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Mikel Arteta: Top Of The Klopps

blaze_of_glory

Moderator
Moderator

Country: Canada
Wenger is responsible (along with Gazidis). He left the team in such a poor shape. The Özil contract, etc...
It’s going to take another 2 years before we can say it’s Arteta’s team.
Wenger was against the contract. He wanted to sign Özil again but not at that price.

I don't think Wenger had a ton of control over things like that at the time Özil re-signed given that he was let go a few months later.
 

ksarp

Active Member
This guy is more pragmatic than emery, and he seems to over complicate his team selections, just play players in their correct positions, and his excuse for not starting partey is just more evidence of him trying to make himself look smarter than he is, its not like we play a complicated system .....


That's something he picked up from Pep..the propensity to make himself look good in all situations. What the heck was up with the false 9?
 

Makingtrax

Worships in the house of Wenger 🙏
Trusted ⭐

Country: England

Player:Saliba
You don't need to @ me every time posters write boll*cks. Tell them Wenger never signed 8 CBs for two positions, or spent millions lining the pockets of agents, or froze out our most valuable and highest paid player, so that he'd be worth nothing. And ask why, if Arsenal has solved it's defensive issues, we finished 8th last year. This year we've no idea where we'll finish yet.
 

kash2

More Consistent Than Arteta
You don't need to @ me every time posters write boll*cks. Tell them Wenger never signed 8 CBs for two positions, or spent millions lining the pockets of agents, or froze out our most valuable and highest paid player, so that he'd be worth nothing. And ask why, if Arsenal has solved it's defensive issues, we finished 8th last year. This year we've no idea where we'll finish yet.
he also didnt let Aaron Ramsey go on a free and sign Willian on a free.. jeez
 

greekgooner

Member

Country: Greece

Player:Martinelli
first about mistakes of former coaches. To be fair with emery and all his mistakes he made us a great gift. He gave the young boys a chance to shine. Saka martinelli and willock took the first real game time in the first team with emery as head coach. its not easy to risk your job even in the europa league group stage to give chances to unproven kids and i give him that.
Yes wenger made a lot of mistakes in the last 5 years with us with the biggest the Özil contract that haunt us till today but dont forget that we called him crazy when he tried to sign Embappe for 100 milion and all the fanbase wanted to give these money for 2 lacazzete type players. A lot of his deadwood still remains in the team like mustafi but before he left he gave us one last gift. obameyang.
Lastly about Arteta. there is not logical explanasion a coach who trained by wenger and sat aside pep to be a diffensive minded coach. I just cant accept it. Last year the goal was to qualify to europe so it was the results first. If someone thinks that we could won against man city in the semi final by playing attacking flowing football is probably crazy.Yes this year we still cant play good football BUT.... How many years have we seen a so organized defense that dont give up goals for fun and dont throw the game when they trail the score? the last time we had a good defence was the good year of mertezacker who alongside kosielny rocked it but it lasted just one year. We must go at 2004 to find a really solid backline and Mikel gave it to us in less than a year. I dont love the football we play at the moment but i really appriciate that i dont get mad during games for the easy goals we give to the opponent team. I think the reason that mikel is cautious with his tactics is because he rates our roster lower than our top 4 rivals and he is probably right. I dont think we have better roster than city liverpool chelsea or Sp**s at the moment so the only chance is smart tactics. I believe that mikel is an offensive minded coach and he will give us what we want but at the right time and this time is not now. Be patient enjoy our defence and back Mikel
 

EmeryCouldnt

Established Member
You don't need to @ me every time posters write boll*cks. Tell them Wenger never signed 8 CBs for two positions, or spent millions lining the pockets of agents, or froze out our most valuable and highest paid player, so that he'd be worth nothing. And ask why, if Arsenal has solved it's defensive issues, we finished 8th last year. This year we've no idea where we'll finish yet.

Um... Emery?
 

GDeep™

League is very weak
Wenger won the double in his first year. 3 years later he built a totally new team and went unbeaten, something never seen in English football. 3 years later with kids, injuries, older players and great defensive record he reached the CL final. All this while playing some of the best football ever seen in the history of the game.

Great times and memories. Wenger and Arteta are in contact apparently, I’m sure Arteta is hugely inspired and will do all he can to emulate the boss, and he has my support in full.
 

Gegen Pressing

Well-Known Member
also bear in mind the paychological scars Arteta carries from being the only sane positional player in a totaly madcap swashbucking wengerball era
:lol: I wondered about that too , Drogba raping our defence and the Silvester/squillaci/vermaelen era .

Wonder if tiki-taka in front of own goal is a rebirthing manifest of Arteta's destroyed childhood by father Wenger.
 

GDeep™

League is very weak
Did we finish 5th when Wenger left? We’re just asking to finish one position higher after a spend of hundreds of millions, multiple keepers, defenders signed, in a league where you’re competing with the poorest Utd since the 80s and poorest Chelsea set up pre Mourinho.

Nobody is asking Arteta to win a title.
 

EmeryCouldnt

Established Member
Did we finish 5th when Wenger left? We’re just asking to finish one position higher after a spend of hundreds of millions, multiple keepers, defenders signed, in a league where you’re competing with the poorest Utd since the 80s and poorest Chelsea set up pre Mourinho.

Nobody is asking Arteta to win a title.

The competitive landscape is changing. Everton and Aston Villa spent nearly 300 million in the past 2 years. TBF our transfer decisions just before Arteta have looked to be pretty bad as well. It appears we did a bit better this summer (which could have been primary targets for the old regime, so who knows).

Fortunately, Arteta succeeded in keeping us in a European competition. Top 4 is not an easy task. It's not a walk for either of the teams you mentioned either. This is not 2016.
 

Kav

Established Member
C'mon mate, the final 5 years of Wenger the squad building was dire. It was also very short-termist and band-aid after band-aid, and only buying for the here and now, desperately trying to save his job or achieve the aims he hadn't been able to achieve for a long time. Aside from that many poor signings, more than the usual amount that will happen with any club.

I don't see how people can deny that the recruitment under Wenger in the last 5 years and squad planning in general was dire.

It was a scatter gun approach for sure but I’m tired of posters like @Manberg putting the blame on Wenger for our current problems when the man has been gone for 2 + years and his acquisitions are not even the issue. Wenger’s teams always were attacking yet manberg wants to blame our lack of offensive output on Wenger?

Arteta has significantly improved our defensive solidity and over structure. We do a lot more work off the ball and everyone seems to be pitching in. He has done very well on the areas that Wenger was deficient on over his last few years. However it has come at a cost offensively. We are very weak in terms of chance creation and shots taken over the last two seasons we have consistently been in the bottom half of the league in regards to those metrics.

Wenger has his faults for sure and Arteta has done very well in doing his best to fix our most glaring issues. However to act like Arteta is infallible and should not be criticized is also laughable.
 

EmeryCouldnt

Established Member
It was a scatter gun approach for sure but I’m tired of posters like @Manberg putting the blame on Wenger for our current problems when the man has been gone for 2 + years and his acquisitions are not even the issue. Wenger’s teams always were attacking yet manberg wants to blame our lack of offensive output on Wenger?

Arteta has significantly improved our defensive solidity and over structure. We do a lot more work off the ball and everyone seems to be pitching in. He has done very well on the areas that Wenger was deficient on over his last few years. However it has come at a cost offensively. We are very weak in terms of chance creation and shots taken over the last two seasons we have consistently been in the bottom half of the league in regards to those metrics.

Wenger has his faults for sure and Arteta has done very well in doing his best to fix our most glaring issues. However to act like Arteta is infallible and should not be criticized is also laughable.

The problems with our attack began under Emery and have slightly improved under Arteta. After the honeymoon phase, we created nearly nothing under Emery (in addition to our defense being leaky). Arteta has improved the defense issue and our attack, but our attack certainly is still not adequate. We seem to create 3 or so great chances from open play per game now; we got to a point that it was 0 under Emery.
 

Finesse

Well-Known Member
[QUOTE ] Arteta has significantly improved our defensive solidity and over structure. We do a lot more work off the ball and everyone seems to be pitching in. He has done very well on the areas that Wenger was deficient on over his last few years. However it has come at a cost offensively. We are very weak in terms of chance creation and shots taken over the last two seasons we have consistently been in

Wenger has his faults for sure and Arteta has done very well in doing his best to fix our most glaring issues. However to act like Arteta is infallible and should not be criticized is also laughable.[/QUOTE]

He has done a phenomenal job so far. Considering it is his first rodeo. Naturally he is liable to errors and misjudgments too.It comes with the game. Like using Willian how he did against City. Some will come off and some would not. Add Gabriel’s omission at Anfield. Etc. He will learn from them. It is indeed comical when any analysis / critic of certain decisions he makes becomes an issue for some on here. You cannot deny we are no longer the push overs of few seasons back. The mentality and the whole focus has changed. We are now up there with the best defences and the stats do not lie.

When you look at the stats for the past 6 games in terms of chances we are in very very bad shape. 4th from bottom in the PL. We must improve here and I strongly believe a change in shape and Mesut in the team would give him more options to improve chances created. He has made his decision on Mesut and made his decision on the shape and I will judge him based on that.
 

Manberg

Predator
Too many people are drawing conclusions from games against City and Pool away. Our top 4 rivals won't win those. Besides, in both those games if luck went our way we could've got something.
As for West Ham and Sheffield, well they are two disciplined teams. It's not easy to create chances against them. We eventually did make the chances that won us the game. If we have to be clinical and take our 3 chances per game then so be it. The onus is on the strikers to deliver. Arteta's in year 1 of a 5 year plan, the attack is not in the form he envisions in the future but he's trying to make the most of what he's got. We have a chance at top 4 and so far we're on the right track.
I'd rather sacrifice a flowing attack to be more solid defensively than be a team who creates chances galore but is open at the other end. Getting the balance right is going to take a lot of time. Some of you don't have any patience.
 

AbouCuéllar

Author of A-M essays 📚
It was a scatter gun approach for sure but I’m tired of posters like @Manberg putting the blame on Wenger for our current problems when the man has been gone for 2 + years and his acquisitions are not even the issue. Wenger’s teams always were attacking yet manberg wants to blame our lack of offensive output on Wenger?

Arteta has significantly improved our defensive solidity and over structure. We do a lot more work off the ball and everyone seems to be pitching in. He has done very well on the areas that Wenger was deficient on over his last few years. However it has come at a cost offensively. We are very weak in terms of chance creation and shots taken over the last two seasons we have consistently been in the bottom half of the league in regards to those metrics.

Wenger has his faults for sure and Arteta has done very well in doing his best to fix our most glaring issues. However to act like Arteta is infallible and should not be criticized is also laughable.

Well, I think in terms of personnel, Wenger certainly deserves some blame for our team's quality, much like Ferguson should deserve some blame for how he left United, in terms of personnel only. Ferguson claimed he left United in good shape with young players like Jones, Smalling, Zaha, Cleverly, Welbeck for the future...not one of those players was United level. Wenger has made similar claims, but who from Wenger's recruitment is a good player for us other than Aubameyang?

Xhaka is the closest, the rest are dead weight. Özil's contract extension was typical of the poor squad planning and lack of vision, Lacazette was a poor signing in that respect too--again, signing band-aids hoping to improve for the here and now--Ramsey's contract being run down in view of a move or a renewal with more leverage in doing so was happening under Wenger's watch, Mustafi, Pérez the less said the better. The fact is, he left us with an old, poor quality team, of which none do we have any use of bar Xhaka and Auba. The Sánchez fiasco was a real sign of the Barçaesque short-termism and band-aidism going on...turn down £55m for Sánchez that we absolutely should've accepted (even then, our supposed replacement, was a poor, poor choice, and also typical of a win-now approach at the expense of all else: he was the obvious choice, so we were going to throw £90m at him, despite there being massive red flags over his quality--his chances created at Monaco were the type of profile that really put a huge doubt over whether he was a player worth spending big money on, or who could translate into a top player for a top side, this isn't hindsight), then go for Mkhitaryan in the winter when there were no other options...

Any way you shake it up, he and Gazidis (who I blame even more, as he was Wenger's higher up, but for Gazidis the world doesn't have enough contempt to properly express what he deserves) left us in a very, very poor position for a top club, in terms of squad recruitment, planning, and general personnel. Other than perhaps Barça it's hard to think of a top club that had as bad of a squad planning and recruitmet policy in these years.

Now, I agree that if we are talking about legacy issues in terms of tactical or 'club culture' issues, and using those nebulous ideas to blame Wenger, then that is nonsense. People were even using those ideas to excuse Emery in his 2nd season here, which is silly-- any proper manager with a vision can change those things in a year or so, that is a fundamental part of his job and whether he is a good manager or not.

But it is totally fair, I think, to say that the team, in terms of squad building and personnel, had a long way to go from when Wenger left us and that we are still paying for it.

They lost :lol:

And created very few chances. Absolutely love Bielsa, he's a legend, an icon, and a visionary, but Arteta >>
 

Manberg

Predator
Did we finish 5th when Wenger left? We’re just asking to finish one position higher after a spend of hundreds of millions, multiple keepers, defenders signed, in a league where you’re competing with the poorest Utd since the 80s and poorest Chelsea set up pre Mourinho.

Nobody is asking Arteta to win a title.

We finished 5th and 6th in Wenger's last two years. Arteta's spent £77m so far. You can count that over one year.

In 2017 - 2018 Wenger spent £138m. The year before that he spent £101m.
So this myth that Wenger didnt' spend is just that - a myth.

Source: https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/fc-arsenal/alletransfers/verein/11

Arteta needs a lot more backing.
 

GDeep™

League is very weak
We finished 5th and 6th in Wenger's last two years. Arteta's spent £77m so far. You can count that over one year.

In 2017 - 2018 Wenger (or Gazidis/Mislintat) spent £138m. The year before that he spent £101m.
So this myth that Wenger didnt' spend is just that - a myth.

Source: https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/fc-arsenal/alletransfers/verein/11

Arteta needs a lot more backing.
We sold 140M worth of players to spend that 130M in 17/18. The net spend in the 2 years you mentioned is 90M, 45M if you divide it between two seasons - which is peanuts.

Wenger is the lowest spending managers, from the top clubs, in PL history, so it’s not a myth, it’s a fact.

What’s the argument anyway? All summer I have been saying give Arteta, who is my boy, more money because he’ll get us CL very easily if Stan backs him.
 
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