Aaron Ramsdale: Toys Out Of The Pramsdale

[Tir Na Nog]

He does a lot of things I don't like but probably just does enough to say he's not a major problem at this moment. Not sure there's anyone we can go out and buy who'd be an improvement.

 

[Patjen]

@Patjen

It isn't a total myth. 24-25 is young for a keeper.

I'm gonna throw 10 keepers in the list the first that come into my head:

Seaman
Lehmann
Schmichael
Cech
Buffon
Neuer
Courtious
Kahn
Allison
Van der Sar

How many of those keepers were at their peak at 24-25?

No ne said anything about peak. Compete t would be the minumum requirement.
Look at Meliefaeeds is he getting vetter with age ,definitely not , what about Butland too.
Is pickford improving , is Ramsdale improving ,nope.
Age doesnt stop mistakes.
Lloris is on the way down now as is De gea.
Just an opinion bit youve got it or you havent

 

[Patjen]

Apologies should have reas.

No one said anything about peak. Competent would be the minumum requirement.
Look at Melia fir Leeds, is he getting bpetter with age ,definitely not , what about Butland too.
Is Pickford improving , is Ramsdale improving ,nope.
Age doesnt stop mistakes.
Lloris is on the way down now as is De gea.
Just an opinion but youve got it or you havent
Only possibility is improvement through a great coach

 

[TromsoGooner]

He does a lot of things I don't like but probably just does enough to say he's not a major problem at this moment. Not sure there's anyone we can go out and buy who'd be an improvement.

Pretty much where I am at too

 

[14Henry]

No ne said anything about peak. Compete t would be the minumum requirement.
Look at Meliefaeeds is he getting vetter with age ,definitely not , what about Butland too.
Is pickford improving , is Ramsdale improving ,nope.
Age doesnt stop mistakes.
Lloris is on the way down now as is De gea.
Just an opinion bit youve got it or you havent

Ages doesn't stop mistakes but experience does help.

Lloris is 36 fs.

Where were Seaman and Schmichael at 24?

 

[Patjen]

Ages doesn't stop mistakes but experience does help.

Lloris is 36 fs.

Where were Seaman and Schmichael at 24?

You tell me you mentioned them.
So what is the magic age where one day you wake up and hey presto youre at your peak.
If youve played first team football at a pro level at 19 which many have done , when will you be capable snd competent. Steve harper sat on the bench fir 90% of his career, will he still ve at his peak at 30 ish ?

 

[14Henry]

You tell me you mentioned them.
So what is the magic age where one day you wake up and hey presto youre at your peak.
If youve played first team football at a pro level at 19 which many have done , when will you be capable snd competent. Steve harper sat on the bench fir 90% of his career, will he still ve at his peak at 30 ish ?

You don't wake up at your peak.

It comes with maturity both on and off the pitch. Experience, coaching, management, sports science. The list goes on. An accumulation of those things makes better players over time.

You can always find exceptions. But if your argument is based around Butland and Steven Harpur I'll take that as you not really having much of an argument.

Anyone who has spent any time watching football and the goings on around it will know that keepers peak later than outfield players. You don't need me to tell you that. You simply have to look back at the history of the game.

 

[Heavy Duty Rom]

You don't wake up at your peak.

It comes with maturity both on and off the pitch. Experience, coaching, management, sports science. The list goes on. An accumulation of those things makes better players over time.

You can always find exceptions. But if your argument is based around Butland and Steven Harpur I'll take that as you not really having much of an argument.

Anyone who has spent any time watching football and the goings on around it will know that keepers peak later than outfield players. You don't need me to tell you that. You simply have to look back at the history of the game.

Players don't usually drastically improve imo. Those who really thrive find the right environment at the right time. Ramsdale found that at Arsenal and still looks incredibly suspect.

 

[GDeep™]

Wow.

I cannot believe what I’m hearing.

What the hell is this?

 

[GDeep™]

@Patjen

It isn't a total myth. 24-25 is young for a keeper.

I'm gonna throw 10 keepers in the list the first that come into my head:

Seaman
Lehmann
Schmichael
Cech
Buffon
Neuer
Courtious
Kahn
Allison
Van der Sar

How many of those keepers were at their peak at 24-25?

None of those looked as dodgy as Ramsdale does either at 25. Cech, Allison, Neuer, Courtois etc, never had these question marks over them at 25.

 

[Patjen]

You don't wake up at your peak.

It comes with maturity both on and off the pitch. Experience, coaching, management, sports science. The list goes on. An accumulation of those things makes better players over time.

You can always find exceptions. But if your argument is based around Butland and Steven Harpur I'll take that as you not really having much of an argument.

Anyone who has spent any time watching football and the goings on around it will know that keepers peak later than outfield players. You don't need me to tell you that. You simply have to look back at the history of the game.

I have 4 sons who playe/play football, one who was a Pro goalkeeper af 5'-10 and had more ability than Ramsdale will ever have.
So believe me ive watched a lot of football and moreso goalkeepers.
Experience is everything.
But that means playing competitive games and not academy.

I mentioned Meslier who played in the prem/ champ very young and with correct coaching should be a top kerper.
Hes not really developed at 23/24 after 5 seasons as first choice . Will he suddenly become wonderful at 30 .

 

[14Henry]

I have 4 sons who playe/play football, one who was a Pro goalkeeper af 5'-10 and had more ability than Ramsdale will ever have.
So believe me ive watched a lot of football and moreso goalkeepers.
Experience is everything.
But that means playing competitive games and not academy.

I mentioned Meslier who played in the prem/ champ very young and with correct coaching should be a top kerper.
Hes not really developed at 23/24 after 5 seasons as first choice . Will he suddenly become wonderful at 30 .

Improvement isnt going from a good goalkeeper to world class.

Meslier is a decent goalkeeper. That doesn't mean that he won't gradually get better even 5-10% over the next 2 or 3 years. He is never going to be world class. But that isn't the debate here.

I'm not saying Ramsdale will be drastically better in 3 or 4 years. But I am willing to say he will be better than he is now. Even if it is only 5 or 10%.

The debate is not going from a 5/10 to a 10/10 by 28-29. But it could be going from 5/10 to a 6/6.5/10.

I'll ask you a question that requires a yes or no answer. Do you think this level is the best Ramsdale will ever reach. He will never be better than he is today?

 

[lomekian]

No ne said anything about peak. Compete t would be the minumum requirement.
Look at Meliefaeeds is he getting vetter with age ,definitely not , what about Butland too.
Is pickford improving , is Ramsdale improving ,nope.
Age doesnt stop mistakes.
Lloris is on the way down now as is De gea.
Just an opinion bit youve got it or you havent

Ramsdale is categorically improving. By every metric bar long ball completions he has significantly improved since last year and the eye test shows he's really improved in 1 on 1's. He's not the finished article, isn't aesthetically pleasing and doesn't exude the calm or aura of a Seaman, Schmeichel or Allison, but as has been pointed out, most of them were playing for small clubs with no pressure at the same age.
Where Ramsdale is one of the best at any top club is his footwork. He often makes very difficult saves look routine (though scrappy at times with his style) because his footwork is absolutely elite for a goalkeeper. Very few with anything like the same footspeed who aren't short-arses.

 

[lomekian]

You tell me you mentioned them.
So what is the magic age where one day you wake up and hey presto youre at your peak.
If youve played first team football at a pro level at 19 which many have done , when will you be capable snd competent. Steve harper sat on the bench fir 90% of his career, will he still ve at his peak at 30 ish ?

Keepers will always peak later because their game is hugely influenced by judgement and experience, in a way that only perhaps centre-backs or defensive midfielders can begin to compete with.

The very best keepers show their talent in their early to mid 20s and peak late 20s toe early 30s if you look historically to the present day

 

[Patjen]

Improvement isnt going from a good goalkeeper to world class.

Meslier is a decent goalkeeper. That doesn't mean that he won't gradually get better even 5-10% over the next 2 or 3 years. He is never going to be world class. But that isn't the debate here.

I'm not saying Ramsdale will be drastically better in 3 or 4 years. But I am willing to say he will be better than he is now. Even if it is only 5 or 10%.

The debate is not going from a 5/10 to a 10/10 by 28-29. But it could be going from 5/10 to a 6/6.5/10.

I'll ask you a question that requires a yes or no answer. Do you think this level is the best Ramsdale will ever reach. He will never be better than he is today?

Yes, he wont improve without one of 2 things . A coach comes him who can correct and improve his nany weaknesses, for eg . Postional player, decision making carelessness, handling , crosses, playing valls inti safe areas, need I go on . The other thing he needs to do is to forget about the supporters and stop trying to play up to them.

Coaches at football clubs in my experience get there badges via the Eufa badge system from coaches who can show hos to put drills on bug ard clueless in correcting infuvidusls, therefire use a one one size fits all attitude hoping repetiveness will improve all eventually.
Thats why goalkeepers continue to remain stagnant in parts of there game. For eg a keeped wilm face 1000s of half volleys in career of training. How many will they face in there career in matches, 10?

 

[Patjen]

Ramsdale is categorically improving. By every metric bar long ball completions he has significantly improved since last year and the eye test shows he's really improved in 1 on 1's. He's not the finished article, isn't aesthetically pleasing and doesn't exude the calm or aura of a Seaman, Schmeichel or Allison, but as has been pointed out, most of them were playing for small clubs with no pressure at the same age.
Where Ramsdale is one of the best at any top club is his footwork. He often makes very difficult saves look routine (though scrappy at times with his style) because his footwork is absolutely elite for a goalkeeper. Very few with anything like the same footspeed who aren't short-arses.

How much worse off would you be with an outfield player in goal.
Like you and i both said Ramsdake majes dverything look hard , even a short pass ge manages to try and wrap his foot around it. Very hard keeper to watch and admire

 

[Rasmi]

Arsenal once again gamble on a young player improving and just handing him huge contract. We are stuck with him. He will always pull of great reflex saves. Unless he improves his positioning and reading of the game big time he will never be top player

 

[Patjen]

Ask yourself How much worse off would you be with an outfield player in goal.
Like you and I both said Ramsdale makes everything look hard , even a short pass he manages to try and wrap his foot around it. Very hard keeper to watch and admire.

 

[14Henry]

Yes, he wont improve without one of 2 things . A coach comes him who can correct and improve his nany weaknesses, for eg . Postional player, decision making carelessness, handling , crosses, playing valls inti safe areas, need I go on . The other thing he needs to do is to forget about the supporters and stop trying to play up to them.

Coaches at football clubs in my experience get there badges via the Eufa badge system from coaches who can show hos to put drills on bug ard clueless in correcting infuvidusls, therefire use a one one size fits all attitude hoping repetiveness will improve all eventually.
Thats why goalkeepers continue to remain stagnant in parts of there game. For eg a keeped wilm face 1000s of half volleys in career of training. How many will they face in there career in matches, 10?

Can you answer my question with one word.

Is the current Aaron Ramsdale the best he will ever be?

Yes or No.

 

[Patjen]

Can you answer my question with one word.

Is the current Aaron Ramsdale the best he will ever be?

Yes or No.

Yes