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Mikel Arteta: Top Of The Klopps

Tir Na Nog

Changes Opinion Every 5 Minutes

Country: Ireland
He played that weakened team against West Ham on the final day of 06/07 that led to Sheffield United's relegation.

Benitez probably tops the worst PL manager list then, I remember him raging he played a weakened team vs Fulham which ended up getting Fulham the result that ensured their safety.

Love Neil Warnock tho, great character and a great bloke.
 

Iceman10

Established Member

Wenger was the best, made lots of quality mid-cost signings while Fergie had luxury to spend top dollar on Rio Ferdinand, Rooney, etc., and Wenger would have done even better early-/mid- 2000s if it wasn’t for corrupt officiating and media (Sky). We were really pushing it, only hours from not being able to pay wages of our players before the stadium move, goes to show how limited we were in continuing to punch above our weight, but did it thanks to Wenger.
 

Rimaal

Mesmerised By Raccoons
Trusted ⭐
Wenger is one of the best looking blokes ever with regards 2 coaches, oozed class (he was classy, but more sly than some posters are willing to admit)
He's classy, but I wouldn't call him good looking, not at any age - charismatic, not handsome. But, as with all that is superficial in life, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
 

ThisFather

Fan of Alpha Males
How is this club going to move forward if we don't focus on the future? We cast away Martinelli who should be starting based on quality itself even disregarding his young age.

Looks like its a trend. Same with Saliba. Such shocking defending this season and we had Saliba who based on QUALITY should have been given many chances as a starter. But got shifted on loan because he's not a 30+ year old we bought on a free.

I actually miss Unai Emery, he would be starting Martinelli every game and Saliba would probably have established himself in the team by now.
 

HairSprayGooners

My brother posted it ⏩
Wenger was the best, made lots of quality mid-cost signings while Fergie had luxury to spend top dollar on Rio Ferdinand, Rooney, etc., and Wenger would have done even better early-/mid- 2000s if it wasn’t for corrupt officiating and media (Sky). We were really pushing it, only hours from not being able to pay wages of our players before the stadium move, goes to show how limited we were in continuing to punch above our weight, but did it thanks to Wenger.

It's fascinating how people think. Wenger did a wonderful job, but SAF was different gravy.

United actually spent less than most of the big teams between 2000 and when SAF left in 2013. Yet I believe (can't remember exactly) SAF won 7 premier league titles in that 13 year period. Oh and a champions league. He didn't spend the earth like Chelsea and Liverpool were trying to do to catch up.

And I absolutely hate United, but the lack of respect is bizarre. Alex ferguson was clear of Wenger. Wenger was better in some ways, but SAF was a born winner.
 

HairSprayGooners

My brother posted it ⏩
How is this club going to move forward if we don't focus on the future? We cast away Martinelli who should be starting based on quality itself even disregarding his young age.

Looks like its a trend. Same with Saliba. Such shocking defending this season and we had Saliba who based on QUALITY should have been given many chances as a starter. But got shifted on loan because he's not a 30+ year old we bought on a free.

I actually miss Unai Emery, he would be starting Martinelli every game and Saliba would probably have established himself in the team by now.

If ifs and buts were coconuts we would all have a merry Christmas.

Martinelli was starting, picked up an ankle knock and has been wrapped up in cotton wool since, rightly so after his injury. If Arteta played him week in week out and he got injured again people would be saying he rushed him back. Just can't win.
 

Iceman10

Established Member
Discussion for anyone who missed it, but I guess it will wind up detractors of The Athletic also.

- Mikel becoming Emery-like in not seeming to know his first XI

- Aubameyang (play him central, ffs)

- Ornstein says Mikel still seen by the club as a highly rated coach, still central to plans moving forwards

... maybe Athletic is vested in still backing Arteta as they have backed him all along, idk.

 

Iceman10

Established Member
It's fascinating how people think. Wenger did a wonderful job, but SAF was different gravy.

United actually spent less than most of the big teams between 2000 and when SAF left in 2013. Yet I believe (can't remember exactly) SAF won 7 premier league titles in that 13 year period. Oh and a champions league. He didn't spend the earth like Chelsea and Liverpool were trying to do to catch up.

And I absolutely hate United, but the lack of respect is bizarre. Alex ferguson was clear of Wenger. Wenger was better in some ways, but SAF was a born winner.

You obviously did not read properly when I wa talking about early-/mid- 2000s when Arsenal was up there competing with United for top dog in the country and punching well above its weight. Don’t conflate in the stadium transition period with it. Your constant ruining of fans naturally remembering Wenger as iconic is unnecessary and unbecoming of an Arsenal fan also. United able to get away with murder kicking Reyes and the rest off the park was horrible, and corrupt in the way it was allowed.
 

squallman

Still Pining for Wenger
It's fascinating how people think. Wenger did a wonderful job, but SAF was different gravy.

United actually spent less than most of the big teams between 2000 and when SAF left in 2013. Yet I believe (can't remember exactly) SAF won 7 premier league titles in that 13 year period. Oh and a champions league. He didn't spend the earth like Chelsea and Liverpool were trying to do to catch up.

And I absolutely hate United, but the lack of respect is bizarre. Alex ferguson was clear of Wenger. Wenger was better in some ways, but SAF was a born winner.

I think this is a bit disingenuous. United had their pick of premier league players from the time Ferguson came till Abramovich arrived.

United bought Cantona, Ferdinand, Rooney, Dwight Yorke, Andy Cole and others. Think about this, we were competing with them for titles and Ferguson still tried to sign Tony Adams and Vieira. Although Tone might have been pre Arsène. You including up till 2013 means that City and Chelsea come into the mix, two teams that had to build themselves up whereas United were already established.

Ferguson was a genius but let's not act as if he won things on a shoestring budget. In those years he had:

A spine of players from United's academy. Something no other club has managed to pull together. Those guys played 1500+ games combined for United. He basically didn't have to buy a LW, RB or a CM for twenty years.

The most expensive English defender of all time
The most expensive British teenager of all time
The second best player in the world
A plethora of players that were bought for big money at the time.
All at the club with the biggest commercial power in the league.

Wenger on the other hand was holding together this club with duct tape and crazy glue.
 

HairSprayGooners

My brother posted it ⏩
You obviously did not read properly when I wa talking about early-/mid- 2000s when Arsenal was up there competing with United for top dog in the country and punching well above its weight. Don’t conflate in the stadium transition period with it. Your constant ruining of fans naturally remembering Wenger as iconic is unnecessary and unbecoming of an Arsenal fan also. United able to get away with murder kicking Reyes and the rest off the park was horrible, and corrupt in the way it was allowed.

No, I read every word. Nothing you will ever say will persuade me. Saf was the better manager, won more titles without spending a stupid amount of money. Never dropped below 3rd.

We are talking about who the better manager was, not who kicked who in certain games.

And i did say what Wenger did in his first few years was remarkable. What he did up until 2013 was brilliant with no money. But saf was a better manager, quite simply my opinion. Both are one and two in premier league history though.
 

Iceman10

Established Member
No, I read every word. Nothing you will ever say will persuade me. Saf was the better manager, won more titles without spending a stupid amount of money. Never dropped below 3rd.

We are talking about who the better manager was, not who kicked who in certain games.

And i did say what Wenger did in his first few years was remarkable. What he did up until 2013 was brilliant with no money. But saf was a better manager, quite simply my opinion. Both are one and two in premier league history though.

It’s ok, agree to disagree, not a Wenger thread anyway. My point earlier about relative scrutiny for Pepe’s ability vs. Arteta having Willian above Pepe/Martinelli in the pecking order is more important, esp. after a match where Pepe delivered and Willian didn’t.
 

HairSprayGooners

My brother posted it ⏩
I think this is a bit disingenuous. United had their pick of premier league players from the time Ferguson came till Abramovich arrived.

United bought Cantona, Ferdinand, Rooney, Dwight Yorke, Andy Cole and others. Think about this, we were competing with them for titles and Ferguson still tried to sign Tony Adams and Vieira. Although Tone might have been pre Arsène. You including up till 2013 means that City and Chelsea come into the mix, two teams that had to build themselves up whereas United were already established.

Ferguson was a genius but let's not act as if he won things on a shoestring budget. In those years he had:

A spine of players from United's academy. Something no other club has managed to pull together. Those guys played 1500+ games combined for United. He basically didn't have to buy a LW, RB or a CM for twenty years.

The most expensive English defender of all time
The most expensive British teenager of all time
The second best player in the world
A plethora of players that were bought for big money at the time.
All at the club with the biggest commercial power in the league.

Wenger on the other hand was holding together this club with duct tape and crazy glue.

You make it sound like Arsenal were bloody Sheffield United.

Let's not forget that Arsène inherited Bergkamp, Keown, Adams, Bould, Ian Wright, Seaman, Parlour and such. Key components to his title winning sides. Specifically for his first premier league title. And it isnt as if he didn't sign Henry and such, he made a lot of signings to build teams after the initial period.

He built the invincibles side, extraordinary feat and in my opinion the greatest premier league team in history. For that he deserves special credit.

But overall you just cannot compare it to a man who won so much, including champions leagues. That will always be my opinion.
 

HairSprayGooners

My brother posted it ⏩
It’s ok, agree to disagree, not a Wenger thread anyway. My point earlier about relative scrutiny for Pepe’s ability vs. Arteta having Willian above Pepe/Martinelli in the pecking order is more important, esp. after a match where Pepe delivered and Willian didn’t.

Does he have Willian over Pepe specifically in the pecking order? Pepe has played the most games for us after Leno this season. Willian has played very little since boxing day.

@American_Gooner if that's true its the beginning of the end. Shame.
 

A_G

Rice Rice Baby 🎼🎵
A-M CL Draft Campeón 🏆
@American_Gooner if that's true its the beginning of the end. Shame.
I’m a bit wary on player power though. If Arteta goes there still needs to be a clear out instead of another “clean slate” reset.
It seems like the turning point was the public dressing down of Aubameyang, which both Gary Neville and Jamie Carragher believed to be an issue as well.
 

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