Jakarta
Active Member
Coincidence?
Anyone is better than Arteta, but outdated/defensive Benitez?
I’m not sure.
Coincidence?
Nothing wrong with expressing themselves unless the manager relies on that for attacking play without coaching combinations and some structured attacks. Some managers prefer to get quality players in and allow the attack to sort itself out.
It reminds me of Mourinho, where the Real Madrid players said in training he primarily focused on defensive drills, off the ball shape etc, and the attacking players were generally left to come up with attacking/counter attacking play themselves. It was almost too much freedom in attack, which showed how much of a defensive coach he was, not really coaching too much attacking play, allowing the attackers to get on with it. I mean, it can work to a degree with quality players who can autonomously do it, but eventually players will need some more guidance and quality coaching.
How many times over the years have we seen some Mourinho teams and other managers' teams look like they have no clue in attack, having run out of ideas, with the opposing team being comfortable in defence. Sometimes the coaching isn't giving them those ideas.
Initially, yes. But his later teams were also filled with ponderous backwards and sideways passing in front of packed defences. He adopted some kind of extreme possession style, without the speed and inventiveness that his earlier teams had. When it worked it looked nice, but it only came off occasionally; we became easier to play against and teams became more comfortable against us.Wenger is one of the greatest attacking coaches of all time and his teas were all about player expression in the final third.
Meanwhile Rogers is bottling yet another season. I definitely don't want him as manager here although he's better than Arteta.
His early possession based teams were still insanely good. Player recruitment massively fall off though towards the end.Initially, yes. But his later teams were also filled with ponderous backwards and sideways passing in front of packed defences. He adopted some kind of extreme possession style, without the speed and inventiveness that his earlier teams had. When it worked it looked nice, but it only came off occasionally; we became easier to play against and teams became more comfortable against us.
Managers like Bielsa, Guardiola, Klopp etc. have shown a better approach to how you can unlock defences in the final third with faster passing, off the ball movement, taking risks, even by just dribbling sometimes, and stretching the play, not just relying on the center.
The more quality you have, the easier it is to allow players to express themselves; eventually you'll need more than that though.
They were definitely better earlier on, I remember that 07-08 team was really good, Fabregas, Flamini, Rosicky, Hleb, Adebayor, Van Persie midfield and forwards, we even challenged for the title that season.His early possession based teams were still insanely good. Player recruitment massively fall off though towards the end.
Watching Lille in Ligue 1 they play really nice football. They can control matches, structure their play with good combinations, everyone knows their job/role on the pitch, it's creative, pleasing on the eye, with passing options on the ball, good movement, and they are also defensively organized, its pretty good.
Galtier has done a very good job there, they were heading for relegation, he rescued them then took them into the top 4, and now he's three wins away from the title, if they can get over the line, in what has been a great title race in France involving 4 teams.
I heard on the Talksport Trans Euro Express show (great live radio/on demand podcast show by the way for insights into European and also South American football) that Galtier is traditionally a very gritty and defensive coach, but the Lille team I'm watching is more attacking than that. They said Bielsa almost ran this team into the ground. But I'm wondering if Bielsa's imprint is still there somehow.
As soon Bielsa he came in he basically did a clear out, some experienced guys and other players that didn't fit his style (e.g. the club captain and veteran Mavuba) were told to find new clubs, and he and Ocampos brought in some young, hungry, high stamina players that would fit in with Bielsa's approach, including our very own Nicolas Pepe. It didnt' work out for Bielsa, but the way they play right now, I'm wondering if the training that Bielsa sdid with them, the high pressing, high energy, run all day approach, excellent pass and move football has sort of been taken on by Galtier and refined with good defensive play as well.
Galtier is wanted by Lyon and Nice, and apparently he'd be open to a move. Lille are in financial trouble, and may need to sell off their talents to relieve debt, so maybe Galtier is thinking about how much longer he'll be able to keep them at the top if they have to asset strip the club. Nice's new owner is ambitious, the richest man in Britain, Radcliffe; they have a nice stadium and plans for the top. Lyon are one of the biggest clubs in France and can usually spend decent money and attract good players.
I considered Galtier as well, but when I heard on the Talksport Trans Euro Express that he was traditionally gritty and defensive, I was a bit more cautious. I don't want a situation like Monaco, where Jardim was usually a conservative manger, then he had a team with Bernardo Silva, Lemar, Fabinho, Mbappe, Bernard Mendy, Falcao, Bakayoko, Germain Sidibe etc all playing free-flowing, amazing football. The journalists asked him, what are you doing in training to make them play such great football, he said I don't know, I just let them play/express themselves, lol.
So maybe Galtier is like that, maybe the effect of Bielsa lingers on and he's allowing them to express themselves, taking advantage of Bielsa's training while adding good defensive and extra mentality, I don't know. Or maybe I'm doing him a disservice, but yeah, someone knowledgeable people on French football may be able to expand on it.
Give me something to get excited about
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10 titles already won at River Plate and to think he’s only 43 years old.
Plays good football, and he’s been linked to a lot of European clubs.
Thanks, and you've added more intriguing insights into Galtier and Lille.Good post and fair comments here. I agree about Galtier. He is surprising me as well. He was indeed a pretty defensive minded manager but having said that it think it was more a matter of the players he had at his disposal. With this Lille team, he is spoiled with talent and while he is not playing possession football, his team is very well structured, attack minded and play of the strengths of his attacking players (speed, fast transitions, technical skills). He is really having a great season.
One thing about Galtier, forwards tend to progress with him. He did a lot for PEA when he was a St Etienne. Jonathan David is really doing well under him as well at LOSC. Having said that, he is playing next to a monster called Burak Yilmaz. I am awe looking him play at 35.
I can't understand how Gallardo is not yet in Europe. He is the real deal. Absolute boss.
Thanks, and you've added more intriguing insights into Galtier and Lille.
Yes, Lille have a number of talents, Ocampos has assembled even more quality, and teams will probably be targeting take them, like we did with Pepe and Gabriel.
It's Interesting that he seems to be good with forwards. David looks a talent, even though he seems to run out of steam later on in matches, but as a young, developing player that can happen.
Yilmaz is awesome. He's a late bloomer, and not just a poacher as well, is quite clever at linking the play and playing others in, in addition to his off the ball movement and finishing.
If Galtier wins the league (just 2 wins away now ), the demand for him will be through the roof. For me I would still wait and see how he does at another club with another set of players, and observe what style of play he uses there, before wanting him for the Arsenal job.
I can't understand how Gallardo is not yet in Europe. He is the real deal. Absolute boss.
My preferences in order at this stage are:
1. Conte
2. Flick (should be in the conversation imo. Plays good football, available, wins)
3. Allegri
4. Gallardo
5. Rangnick or ten Hag
Yeah, Galtier may not even move. I'd expect maybe 2 or 3 to be sold, but as long as there is not a fire sale, they should be ok because they have lots of talents as you said.I think Galtier will stay at Lille. He has a very good team and will be playing CL with them. They may sell a couple of players but the core of the team is solid. Keep in mind that Renato Sanches, who has played very well, is not even a starter. Soumare & Andre are excellent in CM and ahead of him. Maignan, Botman, Bamba, Celik the Turkish left back are young and very talented players as well.
By the way, Yilmaz scored a cracker today in the North Derby vs Lens. The ball trajectory was insane.
He's good enough to win the Champions League.Flick cant build a defence. Bayern never was a stable side defensively with him but the quality of Bayerns forwards prevented that from being a problem last season.
Unai Emery?Well I'll take anyone apart from Ryan Giggs as manager.
He's good enough to win the Champions League.