Mark Tobias
Mr. Agreeable
Regardless of the validity of his statement let's refrain from being nasty. A simple 'ludicrous' would have sufficed.
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Mesut Özil: Time to Move Ön?
- Thread starter blaze_of_glory
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Furious
Emery Gone, Telly Back On
Regardless of the validity of his statement let's refrain from being nasty. A simple 'ludicrous' would have sufficed.
Yeah sorry but come on it's getting embarrassing.
You made a good point to Jae in your post above. People are trying to strip him off anything good he's done for the club.
Maybe
You're wrong, no?
You guys are too concerned with statistics. If we measure the player quality only by that, I bet Mustafi would turn out to be a decent defender.
By saying that we won trophies with Özil here, we also won them with Monreal here (just a lame example). I swear that people are writing all over the Ramsey thread that he alone won us these trophies
Özil was worth the money he was getting before, but it's just ridiculous now. Bear in mind that the worst is yet to come, he has 3 more years on his contract. It will be funny to watch him and his fanatic forum fans how they justify 350k/w, and I'm fairly sure he won't be even near the first team squad in a year from now.
By saying that we won trophies with Özil here, we also won them with Monreal here (just a lame example). I swear that people are writing all over the Ramsey thread that he alone won us these trophies
Özil was worth the money he was getting before, but it's just ridiculous now. Bear in mind that the worst is yet to come, he has 3 more years on his contract. It will be funny to watch him and his fanatic forum fans how they justify 350k/w, and I'm fairly sure he won't be even near the first team squad in a year from now.
Mark Tobias
Mr. Agreeable
This may be true but it doesn't change the fact that he was doing a job for us until this season. You guys have serious selective memory if you honestly believe a guy who basically provided 80% of Giroud's assists did nothing for the club.
We bulldozed United because of him and he's been an instrumental part of many victories. His decline is evident but he wasn't like this since we signed him.
Jae
Well-Known Member
He's been getting criticised for longer than just this season mate, he's been criticised almost constantly since he arrived here (rightly or wrongly).
To say he hasn't done anything for us is silly, but what I will say is his contribution is overexagerated. He's a fantastic player on his day but besides that one season he's been largely hot and cold. The fact that we're even having this debate is evidence of that.
In 20 years time nobody will care that "Özil would have broken the assist records if it weren't for Giroud".
Mark Tobias
Mr. Agreeable
Now you're being reasonable and I can agree.
Jae
Well-Known Member
Maybe
You're wrong, no?
I honestly can't care less for his personal records or that he was part of some title winning teams. I've never wanted him here and never felt that we need him here, and he never added anything to our team. Sure, he did have great assists records, but at the same time he f*cks us in 10 different ways. That's why I'm saying that you are reading too much statistics. We never improved with him, and even now when we have this diabolical squad, I can't see any difference with Özil on the pitch or off.
I can see the difference when we don't have Laca, Auba or Bellerin, that's why I value them more than I value Özil.
I also knew the value of Cazorla, that's why I never wanted Özil here, but we needed to lose Cazorla to see who actually made the difference on the pitch.
The only argument Özil fans are using here is his assists record, but when I need quality player that will make the difference, I will always look for Sanchez, Ramsey, Laca or Cazorla, never Özil.
He did nothing for the club except of milking money, the only thing he is world class at.
Mark Tobias
Mr. Agreeable
At least you admit you've always had an agenda..
Maybe
You're wrong, no?
Yes, never liked him or wanted him, but I was willing to wait and see if he can surprise me. He actually did, that contract absolutely shocked me.
I'm also waiting for the argument of how he actually improved Arsenal in his 5 years here.
Mark Tobias
Mr. Agreeable
I'm not going to start that argument. That would be a silly notion given that it is a team game..
Just amazes me how posters on here are either 0 degrees celcius or 100. No luke warm on this forum with everything being absolute hyperbole..
Beksl
Sell All The Youngsters
I can appreciate your point of view, but I’m still not convinced. Not so sure you can use an injury prone season as evidence of a physical decline. Players will naturally be injured more in some seasons than others, De Bruyne for example has struggled a lot with injuries this term- big and small ones, would you say he’s declining physically?
The mental decline argument you put forward is completely subjective. Who’s to say he’s not as hungry now as he was before he won the World Cup? I can hardly see him being content with no more trophies but a fat wad of cash in the bank. He’s been rich for a long time now. Not sure where those reports about the training sessions come from either, Emery has said nothing but positive things about his effort and application.
What’s “very clear” to me is his wage is influencing a hell of a lot of opinions. If he wasn’t a world class talent I too would be annoyed, but having seen what Özil can do, and what he’s capable of, I’m happy to have him around. We need to put it into context, his contract was signed at a time where our TWO main men were on the verge of leaving for nothing, should we blame Özil for capitalising on that in regards to his contract negotiations?
Sanchez is currently earning £500k p/w up north and so far all he’s done is play the piano. Suppose we would’ve paid him that. If you wanna see clear evidence of physical decline, watch that Chilean dog merchant play football. He’s lost almost every physical attribute that made him such a threat.
So what's your reasoning for his subpar season(s)?
Beksl
Sell All The Youngsters
The fact is he was given special treatment under Wenger and it goes for training sessions as well.
source https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...ain-a-lot-reveals-Arsène-wenger-a6793771.html
It's not too far fetched to imagine there were tensions because the expectaions under Emery are complete opposite of Wenger's. Everyone has to work 100% regardless of the hierarchical position within the team. On the other hand you have Özil who was given special treatment his whole Arsenal career and now finds himself under a manager who demands more from him than he was ever accustomed to.
Curious, what's your reasoning for Özil's subpar performances?
Maybe
You're wrong, no?
He asked for it. Too bad he is not at Real anymore, it would be funny to watch him dealing with their fans. Here it's easy for him: takes 350k, plays Fortnite, pretend he is sick and fans will still be on his side.
Absolutely mental!Even when you want to point it out on forum you get bashed by his fanatic fans, they will always come with fancy youtube videos of him or key passes stats
When Ramsey is fit, this guy is a squad player waiting for his chance with Nketiah, if that's not enough then I don't know what is
Jury
A-M's drunk uncle
He wasn't though. That's rewriting history. His stats were better (they couldn't be worse) but the critique was always the same even when he was having corners nodded in by Giroud for his 'assists'.
Jury
A-M's drunk uncle
I'll answer that for BoG. In BoGs opinion, Özil's basically being misused. Misused when he's anonymous, mind, Not when he pulls his finger out and has a good game.
- Thread starter
- #18,557
Country: Canada
I think overall he's played quite well, but his assists and (I assume) chances created (the two things we really expect from him) are down significantly. I believe this is linked strongly to the system we've played under Emery this season. It basically pushes him to the wing, as creating overloads seems to be the primary focus on the attack (see Özil's heat map this season vs last a few pages back in this thread). He ends up working on the flank to help create attacks but is rarely playing the final ball, or at least not from the more central areas he did under Wenger. Lacazette has been utilized in a way where he is often in the central spaces around the box Özil usually occupied before, and I dont't think it's a coincidence he's the one who has the team in assists this season.
We've certainly not seen the best out of Özil this year (and perhaps never will again), but as with many things in life the I think the reasons are primarily systemic rather than individual.
Could well be that Özil is not a good fit under how Emery wants to play, at least being paid as he is. We are noticeably worse at keeping the ball with Özil off the field, but that is probably not enough to justify his wages at the moment. Quite likely another player could do what Özil's been doing this year for us for a lot cheaper. But I think it's a mistake to paint that as an individual failing without looking at the broader context of how the team plays.
- Thread starter
- #18,558
Country: Canada
I wouldn't call it misuse. I'm not saying Emery is wrong to use Özil in this way or play like we do. He's the manager, it's his call. This is just the way Emery has set the team up to play and it has an effect on Özil the same way it has resulted in, for example, Kolasinac being so often directly involved in attacks.
And most of Özil's games have been good, in that he's rarely played poorly. The question is whether him in the role he now plays is worthwhile for us moving forward.
BigPoppaPump
Reeling from Laca & Kos nightmares
Some people on this forum really need to be told how stupid they are, don't feel any type of way for calling idiocy.
Oh_Snap
Well-Known Member
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