‘Scapegoating’ Players for Wenger’s Incompetence

Discussion in 'Arsenal Talk' started by General, May 10, 2009.

  1. albakos

    albakos Arséne Wenger: "I will miss you" Administrator

    I am coming to conclusion that Wenger has a big ego, and he is on a mission "me vs. critics" and he wants to prove them wrong.

    He is well aware that his youth system is not producing results, yet he insists it will bear fruit, and he created this false sense of security about how this team is growing strong, how we are maturing, how there is a unity among team etc...

    I am of opinion that his decision to build the team around Fabregas is not too assuring, because he can easily be marked(Chelsea, Manure) and lately is having **** performances due to prick attitude he has developed since being named captain.

    Unfortunately the board is a whole bunch of people who seek profit first,titles later and they don't say a word to him.
     
  2. Glovegun

    Glovegun New Member Trusted

    Yes he does have a big ego, and I think we're all very much aware of his inadequacies. For me its quite simple. He has signed and trusted in players, young or otherwise, who are just not good enough.

    The likes of Walcott, Song, Djourou, Gibbs, Bendtner and Vela have all shown that they have the talent to be at the Arsenal long-term, but they shouldnt be relied upon just yet. Too green.

    Diaby has one good game in seven, and has shown no soon of improvement since he came here.

    Adebayor is lazy, egotistical, a poor finisher, has bad control and has awful movement.

    Silvestre is plain ****.

    Denilson will never be good enough.

    Toure has finally evolved into the headless chicken he looked like being this time last year.

    The jury is still out on van Persie and Fabianski.
     
  3. Big Poppa

    Big Poppa Well-Known Member Trusted

    Mate, check the title of the thread. General's point (and a point very well made I must say) is that people are letting Wenger get off lightly by singling out individuals, as you have just done, for blame.

    Diaby did not play when we were creamed 3-1 by Man U, in what was arguably, a worse performance than against Chelsea. Denilson did not play against Man U or Chelsea, but was in the team that took a defensive hammering from Liverpool. And Song played all 3, but again, the guy was left covering the defence all by himself. You see, it doesn't matter who is in the team, nobody seems to know their job when we haven't got the ball.

    It's as if they've been sent out with instructions to 'go out and play'. The gap between midfield / defence / attack is unacceptable. We have no clue how to press as a unit, nor when to drop off. When one of our centre halfs brings the ball out, nobody drops in to cover him. Both fullbacks attack at the same time, leaving our centre halves woefully exposed. Its a much bigger problem than Abou Diaby - not that his performances have helped matters. We were bound to be punished by any team with a bit of quality about them and that's exactly what happened.
     
  4. Anzac

    Anzac Active Member

    Well it's about bl**dy time supporters here saw the forest for the trees..........
     
  5. Biggus

    Biggus New Member Elite

    :lol: Well Al's had a go, so has Eboue, then Denilson, now its Diaby's turn......Do you see a pattern emerging?
     
  6. General

    General Well-Known Member

    I obviously didn’t create this thread to be hijacked for another player bashing contest. In fact the sole reason I created it was to keep these inane drivels out. The childishness on this board is astounding at times.


    We’ve deployed so many systems this season it is not even a laughing matter. We’ve gone from playing Denilson as a DM to a CM to a winger. Bizarrely, the player he was meant to make way for was suddenly deployed elsewhere. We’ve even Song as a right back at one point. There has been no consistency whatsoever in the way Wenger’s set the team up this team up this season and this is a direct result of the good old adage – ‘you don’t know what you’re doing’.

    I honestly don’t give a **** whether or not we buy any players this summer because the issue clearly goes beyond player acquisition or financial management or injuries or poor leadership or bad refereeing decisions …..repeat to fade. Wenger used to be known for his simplicity and creating a synergy friendly system but this is no longer the case. The penny finally dropped this past few weeks and it’s exposed the cluelessness of management in getting the best out of this team. They built this team up from scratch yet don’t appear to have a clue on how to optimise performance with the right system. The worst part of it all is when they decided to discard the system that played a major role in this 21 unbeaten match streak. When asked is he’d be making any signings this summer after the Chelsea game – he pointed to our goal difference and said he will look for a signing in this regard. How about addressing the poorly coached signs these players depict for one!
     
  7. alonso14

    alonso14 New Member Trusted

    Just curious - Match Go-ers

    Watching the game as a neutral and from the outside, there seemed to be an air of quiet resignation in the second half on Sunday

    I noticed it most when the subs were made....polite applause, and sit back and watch the defeat gain momentum...

    Where are the match going crowd at? Has Wenger lost some / most all of the support?

    It reminds me of Houlliers last days.......when people were too fed up to get angry

    I always got the feeling that people were trustin of Wenger, but if here is anything to go by that isnt the case

    just curious
     
  8. asajoseph

    asajoseph New Member Elite

    I was in the lower tier, which is unusual for me, and I thought that generally the fans were fired up at times, resigned at others, and even angry at others.

    I think the cheers and the applause kind of mirrored the attitudes of the players on the pitch - their heads went down for long periods, and at those times the fans were quiet, or indeed on their backs.

    I would say that there was a sense of resignment though, for large chunks of the game, and a certain amount of that frustration was definitely directed in Wenger's direction.

    It was bizarre when Ade came on - not a cheer at all (though I didn't hear any boos either), just polite applause.
     
  9. General

    General Well-Known Member

    The guys sitting next to me(looked a ST holder) upped sticks after Toure planted the ball in our net and asked some people behind me if they were coming to Stoke. He said good luck and off he went. The last time I saw people streaming out like this was probably Tottenham in the Carling Cup. There were ironic cheers when Bendtner scored too which was funny because the crowd have always given him a hard time. I went to Waterloo station after the game to meet a mate and caught a chat with a few fans from the game. People just don't understand where we are heading at the moment, not because we haven't won anything but due to the simple fact that for once Wenger seems clueless to the task ahead. Anyone who went to the Reading at home last season after we lost to United will tell you it was one of the biggest supports at Ashburton, both in terms of numbers and vocal support. This was after it became obvious that we were going to win nothing but people were chirpy because we looked to be heading in the right direction. Wenger has single-handedly gone and undone all the good work within 12 months and I will be surprised if our home game against Stoke comes any close to a sell out. I checked the ticket hub yesterday and people are chucking their tickets back on Ticket Exchange. The end of season parade is going to be interesting. A big change in thinking is needed, whether or not we buy new players. The United game is the perfect opportunity to save some face but I expect Wenger to once again Impede the team with another ridiculous setup.
     
  10. qs

    qs New Member Elite

    Its not exactly a difficult concept to grasp. Wenger should've signed a better second choice keeper. You do realise he is let do that don't you?
     
  11. qs

    qs New Member Elite

    Well the subs who were brought on weren't the most popular. Taking Diaby off was welcomed but most don't get excited as Bendtners brought on. The second set of subs took off 2 players who'd been bright and involved and replaced them with 2 pretty unpopular characters in Ade and Denilson. Atmosphere had died at that stage though but it came back to life after Nik scored. Then once they got the 4th the place emptied out with the usual plastic ****s all marching out before the game was over.
     
  12. AnthonyG

    AnthonyG Arse Emeritus Administrator

    Well now Wenger knows that being a regular for your NT does not mean you are necessarily ready for the big time in the EPL. I doubt he'll bring in an experienced journeyman #2 - I think there'd be more chance of him bringing in someone to compete directly with Al to be honest.

    Fabianski was poor but I have a hard time separating his overall performance from the play of our back three and a half.
     
  13. TomasCR

    TomasCR New Member Trusted

    So you think Wenger is going to buy a keeper Anthony?
     
  14. Spam

    Spam New Member

    A keeper? Almunia has cemented top spot and with Wenger not splashing out huge sums on players we desperatelly need, he's hardly going to move ffor another 'keeper. Lukasz provides 'adecquate' backup to Almunia, and with Vito Unknown as third choice accompanied by Shea and Szczesny still to come through the ranks we mightn't see a 'big' keeper like Frey or akinfeev here for some time. Almunia isn't to blame for, and a new Goalkeeper isn't the answer to our problems.
     
  15. ultradoc

    ultradoc New Member

    Dude! Wenger buys number 1s who need playing time to develop into permanent players first. No chance he is buying a number two who is a finished product already. Haha. Never.
     
  16. AnthonyG

    AnthonyG Arse Emeritus Administrator

    No I don't. I think both scenarios are very unlikely. Bar someone crushing his ankle Al seems pretty durable.
     
  17. Hoboface

    Hoboface New Member

    I must say I am quite shocked to read some of the posts here, from very experienced forum members/moderators who I believe have slightly missed a trick.

    Number 1, people here say you can't really blame Diaby (for example, but could apply to a number of players) for playing badly etc, as he's out of position in a team that isn't settled, and part of a squad that is wholly imbalanced. Fair enough, I agree completely.

    But what confuses me is how this theory is not extended to its natural conclusion. Diaby is himself, no more no less, so you cannot (or at least a good manager SHOULD not) ask him to do things he can't. But equally Wenger is Wenger, no more and no less. Historically he has always overseen teams that have flair and pace, but often lack a bit of backbone or defensive toughness. The only time I can think of an exception is when he inherited the best back four in english football history (more or less). The result? A team with great balance that found great success. Simple.

    However, Wenger in my opinion has been mismanaged by the Board. They can obviously see, like the rest of us, that he is not the perfect manager, and yet they have done nothing to reign in his excesses! why not? Wenger by nature will want to save money, get good bargains, and bring players through the youth system....this is his pattern throughout his career. It is also a pattern that has served us well, since it has brought massive steps forward (stadium, training ground etc) while at the same time bringin some trophies.

    But now the formula isn't working, and needs to be slightly changed. It is the job of the BOARD to do this, to utilise the strengths they have and minimise the weaknesses. They are so frightened about their own positions perhaps, that they have failed to do this. Hopefully the new chief exec to replace Dein will go some way to achieving this, and i think we are seeing some results in the Arshavin deal.

    Anyway, please guys, I think the mauling you've given Wenger is a bit of a disgrace to be honest, even though the points made about his ego etc are pretty fair. The guy IS a great manager....anyone who can take that shower of s**t, on a small budget, and be without Walcott and Fabregas for lots of the season, and STILL get champ lg semi finals, is testament to his skills.

    Don't sack him, just tell him to buy a couple of players (possibly at a slightly inflated price) that are necessary for the team to regain balance. IF he wont listen, then maybe show him the door.

    But if you ask me, the board love this situation, cos they can b;lame everything on Arsène. They should take some repsonsiblity for the whole mess of this season. Anyway sorry for the long post, but I feel very strongly about this as its something I hear from idiots at the game (especially yesterday). I expect better on this site though.
     
  18. Clrnc

    Clrnc Well-Known Member Trusted

    I think you are belittling Fabianski. He hasn't had a great month of games but I wouldn't judge him on that based on the amount of defensive errors in front of him. Its clear he is a good goalie, but very inexperienced yet. Like I said in another thread, there won't be many better number 2s than him.
     
  19. belgianfan

    belgianfan New Member

    I am furious with wenger's tactics but sometimes a player is overrated.

    Yes diaby is played on an unfamiliar position, but that doesn't exclude the fact if he tries to controll a ball and it jumps away from his foot, that this is a bad control. He can be anywhere on the pitch for that matter. If there are 3 people around you, you pass the ball and you don't try to dribble yourself out of this situation.

    Some players lack certain qualities that just aren't excusable. Like our crossing at times is just plain inexcusable. It's ridiculous how so many players at a topclub can't even cross the ball to create dangerous situations.

    Look at manutd o'shea, fletcher, rooney, giggs these guys play everywhere. I am not saying they are doing a good job but they make themself usefull. If you put half of our players in another position they become useless. Guys like nasri or rosicky can play good in a few positions, walcott too.

    Flamini was a guy you could put everywhere and he would do decent, he was a lb, rb, defensive midfielder or even a attacking midfielder.

    Wenger's fault lays there that he plays too much people out of position but most of all people who can't handle that position at all because these guys are not even good enough for their natural position to be at a topclub.

    I know I'm being very negative, but our squad lacks the quality, lacks the inexperience and wengers transfers in recent years have been ****. Look at how many players we have for the attacking spots.
     
  20. Glovegun

    Glovegun New Member Trusted

    Agreed.
     

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