real achievement.

Really excited that we're starting to see a new crop of players very loyal and dedicated to the team. Through the late 90's and early 2000's it was evident how much players like Henry, Bergkamp, Pires, Keown, Adams, Viera and Ray Parlour all loved the club.

In recent years I've felt like this has waned with only Campbell, Sagna, Fabregas, Theo and RVP showing that kind of emotion and dedication. Might have missed out on one or two but honestly there haven't been a lot of players as of late showing that kind of passion.

Point being - look at our team now and how much of the team loves and is dedicated (hopefully) to Arsène and Arsenal.

Szcesny, Sagna, Jenkinson, Vermalean, Koscielny, Gibbs, Wilshere, Theo, and RVP. With the likes of Song, Ramsey, Ox and Lansbury all for one reason or another being close to that level too.

Real excited to seem the core develop and have the team fight for each other.

Is that Nasri in the bg?

Agree with the post btw, just found it a bit funny talking about loyal players with him in the pic

Right, I was thinking of brushing him out or adding a silly face but couldn't get up to it

Yep. A core of loyal players with some excellent youth prospects coming through. We seem to be getting the balance right.

It's crucial that when keep those that love the club, as it's contagious. Imagine being a new signing (ala Podolski) and coming in and meeting RvP, Jack, Ox, Verms, Sagna etc. It's a good start, and you understand what the club is all about. In the past I wasn't too certain about that.

Too early to call them "loyal" I think

Right, I was thinking of brushing him out or adding a silly face but couldn't get up to it

You could have photoshopped a donkey.

Too early to call them "loyal" I think

Perhaps.

RvP has been here for 8 years, Sagna 5 years, Song 6 years, and the likes of Wilshere have been here for like 10 years. I'll give them the benefit of the doubt, and Vermaelen has been here 3 years and signed a contract when we were near our lowest ebb this season so I'm giving him some credit there too.

These players say and do the right things, perhaps you can query loyal to an extent, but I'd argue they understand the club and are dedicated to bringing trophies and good football here.

We need to make drastic improvements across the attack, if we are to challenge for anything next season. We cannot rely on Robin as heavily again, nor should we expect him to produce the numbers he has done over the past 2 years. To put it simply, he seriously needs support. Look at the respective contributions (in the PL) from the attackers within the top 5;

Man Utd; Rooney (21 goals + 5 assists), Hernandez (10 goals + 2 assists), Valencia (4 goals + 12 assists), Nani (6 goals + 8 assists), Welbeck (7 goals + 2 assists), Young (4 goals + 7 assists), Berbatov (7 goals)
Total: 59 goals + 36 assists

Man City; Aguero (17 goals + 5 assists), Balotelli (13 goals), Dzeko (13 goals + 3 assists), Silva (5 goals + 12 assists), Nasri (4 goals + 7 assists), A. Johnson (5 goals + 2 assists), Milner (3 goals + 5 assists)
Total: 60 goals + 34 assists

Arsenal; van Persie (26 goals + 9 assists), Walcott (7 goals + 8 assists), Rosicky (1 goals + 1 assist), Ramsey (2 goals + 4 assists), Gervinho (4 goals + 6 assists), Chamakh (1 goal), Oxlade (2 goals + 1 assist), Arshavin (1 goals + 3 assists)
Total: 44 goals + 32 assists

Tottenham; Adebayor (13 goals + 11 assists), Bale (9 goals + 8 assists), Lennon (3 goals + 4 assists), Van der Vaart (9 goals + 5 assists), Defoe (9 goals + 1 assist), Saha (3 goals + 1 assist), Pienaar (1 goal + 2 assists)
Total: 47 goals + 32 assists

Chelsea; Torres (3 goals + 4 assists), Drogba (5 goals + 1 assist), Lampard (10 goals + 5 assists), Mata (5 goals + 11 assists), Malouda (1 goal + 2 assists), Sturridge (10 goals + 3 assists), Kalou (1 goal), Lukaku (0 goals)
Total: 35 goals + 26 assists

No surprise that both City and United have a wide array of decent contributers supporting the main striker. Tottenham and Arsenal have fewer goals within their frontmen, and their positions in the table reflects that. The stats make for interesting reading when you look at the total of the teams, excluding the most prolific attacker.

Man Utd(minus Rooney): 38 goals + 31 assists
Man City(minus Aguero): 43 goals + 29 assists
Arsenal(minus van Persie): 18 goals + 23 assists
Tottenham(minus Adebayor): 34 goals + 21 assists
Chelsea(minus Lampard): 25 goals + 21 assists

The OTHER stats that should be looked at in conjunction with this are in regards to the number of appearances/rotation of the goal scoring options,
and where the teams tend to progress their attack from on the pitch.

ManU has a high rotation of their options as do CFC, whereas the rest don't.
Similarly ManU & CFC have an almost equal distribution of attack via left, right or centre, whereas both us & Spuds show a bias to the right,
whilst City tend to favour the Silva-Aguero route.

For me this is the biggest issue in the team right now, and one that can be rectified by coaching or picking players with the defensive discipline to protect the back four:



Our full-backs are in the right positions, Gibbs tracking his man and Sagna supporting Kos in the middle. As you can see Song and Arteta are miles behind the two QPR players.

I can think of 3 reasons. A. Laziness. B. Tired. C. Too focused on attack.

If it is A, then Wenger needs to lay the law or drop them in favor of players who are committed. If B, then work on endurance or substitute for fresh legs. If C, then exactly what are the front 3 attackers and attacking midfielder doing? (or not doing?).

if we can fix that, then we will be a lot more difficult to beat.

For me this is the biggest issue in the team right now, and one that can be rectified by coaching or picking players with the defensive discipline to protect the back four:



Our full-backs are in the right positions, Gibbs tracking his man and Sagna supporting Kos in the middle. As you can see Song and Arteta are miles behind the two QPR players.

I can think of 3 reasons. A. Laziness. B. Tired. C. Too focused on attack.

If it is A, then Wenger needs to lay the law or drop them in favor of players who are committed. If B, then work on endurance or substitute for fresh legs. If C, then exactly what are the front 3 attackers and attacking midfielder doing? (or not doing?).

if we can fix that, then we will be a lot more difficult to beat.

Arteta is at least running. (--> Too focused on attack) But Song is just standing there (--> Too lazy)

Everything went wrong that game.

Disgraceful from Song.

The only ****** in a decent position in that pic is Kos.

Gibbs was out of position, meaning TV had to cover and made a pigs ear of it. Sagna, although he looks to be recovering, isn't goal side, and so may as well be sat at home. Arteta looks alive to the threat of Diakite, but is too far behind, and greatest 'B2B' midfielder in the world is struggling yet again to get from....'B2B'. A comedy of errors all too familiar.