All or Nothing - Mikel Arteta ( and Arsenal ) - Amazon Prime

[Deleted member 102404]

Yeah - he's still insecure about his status as a manager at this level. You can see it. I get the impression that he is far more aware of his ****-ups than people credit and he broods over them. You could also see that when he knew the team was struggling at the start and end of the season that he could see it, was worried about it, and wasn't sure what to do, so resorted to 'trying stuff'.

What he needs to get better at as well, is the Wenger super powers of 1) knowing how to make the team feel 'unbelievable belief' when they need it & 2)Being able to shield the players from his own stress.

the first may be beyond him as its partly a personality thing. The second should come with experience and confidence.

Being able to bear your own stress and not pass too much on is a really key part of being an effective leader.

I think the two points you make are linked also. Calmness under fire transmits a sense of belief and instills it in those around you. Projecting belief even when you are nervous as hell does come with experience.
I think he’ll learn. As has been said many times - and I think even the most staunch Arteta supporter agrees - Arteta should never have been appointed. The premier league is not a place for managers with no experience , never mind Arsenal. But, he was appointed, and he’s making a decent fist of it so far … but needs to learn man management very quickly if he is going to succeed… and it’s not something you can learn in a text book. You learn by doing and the mistakes you make.

 

[Rex Stone]

As long as you accept that you can’t get any Pizza topping you like you’ll be ok.

Fast food workers the world over tremble when they hear me on the phone.

 

[lomekian]

Interesting conclusions, I think it'd be a good discussion to had. Some points I agree with, some I think are a bit of stretch.

Not really interesting conclusions because this guy has been hardcore Arteta out for like 2 years. They are also totally confirmation bias projections and show a total lack of understanding for the fact that this is a highly edited TV show in which certain things were never going to be shown.

I mean we literally didn't see Ødegaard speak more than once in 7 episodes, yet he's ALWAYS talking on the pitch and is captain of Norway. And like Pepe 'made to feel isolated' - I mean quite apart from the footage we saw, we see it enough in training clips & on match days that Pepe seems really shy and barely makes eye contact with anyone who isn't French or francophone. It may well not be his fault, but Pepe over 3 has just never managed to integrate with the group as well as Jesus did in like a fortnight. And they were never going to show tactical or managerial accountability in this show FFS.

 

[Macho]

Did they ask for Lacas opinion on the whole thing? I mean he was made captain straight after and this was his best friend at the club. I honestly can't remember, if he did say anything it wasn't noteworthy

Kept it PG, said Auba wished him well and said he deserved to keep the armband.

As it was unfolding, no none of the players were asked. There was a clip of Auba in his car someone asked him if he was going to talk to management and Auba said "no lol" and drove off.

Auba being a mute was weird as well because we know for sure he is not, we've seen enough footage over the years. Hence why I am allowing Ødegaard (although I have absolutely zero doubts his portrayal wasn't very far from the truth).

 

[lomekian]

I think both Mikel and Edu come across as inexperienced and a bit out of their depth when it comes to some essential management tasks.

Edu seems a decent bloke but he would have a tough time bartering with an importer of damaged goods on the flea market. The guy has a face of a person ready to be scammed.

Arteta is trying to impose himself as an authoritarian but I think he comes across as pretty insecure which is understandable considering the scope of the job and it being his first. Looking from that angle, you got to respect the bravery and Machiavelism... kind of.

The good thing is that after this summer you don't have any more of these pay-to-leave guys and both Edu and Arteta seem to be learning on the job and you can actually see some progress. That's the positive.

I think Edu is tougher than he looks, but chooses his battles. Its clear however, that he's not that fussed about cash flow when it comes to getting people out the door.

Arteta is clearly excellent at some parts of his job and really inexperienced and a bit insecure at others. Which probably reflects what most suspected. I think like a lot of coaches who were successful players because they squeezed everything they could out of themselves, people being half arsed drives him mad, and he's clearly carrying some baggage from stuff he wasn't happy about re club discipline when he was towards the end of his playing career.

Like you say, they both seem to be learning year on year from what we can see, and the overarching approach seems the right one despite ****-ups along the way, and the worst of the overpaid bell-ends (and overpaid good guys who tailed off) have gone, so not only is the vibe better, but we can start to really judge them this year.

 

[BergMan]

Feedback on the series from most Arsenal fans is positive. Many are asking for a season 2.

 

[lomekian]

Can you train me up?

People say I sound too much like Pat Tate and find it intimidating

That would be intimidating!

There's lots of stuff online tbf - Key thing is connecting your breath to your speech and breathing abdominally (ie getting enough air into the lungs so it makes your belly move rather than your chest, and using that air rather than your throat to power the voice) & to a) drink more water and b) try to keep your throat and neck relaxed. Throat and neck tension properly screw your voice.

One really simple thing that helps is just drink some lemon and ginger tea with a spoon of honey if feeling a bit scratchy!

 

[lomekian]

I think the two points you make are linked also. Calmness under fire transmits a sense of belief and instills it in those around you. Projecting belief even when you are nervous as hell does come with experience.
I think he’ll learn. As has been said many times - and I think even the most staunch Arteta supporter agrees - Arteta should never have been appointed. The premier league is not a place for managers with no experience , never mind Arsenal. But, he was appointed, and he’s making a decent fist of it so far … but needs to learn man management very quickly if he is going to succeed… and it’s not something you can learn in a text book. You learn by doing and the mistakes you make.

I think Mikel was the wrong appointment for his first season and while supportive I had real doubts, but once they decided to burn it down and start again it made a lot more sense to keep him as the things he is good at lend itself for a longer term approach.

I hope he watches it and reflects on certain things again (I'm sure he has thought about them already), because there are times it clearly shows him transmitting his own stresses onto the team.

 

[lomekian]

That would be intimidating!

There's lots of stuff online tbf - Key thing is connecting your breath to your speech and breathing abdominally (ie getting enough air into the lungs so it makes your belly move rather than your chest, and using that air rather than your throat to power the voice) & to a) drink more water and b) try to keep your throat and neck relaxed. Throat and neck tension properly screw your voice.

One really simple thing that helps is just drink some lemon and ginger tea with a spoon of honey if feeling a bit scratchy!

PS - if you are genuinely interested in learning more about this stuff, I'm more than happy to share info and bits of what I know. I'm not an expert in it, but its been part of my professional life for 15 years or so, and I've helped a handful of mates who have had either vocal or breathing issues.

 

[Jury]

How are you talking though. You stay sucking Mikdick while hating Xhaka, how does that work for you?

That doesn’t apply to me at all. That position applies far more to that of you and others.

I don’t feel any big way about him at all. I’ve stated my stance a few pages back. I’m just letting it play out and trying to enjoy it while seeing both sides. If anybody is a fan of midshIte, it’s people like you who hang off Xhaka’s nuts while being massive Mikel critics, unable to give him any credit or acknowledge any influence he may have had in helping Xhaka turn his Arsenal career around.

How does that work for you?

 

[db10_therza]

Seeing a lot of posts here about the lack of accountability for Mikel when it comes to his tactics. I'm curious, what do you guys think happens at say other clubs with other managers? You think players gang up and confront their manager about his tactics? And do you think it ends well for the clubs where that happens?

The manager is basically the end of the line. His job is to hold himself to account. I dont think even Amazon have the technical know-how to put a camera inside mikel's brain to see if he's doing that or not. Although to be fair if they ask nicely enough he might draw it out for them, he's got a masters in brain drawing.

And before someone pipes up, yes there is a step up from the manager but I'm fairly sure, barring Abramovic, owners don't get involved in the day to day tactics of a team. No manager would stand for that.

 

[Jury]

I mean it's clear he's the leader in the dressing room, anyone denying this is on an agenda.
On the pitch he's let us and his teammates down far too many times to be a captain.

Still we need him, he has a good role here.

Tbh I think Mikel is cutting corners with him. He’s using the players experience of all good and ****e, and the fact he’s liked and even looked up to within the group, to influence his evaluation of him as a footballer and what he brings technically to the table. I think he thinks that his job will be made harder in the short term which is mightily important in our fight to reclaim CL football, in respect of team morale if he let him go. On that score, I think he needs to take a leaf out of Klopps book in how he managed another spiritual leader of a group in Henderson. Quality can and will always make up for the shouting and the pointing. If you don’t think it can, then you lack management skills.

 

[jones]

That doesn’t apply to me at all. That position applies far more to that of you and others.

I don’t feel any big way about him at all. I’ve stated my stance a few pages back. I’m just letting it play out and trying to enjoy it while seeing both sides. If anybody is a fan of midshIte, it’s people like you who hang off Xhaka’s nuts while being massive Mikel critics, unable to give him any credit or acknowledge any influence he may have had in helping Xhaka turn his Arsenal career around.

How does that work for you?

You're chatting a bunch of **** as usual, where did I hang off Xhaka's nuts? And what kind of "no you" response is that first paragraph in the first place you ****ing infant? Try argue any point I'm actually making instead of just assuming there's a hivemind of people who all think the same as soon as they disagree with you.

I wishlisted Xhaka some ten years ago, kept hoping he'd turn it around for years watching him drop clanger after clanger. Not going to sing his praises or forget all the poor he's done because he's gone a couple of games without causing another carcrash. He's not a horrible player and has some good qualities - his availability comes to mind - but considering how we're upgrading every position (bar coach) Xhaka definitely needs to be replaced asap.

 

[lomekian]

Tbh I think Mikel is cutting corners with him. He’s using the players experience of all good and ****e, and the fact he’s liked and even looked up to within the group, to influence his evaluation of him as a footballer and what he brings technically to the table. I think he thinks that his job will be made harder in the short term which is mightily important in our fight to reclaim CL football, in respect of team morale if he let him go. On that score, I think he needs to take a leaf out of Klopps book in how he managed another spiritual leader of a group in Henderson. Quality can and will always make up for the shouting and the pointing. If you don’t think it can, then you lack management skills.

1) Others may have a higher opinion of Xhaka's technique than you. While he has slow feet so can't beat players unless he nutmegs them, his passing technique is excellent as is his ball striking and heading. Different people value different technical skills in different positions.

2) Your comparison with Henderson kind of falls down with the Liverpool man playing in almost every game he's been fit for (see transfermrkt for stats) over the last 3 years. Although some of those have been as sub, he normally gets quite lengthy sub appearances. Given that a chunk of that time he's being nursed back from injuries and is 2 1/4 years older than Xhaka, I'm not sure your suggestion carries much water - when fully fit Henderson plays almost as much as Xhaka, with almost as many starts.

 

[Hunta]

Finally watched the rest. Rob Holding needs to go.

 

[Jury]

1) Others may have a higher opinion of Xhaka's technique than you. While he has slow feet so can't beat players unless he nutmegs them, his passing technique is excellent as is his ball striking and heading. Different people value different technical skills in different positions.

2) Your comparison with Henderson kind of falls down with the Liverpool man playing in almost every game he's been fit for (see transfermrkt for stats) over the last 3 years. Although some of those have been as sub, he normally gets quite lengthy sub appearances. Given that a chunk of that time he's being nursed back from injuries and is 2 1/4 years older than Xhaka, I'm not sure your suggestion carries much water - when fully fit Henderson plays almost as much as Xhaka, with almost as many starts.

You’ve just basically agreed with me on your second point.

. Liverpool fans don’t have him as a first team starter in a game they had to win. Xhaka’s fan alienating antics aside, I think their respective roles and importance are quite similar

 

[lomekian]

You’ve just basically agreed with me on your second point.

. Liverpool fans don’t have him as a first team starter in a game they had to win. Xhaka’s fan alienating antics aside, I think their respective roles and importance are quite similar

I've not basically agreed with you at all. He was a nailed on starter until he started missing chunks with injuries, and now they manage his game time because he can't last 90 minutes twice a week.
Last season he started 31 games in the Premier League, and the ones he didn't were against us at their place, and then 3 games against ****e teams in relegation battles.

Given they just missed the title, quite a lot of those games he started were must wins.

They rotate him out more in Europe, because they have a different tactical set up in a number of those games, and he struggles to play twice a week now.

 

[Trilly]

I think both Mikel and Edu come across as inexperienced and a bit out of their depth when it comes to some essential management tasks.

Edu seems a decent bloke but he would have a tough time bartering with an importer of damaged goods on the flea market. The guy has a face of a person ready to be scammed.

Arteta is trying to impose himself as an authoritarian but I think he comes across as pretty insecure which is understandable considering the scope of the job and it being his first. Looking from that angle, you got to respect the bravery and Machiavelism... kind of.

The good thing is that after this summer you don't have any more of these pay-to-leave guys and both Edu and Arteta seem to be learning on the job and you can actually see some progress. That's the positive.

Watching it you forget that it’s actually their second full season in charge. Honestly I wonder what things were like during their first.

 

[MikeVinna]

Stopped watching after ep3 because I really didn’t want to relive all the heartbreak of that season. But somehow I convinced myself to put ep4 on today which ends with our home defeat against Man City. Still hurts we lost that one. We were all over them and then the Xhaka penalty and Gabriel red happened. Both very soft.

 

[DJ_Markstar]

As long as you accept that you can’t get any Pizza topping you like you’ll be ok.

How about pineapple