✍️ OFFICIAL Ben White

[Barry]

Exactly. Walcott is one of the highest scoring PL winger of all time, yet AM still **** on him.

I'm reading Wengers autobiography at the moment, and there is quite an interesting passage when he talks about the achievements of the players who followed the invincibles. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically says that he feels in some ways they had a bigger achievement in constantly teaching Europe but falling short of titles because it was hard for morale and more so because the club constantly sold players to balance the books in that period. In a different squad Walcott would probably be viewed in a better light. He was never my favourite player, but he was very effective for a few seasons at his peak.

 

[Makingtrax]

Actually, you can see how White has a firm grip on Trippier's seat (probably lifting his upper body a bit) and his heels seem a bit raised; the angle of Stone's haircut is downwards compared to White's, so this is clearly an optical illusion.

Going by this, I'd say White is 182.7 cm tall

The confusion over White’s height is definitely why the Euro’s photo had those horizontal lines behind. Pretty clear Rashford’s about a foot taller. We’ve had it with set pieces against United!

 

[SingmeasongSong]

I'm reading Wengers autobiography at the moment, and there is quite an interesting passage when he talks about the achievements of the players who followed the invincibles. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically says that he feels in some ways they had a bigger achievement in constantly teaching Europe but falling short of titles because it was hard for morale and more so because the club constantly sold players to balance the books in that period. In a different squad Walcott would probably be viewed in a better light. He was never my favourite player, but he was very effective for a few seasons at his peak.

Well, to me it has become a bit harder to judge the difference in quality between the early 2000's and now, but for the former and post end of 90's, the quality jump is INEXPLICABLE.

I'd say teams of now would trash teams past that boundary just as much as a young kids team of men is trashing the women teams in football, the professionalism has simply gone through the roof.
Before the midst of 90's or so, footballers were just so incredibly unprofessional and bad in tactical approaches to the game that it's incomparable.

With all that being said, I often prefer the old football days and it's been so much better "on the eye" that not just a few make the false assumption to mistake it for better football. (in terms of what "wins")
It's a sad trend to incredibly dull and tactical football with massive physical improvements with little to no free flowing football as in the early 2000's and even more so before.

The invinsibles as players, especially Bergkamp, Henry, Vieira and the likes would be worldclass and special nowadays nonetheless and they already had their prime when the professionalism of football has well started, but it is really tough to judge our old team, the best of ManU, Liverpool, Chelsea and the likes in what they would actually ACHIEVE IN TERMS OF WINNING in today's football world.
I'd be afraid to say not that much.

 

[Barry]

Well, to me it has become a bit harder to judge the difference in quality between the early 2000's and now, but for the former and post end of 90's, the quality jump is INEXPLICABLE.

I'd say teams of now would trash teams past that boundary just as much as a young kids team of men is trashing the women teams in football, the professionalism has simply gone through the roof.
Before the midst of 90's or so, footballers were just so incredibly unprofessional and bad in tactical approaches to the game that it's incomparable.

With all that being said, I often prefer the old football days and it's been so much better "on the eye" that not just a few make the false assumption to mistake it for better football. (in terms of what "wins")
It's a sad trend to incredibly dull and tactical football with massive physical improvements with little to no free flowing football as in the early 2000's and even more so before.

The invinsibles as players, especially Bergkamp, Henry, Vieira and the likes would be worldclass and special nowadays nonetheless and they already had their prime when the professionalism of football has well started, but it is really tough to judge our old team, the best of ManU, Liverpool, Chelsea and the likes in what they would actually ACHIEVE IN TERMS OF WINNING in today's football world.
I'd be afraid to say not that much.

It's impossible to know for sure but I suspect that you are right. At this moment in time the premier league has the firepower to buy most of the best players in the world. And at the same time, we had club legends back then who were drinking pints at half time. We think our players now are no good but they may well have held up against past greats, it's so hard to know.

 

[Makingtrax]

Well, to me it has become a bit harder to judge the difference in quality between the early 2000's and now, but for the former and post end of 90's, the quality jump is INEXPLICABLE.

I'd say teams of now would trash teams past that boundary just as much as a young kids team of men is trashing the women teams in football, the professionalism has simply gone through the roof.
Before the midst of 90's or so, footballers were just so incredibly unprofessional and bad in tactical approaches to the game that it's incomparable.

With all that being said, I often prefer the old football days and it's been so much better "on the eye" that not just a few make the false assumption to mistake it for better football. (in terms of what "wins")
It's a sad trend to incredibly dull and tactical football with massive physical improvements with little to no free flowing football as in the early 2000's and even more so before.

The invinsibles as players, especially Bergkamp, Henry, Vieira and the likes would be worldclass and special nowadays nonetheless and they already had their prime when the professionalism of football has well started, but it is really tough to judge our old team, the best of ManU, Liverpool, Chelsea and the likes in what they would actually ACHIEVE IN TERMS OF WINNING in today's football world.
I'd be afraid to say not that much.

Watched the film of the 1966 World Cup final shown on BBC before the Euros final a couple of weeks ago. The standard of football was laughable. Some of the footballers were clearly talented though and with modern nutrition, training and tactics they may well be just as good as today’s footballers.

 

[SingmeasongSong]

Watched the film of the 1966 World Cup final shown on BBC before the Euros final a couple of weeks ago. The standard of football was laughable. Some of the footballers were clearly talented though and with modern nutrition, training and tactics they may well be just as good as today’s footballers.

That's been not my point though, talent is independent but what's put on the pitch and actually playing before mid 90's is a joke in comparison to now.

Early 2000's to now hard to judge, if the jump is still massive, simply based on "success", not beautiful football.

 

[Makingtrax]

That's been not my point though, talent is independent but what's put on the pitch and actually playing before mid 90's is a joke in comparison to now.

Early 2000's to now hard to judge, if the jump is still massive, simply based on "success", not beautiful football.

Yeah, not sure there’s any way to assess a gap in performance of just 20 years. Particularly in team sports. But the gap is probably diminishing as time goes on.

Athletics is the only sure sport to know absolutely how athletes of yesterday compare to now. That shows us that stand out athletes are still better than those that come 20 or even 30 years later. So it’s seems likely that the likes of Henry and Bergkamp would still have been very notable players even if they’d been born 20 years later. But they’d have Arteta in charge.

 

[SingmeasongSong]

Yeah, not sure there’s any way to assess a gap in performance of just 20 years. Particularly in team sports. But the gap is probably diminishing as time goes on.

Athletics is the only sure sport to know absolutely how athletes of yesterday compare to now. That shows us that stand out athletes are still better than those that come 20 or even 30 years later. So it’s seems likely that the likes of Henry and Bergkamp would still have been very notable players even if they’d been born 20 years later. But they’d have Arteta in charge.

The biggest jump is end 90's to start of 2005'ish.
Still a leap from thereon, but as you said, now it's probably less noticable and big.

Wouldn't take another noticable effect by perfect training simulations out of the picture though.
That would be improvement on another dimension, not that much on the physical sight of things.

And then, in 30 years+, there's robots - I ain't joking.

 

[Barry]

Yeah, not sure there’s any way to assess a gap in performance of just 20 years. Particularly in team sports. But the gap is probably diminishing as time goes on.

Athletics is the only sure sport to know absolutely how athletes of yesterday compare to now. That shows us that stand out athletes are still better than those that come 20 or even 30 years later. So it’s seems likely that the likes of Henry and Bergkamp would still have been very notable players even if they’d been born 20 years later. But they’d have Arteta in charge.

That's actually a really nice take on it. Went on holiday to Ilfracombe this summer and they have a monument to Jonathan Edwards world record 18.29m triple jump which he did in 1995. It was frickin insane to see how far 18m is, marked out on the ground and how anyone could jump that far.

Professionalism in English football has increased more than athletics though but I guess your point still stands.

 

[SingmeasongSong]

Robot barry ready as is, goes without saying.

 

[TornadoTed]

Watched the film of the 1966 World Cup final shown on BBC before the Euros final a couple of weeks ago. The standard of football was laughable. Some of the footballers were clearly talented though and with modern nutrition, training and tactics they may well be just as good as today’s footballers.

Totally agree, lots of other factors too, perfect pitches, lighter balls, lighter boots and way more protection for skilful players from referees. Sir Stanley Matthews, Pele, George Best, Cruyff etc. would be an absolute ballers in 2021 with all the modern advantages todays players have.

 

[Arseshavin]

Sagna was a monster in the air and he is like 175cm

Ben White isn't a monster in the air.

 

[Riou]

Suppose it depends on what you like.

The mid 90s up to the 2000s, there was more art in football...while at some point in the 2010s, it mainly became about stamina/running...I know which one I prefer...think football in the back in the day, had a better mix of technical and physical, now it's too geared towards the physical, im.

Even though it's gone off topic, glad this thread seems to have moved past the height discussion...was really stupid.

 

[Arai]

Some viewpoints upon his signing.

Ben White to Arsenal: Brighton defender can add a new dimension for Mikel Arteta's side

Arsenal have signed Brighton centre-back Ben White in a deal worth £50m; White brings technical ability, attacking impetus and flexibility to Mikel Artetas side

www.skysports.com

 

[SingmeasongSong]

Suppose it depends on what you like.

The mid 90s up to the 2000s, there was more art in football...while at some point in the 2010s, it mainly became about stamina/running...I know which one I prefer...think football in the back in the day, had a better mix of technical and physical, now it's too geared towards the physical, im.

Even though it's gone off topic, glad this thread seems to have moved past the height discussion...was really stupid.

It's not really about what you like, as I'd assume that 99% of people should prefer the end of 90's to mid 2000's with more free flowing football with Ronaldinho, Zidane, Ronaldo and the likes.

Rather, we have been talking about what would win in the end, and beyond 90's, it's really not hard to call that they'd get trashed because they haven't been professionals.
It's also not about the talent aspect since that obviously doesn't change over years, old players could have blossomed with today's football, thst goes without saying.

There's a question to be had about how much more professional football still has become on terms of physical and tactical approaches from 2005+ thereon, but I'd say it is significant as well.

Free flowing football isn't gone from today's football because there are no players capable of doing so now, but because teams leave almost no space to exploit it, have pretty much the same perfection in terms of nutrition, training and the likes..

Think there's a very clear reasoning for more ugly tactical and physical football, and it's straightforward - it's more successful.

 

[Head&Shoulders]

How many has Varane played?

Anyway he was also Leeds' maybe best player in the Championship run and played 46 games.

Championship is tough and the best players nowadays usually are PL level.

23 years with two good seasons in England is nothing for a CB. He is young and already pretty proven.

There are not many similar player profiles on the market on a general note.

What does that have to do with Varane? We're talking about experience here and Ben White's been playing top level football for 1 full season

 

[AbouCuéllar]

I'm reading Wengers autobiography at the moment, and there is quite an interesting passage when he talks about the achievements of the players who followed the invincibles. I'm paraphrasing, but he basically says that he feels in some ways they had a bigger achievement in constantly teaching Europe but falling short of titles because it was hard for morale and more so because the club constantly sold players to balance the books in that period. In a different squad Walcott would probably be viewed in a better light. He was never my favourite player, but he was very effective for a few seasons at his peak.

Walcott from 2012/13 to his injury against Sp**s in the Carling Cup was elite. If you break down his statistics from that period there is no other conclusion but that.

 

[El Duderino]

So, how long until this one is announced? Reckon there's still a week in it.

 

[Riou]

Would Walcott get in our best Emirates Era combined team?

On performances/longevity he might, tbh...it's either him or Auba, suppose it depends on who you prefer.

Edit...no, he wouldn't...he would get in our best team of the 2010s though, for me.

 

[gunner4lyfe]

Some viewpoints upon his signing.

Ben White to Arsenal: Brighton defender can add a new dimension for Mikel Arteta's side

Arsenal have signed Brighton centre-back Ben White in a deal worth £50m; White brings technical ability, attacking impetus and flexibility to Mikel Artetas side

www.skysports.com

After reading this I have to ask. Is the problem the signing itself or the price?

If it's the signing itself: He's what the majority of you have wanted for a long time. Young, good on the ball and has PL experience. So whats the issue?

If it's the price: The majority have always chastised Arsenal for penny pinching and now that they're paying there's still a problem?