Mikel Arteta: Managerial Royalty

[Makingtrax]

Adds up with those reports of him and Luiz trying to stir something up.

Serves the club right for doing a deal everybody felt would end this way.

Iirc, a lot of posters thought the signing was an Arteta master stroke. A bit like selling Emi and buying Runarsson.

 

[Makingtrax]

Yeah I said it may be years till we get a whiff of second. I never even mentioned Arsène. And yes we had injuries doesn’t make it any better to beat the champions twice and finish 2nd then listen to everyone earth kiss Leicester’s butt for years. It was a missed opportunity and it hurt as a fan. Just like finishing 2nd in 06 hurt in Cl. It has nothing to do with relitigating Wenger

It was never a missed opportunity. All the major clubs had problems, including us, but we handled it best, even beat Leicester twice. If the other top 6 had done that Leicester wouldn’t have won.

 

[Farzad Stoned]

It’s not about Wenger as I said. We were never in it. You can look back at the table at various points during the season. We were lingering around 3rd. It doesn’t matter that we beat them twice. What mattered is that we failed at beating the other teams when we should have. We drew too many games that season and that was the major issue.

Ok you weren’t disappointed I was not happy. Where from my post did I use it to beat up the club? It was a giant missed opportunity just like 2006 CL final. If you were happy by the result great for you

 

[Farzad Stoned]

It was never a missed opportunity. All the major clubs had problems, including us, but we handled it best, even beat Leicester twice. If the other top 6 had done that Leicester wouldn’t have won.

Either way closest we been to the title in a decade and it was ripe for the taking it is you guys that reading things into my comments. When Welbeck beat them at the death in the Emirates I thought we would take it, then it fizzled out in a wave of injuries and draws to lesser teams. It still doesn’t change the facts the point total was not something unattainable. The other big clubs also dropped the ball but unlike us they have sniffed at least second since, we have not.

 

[Makingtrax]

The other big clubs also dropped the ball but unlike us they have sniffed at least second since, we have not.

And we all know why that is. The club was toxic for two years.

 

[Fabregasm]

This are the number of seasons it took for Klopp to be title challenger.





This one hurt us the most





That's about 4 years it took. Arteta took over a squad which is very poor and has no good system in place. He converted it a energetic young team and giving it a strong challenge to top 4 this season so far. Last season was horrid but he did learn from there and made some corrections. As long as he's ever improving I do believe he is going on the right direction, it's the fans job to support him through and give him the extra push on that. Anything less than Europa League he should be sacked for sure.

 

[Farzad Stoned]

And we all know why that is. The club was toxic for two years.

It is what it is frankly, at this point I just want the team to get back to the top. I try not even to mention Wenger’s name because it seems to be an invitation to relitigate old battles I didn’t participate in and after this many years is moot anyway

 

[Macho]

Ah, it's safe to make Klopp comparisons again this must be the peak of the team's current run then.

 

[Farzad Stoned]

This are the number of seasons it took for Klopp to be title challenger.

View attachment 5277

View attachment 5278

This one hurt us the most

View attachment 5279

View attachment 5280

That's about 4 years it took. Arteta took over a squad which is very poor and has no good system in place. He converted it a energetic young team and giving it a strong challenge to top 4 this season so far. Last season was horrid but he did learn from there and made some corrections. As long as he's ever improving I do believe he is going on the right direction, it's the fans job to support him through and give him the extra push on that. Anything less than Europa League he should be sacked for sure.

I don’t know if 6th place, no trophy and getting bombed in matches against the big teams would be enough for me; especially if we play full and turgid football

 

[Sapient Hawk]

I would be nice to fluke a title tbh. All the pundits would have to grind their teeth and utter the immortal words "the best team always wins the league". We'd all know it was a lie too

Would be worth it to see Jenas cry that his beloved Sp**s are still sans title.

And Souness?



Let's just say Pogba will be happy to have a day off when the time comes

 

[Trilly]

Nah, but it will come in time. Beat Chelsea, Liverpool, Man City, Man Utd, Tottenham, Everton, Leicester at least once during his tenure here, not too shabby. Now is the time to put up consequently good results, lets see if he can do it

I think this is where we disagree. I’ve seen plenty examples of managers producing something special before they had time to sign better players, the cliche of being able to make a team more than the sum of its parts.

It’s taken us two years just to get to the point where we are a team that pretty much beats the teams it’s expected to beat. But the media and probably the board are going to treat it like we have the next Klopp/Pep and that’s just because Mikel was underachieving in the first place. Masterclass in terms of lowering the bar.

Arteta might be improving but he also might just be spending more. Each scenario could be true but we’ve seen that player quality is more of a factor than manager quality so I learn towards the latter until I see clear signs that it’s not the case. It’s hard to seperate a manager’s quality from his players but I think signs such as challenging teams that are better than us, players coming here and improving or implementing a style of football that can be played against teams of varying strengths are some things to look out for.

 

[Macho]

Arteta might be improving but he also might just be spending more.

In all my days I've never seen a manager have results ignored until he got his whole team. Outside of Mourinho and Pep. Klopp got results and visible tangible progress from the off so that comparison is bummy.

You could argue his FA Cup win was the something special admittedly. I definitely had bought into it.

 

[Trilly]

You could argue his FA Cup win was the something special admittedly. I definitely had bought into it.

Same actually. Then a non-Arsenal fan pointed out the style of play being unsustainable and we finished 8th which kind of confirmed things and you know what they all say about cups anyway. Wasn’t enough for Wenger, wasn’t enough for Di Matteo, might not even be enough for Tuchel.

Let’s write off the 8th with the good will from winning the FA cup. Happy for this season to be Mikel’s true ‘trial’ tbh. If the second half of the season is better then the first then that’s progress. I’m just not here for someone being applauded for just having better players.

 

[Blankety Blank]

Really? Think you've imagined that. Arsenal's standing in Premier League has not changed since 2015 when it moved up to 5th for investment in the squad and hasn't moved from that position since. The figures are posted every year on here. The only movement in the last 5 years is that the richest teams at the top are pulling away from the rest financially, year on year, which should make it easier for Arsenal, not harder.

The standing of the EPL in Euope in terms of spend has nothing to do with competition within the EPL as I and @Kav and others have tried to explain to you a number of times.

Thats fine but the big 4 in the last 5 years have become much stronger financially so the gap has simply got wider between us & them.

The level between 5th & say 10th in the prem has also narrowed due to the massive amounts of money.
Spending/investment is not simply linear though, its why a club like Everton can spend half a billion over the last few years only to finish 10th.
Its also why Arsenal when at the top in a position of real strength decided to finance the stadium & with limited spending managed to retain top 4 (Arsène did fantastic stuff at the time, but you knew that )
Man City could likely face transfer embargo for a few years yet still finish top 4. Its why Newcastle wont be challenging next season but will be a major threat in the future.

How does this make it easier to get top 4?

As said Arsène did great hanging on to top 4 but then clubs like Leicester & Sp**s overtook us & so forget top 4, getting top 6 becomes hard.

Finish 8th was obviously major disappointing but i can certainly see why it happened. Football is mainly about the quality of the players & our squad was declining & needed major work as the league got stronger.



Squads & managers need time to develop & mature.
it looks like are heading the right way again with a young manager & team.

 

[Mrs Bergkamp]

Would be worth it to see Jenas cry that his beloved Sp**s are still sans title.

And Souness?

View attachment 5281

Let's just say Pogba will be happy to have a day off when the time comes

My biggest motivation is when Wenger said the best team (us) didn't win the league in 2003. I want smug Alan Hansen on every channel saying "the best team always wins the league". My joy would know no bounds.

 

[Farzad Stoned]

I think we will finish 5th and have a 25 percent chance of maybe getting a trophy. This team is not bereft of the talent, a good manager could get 4th out of them.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

After two years it's still quite hard to form a strong opinion on Arteta.

My general view is he should probably not have been appointed as manager, in hindsight. Okay, we won the FA Cup but his first full season was a nightmare for a significant portion.

I think he should also have been sacked after the Europa League semi's débâcle.

For the most part this season I think we've seen some nice improvements with some better than average signings in the summer thrown in. As it stands I don't see Arteta's job being under any threat, nor should it be really but he's been fortunate during his tenure here. There have been 2 occasions where if he'd been sacked he'd have had no complaints.

We're looking like we might be onto something finally but it's taken 2 full years to get to this stage. It's hard to argue that a more seasoned manager like Ancelotti wouldn't have started turning things around sooner and he definitely wouldn't have fallen into some of the pitfalls Mikel has due to inexperienced.

Kind of think we're pot commited with Arteta now. We've stuck with him through his really inexperienced and poor stages hopefully now's the time we reap the rewards of doing that.

 

[Trilly]

This are the number of seasons it took for Klopp to be title challenger.

View attachment 5277

View attachment 5278

This one hurt us the most

View attachment 5279

View attachment 5280

That's about 4 years it took. Arteta took over a squad which is very poor and has no good system in place. He converted it a energetic young team and giving it a strong challenge to top 4 this season so far. Last season was horrid but he did learn from there and made some corrections. As long as he's ever improving I do believe he is going on the right direction, it's the fans job to support him through and give him the extra push on that. Anything less than Europa League he should be sacked for sure.

Klopp went from 8th to 4th in 1.5 seasons. In the same span we went from 8th to 8th. He then retained top four for one more season then became a consistent title challenger the next. Very cheeky how you’ve represented it as a four year process when it’s closer to three really.

Arteta is at the stage in his Arsenal career where Klopp at Liverpool retained fourth easily, only lost five games in the league and made a CL final. He then banged a 97 point, one loss PL season the next year.

I really like the comparison as the clubs were at similar stages when managers took over, have similar financial power and both managers had to overhaul squads. However the comparisons in terms of Arteta being anywhere as good as Klopp need to stop!

 

[BigPoppaPump]

Klopp went from 8th to 4th in 1.5 seasons. In the same span we went from 8th to 8th. He then retained top four for one more season then became a consistent title challenger the next.

Arteta is at the stage in his Arsenal career where Klopp at Liverpool retained fourth easily, only lost five games in the league and made a CL final. He then banged a 97 point, one loss PL season the next year.

The comparisons need to stop!

You can’t compare them cos this is Arteta’s first job, Klopp to Dortmund that weren’t doing much and turned them into one of the biggest teams in Europe winning two titles off Bayern.

 

[Riou]

@Emeryates

Not taking it away from Arteta, think he is doing a good job so far this season...but I don't think our team is that far away from United's.

Was a little intimidated when they signed Ronaldo, but I feel a best 11 is pretty even now that we are some way I to the season.

Think we have quite a good team, for the first time in a few years.