Life after Wenger | Ornstein: Arsenal set to appoint Unai Emery

[GDeep™]

Guessing Real will push for Potchetino this summer, after they sack Zidane.

 

[Makingtrax]

If Arteta came here, I’ll guess he brings in an experienced mainly Spanish coaching set up with him. So, he’ll have a team to help him.

Be a gutsy thing to do, to give the job to Arteta. An unknown quantity.

The average age of our board is about 103. Do you think their hearts could take it?

 

[AmberHawk]

Typical us would be a Carlo Ancelotti, Low or Blanc. Average dinosaur type managers who’ll come in and take over from where Wenger left over. These guys barely have a heartbeat either.

Arteta is the opposite of how we operate now, he’s a young, dynamic but risky option. He’s the unknown.

Maybe you are right to some extent. But i dont see Arteta as a very exciting type of person either. Rather calm and boring.
I dont see us changing direction with him.

I want a Simone type manager. Someone with the experience to know how he want us to play and what players to get to get us there. Yes i know Simone is unrealistic, its just the easiest example.

 

[MutableEarth]

Maybe you are right to some extent. But i dont see Arteta as a very exciting type of person either. Rather calm and boring.
I dont see us changing direction with him.

I want a Simone type manager. Someone with the experience to know how he want us to play and what players to get to get us there. Yes i know Simone is unrealistic, its just the easiest example.

They won't bring in Simeone, they'll want an attacking manager.

Arsenal definitely need an evolution rather than a revolution - Ancelotti and the like are "transitional". They will do a decent job for a couple years, maybe even win us a couple trophies, but they'll f*ck off after a few years.

Arteta wouldn't necessarily be my choice, but someone who's relatively new, fresh and avant-garde is the kind of approach we should be looking at.

 

[Hunta]

I’d say Hasenhuttl is a massive favourite currently.

Just makes so much sense, ticks every box near enough.

 

[AmberHawk]

They won't bring in Simeone, they'll want an attacking manager.

Arsenal definitely need an evolution rather than a revolution - Ancelotti and the like are "transitional". They will do a decent job for a couple years, maybe even win us a couple trophies, but they'll f*ck off after a few years.

Arteta wouldn't necessarily be my choice, but someone who's relatively new, fresh and avant-garde is the kind of approach we should be looking at.

Yea i know Simone would never be on the radar, just an example of a coach who knows exactly what he wants and how to get it.

Nagelsmann would in my opinion be my top choice and he ticks all ur boxes to! But i think he wants to stay in hoffenheim.

I’d say Hasenhuttl is a massive favourite currently.

Just makes so much sense, ticks every box near enough.

Id take Hasenhuttl to! He can bring Forsberg with him ; )

 

[Toby]

Simeone will never come to Arsenal. He seems set on Atletico, and he's indicated he'd be interested in Inter or Lazio after his stint in Spain. Concerning the PL, he seems more of a Utd or Chelsea guy.

Nagelsmann is still out to prove himself. He's done a fantastic job turning Hoffenheim around from sure relegation to safe finish and then getting them into the CL qualification and EL the following season. But Hoffenheim's EL stint was ridiculously bad. He's starting to lose some important players. Also, he's dead set on the Bayern job, and I think he'll rather go the route via Dortmund instead of a foreign league. For me, who watches Bundesliga week in week out, there's too much hype for this, considering he's just in the 2.5th season of his top flight career.

Hasenhüttl has experience, Leipzig play interesting, purposeful football, tactically astute guy. Seems reasonable as well. But hearing him talk he seems very fond of his own little project at Leipzig. They also did a lot better in the CL than Hoffenheim in the EL, notwithstanding the better squad, they still didn't look as out of their depth as Nagelsmann's team on the european stage. Let's see how Hasenhüttl does in the EL. But he might be a dark horse, leftfield option to seriously consider. Though, I'd bet on him being exactly that for Bayern Munich as well, when Heynckes leaves, as they seem wary of Nagelsmann's experience and Tuchel's character.

My favourite would be Favre. He's seasoned, having coached in three leagues by now and for quite some more time than the others mentioned. Along with sporting director Eberl, he's been the catalyst for Gladbach's resurgence over the last years. He's been doing very good at Nice, and after a bumpy start has them back at 3rd, I believe. He has EL and CL experience.
He's an oldschool football idealist, just like Wenger, but a lot more modern in his perception and awareness of the game, he's tactically very astute, plays offensive, positive football. He's good with young players, having a positive hand in Reus, Xhaka, T. Hazard, Kramer, Dahoud, Christensen, Stindl development/evolution.
He seems quite close to Wenger in terms of personal characteristics, traits and views on football, always bearing social and economic ramifications of the sport in mind. Intelligent, wary of the press, well spoken, speaks a couple of languages. Shouldn't be too big of a departure from Wenger for the players.
He could get the most out of Xhaka, he shares the Bundesliga background with a lot of players and staff currently around, he's working in France, which currently produces the most talented players, which means he'll probably have connections. He has expierenced success and crisis, he knows when to leave and quit a job, is no travelman, but looks for longer stints.
And, I've mentioned it before, he might be somewhat oldschool, romantic and idealist in his views on football, but he's absolutely up top with modern tactics, which is really needed at Arsenal.

 

[CurryFlavoured]

I’d say Hasenhuttl is a massive favourite currently.

Just makes so much sense, ticks every box near enough.

Just looked him up there. He's doing very well but I'm a little skeptical of a manager who's; a. new to the top level, b. hasn't managed a big side and c. only managed in one league (not England). This is a very quick look at him though, I've never actually watched any of his sides play.

I feel like if there's any slight chance that we could get Allegri, he's got to be the outstanding #1 candidate. Other than money, I can't think of a reason why he'd come here though.

 

[CaseUteinberger]

Voted no in the poll, but I have arrived at the position of anyone but Wenger. Even if we get someone I don't want like a Löw e.g. I would be okay with that. At least we would fire him after a couple of seasons without success. With Wenger we are stuck as long as he wants to continue. I just do not see leave any time soon.

PS. Would love Allegri to be our coach.

 

[tap-in]

I feel Arteta has to go out and manage a smaller club first, even if its in the Championship. Yesterday was his first taste of PL defeat at City, he needs to go out and experience more of that as a manager because picking your players up after a defeat or after a run of defeats is great experience. I realise he could get that here but he's not the answer just yet.

 

[Toby]

Problem is, managers at big clubs are already at big clubs, and if they don't fail miserably or the job is an ejection seat, they will stay. E.g. Allegri, Simeone, Guardiola, Conte...

Guys who have done rather good at big clubs but are no longer are problematic for other reasons. E.g. with Real and Barca's squads, as well as PSG's in relation to the rest of Ligue 1, it's hard to properly judge Luis Enrique, Blanc, Valverde, even Zidane and recent Ancelotti.

Both of these categories are either unattainable or I'd be wary of their true or recent level.

Then there's the managers who are at "upper table clubs", but not the absolute top. And the thing with these guys is, can they take the step up or not? Moyes, Emery, Montella, R. Garcia, Bosz are all examples that prove there are guys who do a good job at a certain decent level, but not beyond. Tuchel and Klopp being two examples who were able to take that step up. Stöger is right now at the test.

We also got managers at fairly small clubs doing good to great jobs, but for them it's even more steps up to the top clubs. With these guys, I have a feeling they're operating under very specific circumstances in which they flourish, but would massively struggle in a different club setup. E.g. Howe, Dyche, Wagner, Streich. I'd absolutely refrain from hiring one of these.

I'd refrain from very young managers, too. That rules our Arteta for me. They're just too unproven in too many situations (success, crisis,long time player recruiting, etc) and over longer periods of time. Even if they're having their teams play at a decent level - keep in mind it's a very short timeframe, maybe 1 to 2 years in the topflight only. I think 3/4 of these young promising guys, or even more, won't make the cut. England is very conservative in hiring managers, Germany very progressive. There's 5 to 10 young, promising, exciting managers getting promoted or hired every year, but most don't make the cut even for a season. Right now there's 3 (Nagelsmann, Wolf, Baum) who have survived for more than one season.

So we're basically left with the category of coaches at good, upper table clubs, who've not yet trained top clubs. Favre, Jardim, Marcelino, Hasenhüttl to a degree, Pocchettino is in theere but he's at Sp**s.
I feel of those Favre and Jardim have the highest likeliness to succeed at Arsenal, because of their age, longitude of their stints, international experience, experience with CL and EL, and cause they have already managed different clubs.

 

[c00lguy]

I think we should go for Arteta. What if he goes somewhere else and does superb and therefore we miss the boat?
We need to take risks.

 

[Makingtrax]

Problem is, managers at big clubs are already at big clubs, and if they don't fail miserably or the job is an ejection seat, they will stay. E.g. Allegri, Simeone, Guardiola, Conte...

Guys who have done rather good at big clubs but are no longer are problematic for other reasons. E.g. with Real and Barca's squads, as well as PSG's in relation to the rest of Ligue 1, it's hard to properly judge Luis Enrique, Blanc, Valverde, even Zidane and recent Ancelotti.

Both of these categories are either unattainable or I'd be wary of their true or recent level.

Then there's the managers who are at "upper table clubs", but not the absolute top. And the thing with these guys is, can they take the step up or not? Moyes, Emery, Montella, R. Garcia, Bosz are all examples that prove there are guys who do a good job at a certain decent level, but not beyond. Tuchel and Klopp being two examples who were able to take that step up. Stöger is right now at the test.

We also got managers at fairly small clubs doing good to great jobs, but for them it's even more steps up to the top clubs. With these guys, I have a feeling they're operating under very specific circumstances in which they flourish, but would massively struggle in a different club setup. E.g. Howe, Dyche, Wagner, Streich. I'd absolutely refrain from hiring one of these.

I'd refrain from very young managers, too. That rules our Arteta for me. They're just too unproven in too many situations (success, crisis,long time player recruiting, etc) and over longer periods of time. Even if they're having their teams play at a decent level - keep in mind it's a very short timeframe, maybe 1 to 2 years in the topflight only. I think 3/4 of these young promising guys, or even more, won't make the cut. England is very conservative in hiring managers, Germany very progressive. There's 5 to 10 young, promising, exciting managers getting promoted or hired every year, but most don't make the cut even for a season. Right now there's 3 (Nagelsmann, Wolf, Baum) who have survived for more than one season.

So we're basically left with the category of coaches at good, upper table clubs, who've not yet trained top clubs. Favre, Jardim, Marcelino, Hasenhüttl to a degree, Pocchettino is in theere but he's at Sp**s.
I feel of those Favre and Jardim have the highest likeliness to succeed at Arsenal, because of their age, longitude of their stints, international experience, experience with CL and EL, and cause they have already managed different clubs.

Totally agree with this. Favre would be my favourite. A fan of quick attacking, attractive football. A bit stubborn too. Would love it if he came.

But he's a big mate of Wenger. You reckon he'd take his job?

 

[Toby]

Totally agree with this. Favre would be my favourite. A fan of quick attacking, attractive football. A bit stubborn too. Would love it if he came.

But he's a big mate of Wenger. You reckon he'd take his job?

Thanks. While writing this, and thinking about longitude, experience and so on, I found myself agreeing with you on Wenger's outstanding performances in correlation to the duration of his stint at Arsenal with the environment drastically changing small and big factors all the time.
I'm though still not following the squadcost thing too much, and probably think it's over for Wenger by now.

Wenger's contract runs out in 2019, and guess whose contract, too? Favre's at Nice.
Concerning Wenger stepping down at the end of this season, why not hand your pal the steering wheel? I'd personally rather have a friend and someone who thinks a lot like me take over my life's project, than some random guy.
Another big factor in favour of Favre might be that most of the guys with Bundesliga history will know him as one of the better/best performing managers of the last decade over a long period of time in Germany. That's a lot more respect commanding than saving Hoffenheim from relegation.

 

[Makingtrax]

Thanks. While writing this, and thinking about longitude, experience and so on, I found myself agreeing with you on Wenger's outstanding performances in correlation to the duration of his stint at Arsenal with the environment drastically changing small and big factors all the time.
I'm though still not following the squadcost thing too much, and probably think it's over for Wenger by now.

Wenger's contract runs out in 2019, and guess whose contract, too? Favre's at Nice.
Concerning Wenger stepping down at the end of this season, why not hand your pal the steering wheel? I'd personally rather have a friend and someone who thinks a lot like me take over my life's project, than some random guy.
Another big factor in favour of Favre might be that most of the guys with Bundesliga history will know him as one of the better/best performing managers of the last decade over a long period of time in Germany. That's a lot more respect commanding than saving Hoffenheim from relegation.

Makes a lot of sense when you put it like that.

The only fly in the ointment is I think the fans will push Wenger out this year. The team can't play if there's more demonstrations and planes etc. It's hard enough to play football at 90 mph when your mind is free. And if attendances really are dropping ( still not absolutely sure about that) and we end up 6th with no other trophy, the board will be under huge pressure to act sooner rather than later.

 

[CurryFlavoured]

I think we should go for Arteta. What if he goes somewhere else and does superb and therefore we miss the boat?
We need to take risks.

No we don't we're in a position where we can attract most established managers, why get an unknown entity.

Arteta could become a top manager, in the same way that Bould, Henry, Bergkamp and several other upcoming coaches could. I'm willing to take the risk of passing on it for now though. The likelihood at this point is that he's probably not fit to manage any team, never mind Arsenal. He's been coaching for 18 months, it's weird that this is even a discussion.

 

[c00lguy]

No we don't we're in a position where we can attract most established managers, why get an unknown entity.

Arteta could become a top manager, in the same way that Bould, Henry, Bergkamp and several other upcoming coaches could. I'm willing to take the risk of passing on it for now though. The likelihood at this point is that he's probably not fit to manage any team, never mind Arsenal. He's been coaching for 18 months, it's weird that this is even a discussion.

Guardiola managed Barcelona in his first job as a manager. Look how successful he turned out.
Arteta is of similar ilk. Smart Spanish footballer with bags of EPL experience as a bonus.

 

[MutableEarth]

Guardiola managed Barcelona in his first job as a manager. Look how successful he turned out.
Arteta is of similar ilk. Smart Spanish footballer with bags of EPL experience as a bonus.

Guardiola managed their B team beforehand though. Zidane did the same at Real Madrid.

 

[c00lguy]

Guardiola managed their B team beforehand though. Zidane did the same at Real Madrid.

For 1 year.

I think that can be offset by his experience this season at City. He also knows our team well.

 

[CurryFlavoured]

For 1 year.

I think that can be offset by his experience this season at City. He also knows our team well.

A few problems here, firstly I don't see how you can assume that Arteta will follow a similar trajectory just because he is also Spanish/Catalan background with EPL experience.

Second, Arteta's situation is not the same. There's a difference between being a coach among the staff where you have a portion of responsibility, and being in charge of a team of players. Pep was in charge of Barca B - he was responsible for the team selection, tactics, team talks, motivation, training, recovery etc. It all fell on him. Same thing with Zidane.

And you need to take into account that Guardiola is an extremely gifted coach with innovative ideas, Barcelona obviously identified this potential and decided he was worth the risk. We know nothing about Arteta's ability as a coach, never mind his ability as a manager.