Arsène Wenger: 20 Years and Counting

[glaveror]

No offense mate,but that opening post almost looks like something pulled from RAWK,at least to me.
Oh and why are people constantly berating FA Cup around here? The oldest football competition with amazing tradition and people go around dismissing it like it's nothing,amazing actually.

 

[MrBump]

I have always been in the pro Wenger camp but it's been waining over the last few. Unless he can pull a few rabbits outa the hat before sept3 I will be falling over the other side.

I'm just finding the whole club and everyone involved to be full of arrogance and I'm frequently asking myself if I want to love a club that obviously doesn't give a fck what the average supporter feels.

AFC is destined to be a showpiece club for the people traveling through London. Constantly focussing on new fans at the same time forgetting the loyal ones.

 

[outlaw_member]

The reality is that Wenger hasn't really changed all that much from the glory days. The only significant difference is that his gambles, something he is incredibly fond of, are just not paying off with the same frequency as they did in the past.

The difference is that when he gambled on an injury prone Marc Overmars in 1997, it paid off with the Dutchman being instrumental to the Double. A similar move saw him do likewise with Tomas Rosicky in 2006, but this time the results were not repeated. Similarly, when he downgraded Ian Wright and replaced him with the young Nicolas Anelka, it proved to be a masterstroke, a move which we have since seen time and time again over the years. Again, the success of Anelka hasn't really ever repeated again by another youngster who was tasked with replacing a key player.

Likewise, his trademark move of selling a key CM and not replacing him happened all the way back in 2000 when Petit left for Barcelona, and no replacement arrived. Just like the previous examples, the move did not cost us as much as it did when Vieira, Flamini or even Song left many years later. Simply put, Wenger's methods were the reason behind our success back then, and those very same methods are now the crux of the problem today.

People like to look at all the external factors, money, boardroom, the competition, but the true cause is right in front of everyone.

 

[Penn_]

I really want him to leave, but not before he wins the league and/or CL with us. I am conflicted. Always said I will refrain from totally wanting him out till he gets the chance to spend like the other big clubs. And thought this summer is the start of something beautiful. New dawn, new day, and the sun will be shining on AFC once more. We deserve it after what we went through of tough losses of players and trophies, Wenger deserves it the most. And that's the highest level of appreciation I can give him....not wanting him out before winning a trophy again!

Just another indication of how, for some fans, it's Arsène FC rather than Arsenal FC.

There is nothing wrong with a supporter being able to see just how much Arsène has done for the club and wanted to keep a little faith whether it be misplaced or not. That does not make him any less of an Arsenal.

This whole Arsenal not Arsène thing needs to stop, it's just stupid.

 

[Chappers]

AW is one of the best managers in the world and if we'd have kept the squad over the years we'd have won trophies so whoever calls him average can't be taken seriously. The problem has never been about his qualities as a manager IMO but rather the economic climate in world football changing since the Emirates together with our own financial constraints, making his sound financial views obsolete. I don't think he can justify paying what clubs with unlimited resources forces everyone else to follow and therefore he's the perfect manager for a club that want to maximise income ahead of on-field success.

That doesn't take anything away from what he has achieved as a manager and if we can hold those two notions seperate he has proved how good of a manager he is. Whoever criticize him for helping us overcome an incredible uphill battle in the last 8 years without a single season outside the CL, is underestimating his managerial prowess. He's not perfect but most agree that the problems have always been the lack of ambition shown by the club and himself moreso than his qualities as a manager.

Even the last couple of years when Sp**s have been at their strongest while we've been seeing our 4 best players at the time leave, we've clawed ourselves above and that's a testament to his ability to instill belief in his players.

I don't expect many to agree but as a manager he has what it takes but unfortunately he's not amibtious and ruthless enough to demand the board to make funds available. That's why the thread "do AW has got what it takes" should be rephrased because as a manager he's undoubtedly one of the best, but he gets the results our board set out to achieve. That unfortunately is not winning titles but making as much money as possible.

I still believe that we need to change if he refuses to spend what we can because there isn't a manager good enough to compete in a league with so many "rich" and ambitious clubs without showing the same ambition. In Germany and Spain only two teams fight for the league but in England 5 teams excluding Arsenal have the resources to compete for trophies. We have done bare minimum so far and I hoped it was while awaiting this summer but so far that hasn't been the case.

With the resources we now have we don't need a prudent world class manager who can do more with less but an ambitious one who will put pressure on the board and improve the squad enough to make us title challengers. In a dream world that would be a manager as good as AW but with the ambition of other top managers. I still am grateful for AW though because not many other managers would put the club ahead of personal glory and that's exactly what we needed to stay afloat.

 

[Cruisio]

I really want him to leave, but not before he wins the league and/or CL with us. I am conflicted. Always said I will refrain from totally wanting him out till he gets the chance to spend like the other big clubs. And thought this summer is the start of something beautiful. New dawn, new day, and the sun will be shining on AFC once more. We deserve it after what we went through of tough losses of players and trophies, Wenger deserves it the most. And that's the highest level of appreciation I can give him....not wanting him out before winning a trophy again!

Just another indication of how, for some fans, it's Arsène FC rather than Arsenal FC.

There is nothing wrong with a supporter being able to see just how much Arsène has done for the club and wanted to keep a little faith whether it be misplaced or not. That does not make him any less of an Arsenal.

This whole Arsenal not Arsène thing needs to stop, it's just stupid.

Depends really, do you believe Wenger has done the absolute best that is possible by this club recently or over the past few years?

 

[DJ_Markstar]

Dear AW, Thank you for the Invincible's and the double winning sides. Along with the transition from Highbury to the Emirates. Now do one last thing and retire soon so we can move on and shape the club into a modern power house.

We'd need a new board for that, too.

 

[DJ_Markstar]

Meaning he's now been unsuccessful for us for nearly as long as he was successful for us! Yes, it's been difficult to win the league against the likes of Chelsea and City, but the money excuse doesn't hide the losses to Birmingham, or Bradford, or Blackburn or the many failings against lesser sides in the league. People need to get their head around the fact that one day he WILL leave, it just should have been done a few years ago

Come on mate, surely you can see the fault in this reasoning.

 

[Cruisio]

How exactly?

I've said it before, at certain times during the season and seasons previous you cannot tell me they haven't performed below their capabilities far too often against teams they should beat

We've all discussed our inability to start games well, only picking up our game when we're losing (which then transpires into a bigger problem of only ever picking up our game when we're out of all competitions), being tactically rigid without having the players that suit the system. We've got many many issues with have nothing to do with the financial constraints

Also, a new board to become a modern day super club? Maybe. But to win a trophy again? No

 

[Penn_]

Depends really, do you believe Wenger has done the absolute best that is possible by this club recently or over the past few years?

Depends really whether he has been give money before to replace gaps in the team and that is something only Wenger himself will be able to tell us. He has had his fair share of bad luck with leg breaks and players he grew abandoning him when we looked to be on the verge of success.

The FA/League Cup should of been taken alot more seriously and probably would of caused less of atmosphere that currently hangs between supporters but I can't blame him for the tittle when you look at how much money has been spent.

 

[tap-in]

I have always appreciated Wenger, I may have had the odd moan about an odd choice of sub etc but generally I still rate him very highly. We still have 2 weeks to sign players, I dont think we will sign the big name CF everyone is craving but I do think we will sign some quality players that will improve the squad.

In terms of silver, what clubs have won silver in the past 8 seasons? Apart from Swansea they have all been clubs with huge financial power that we could not compete with. I do believe this will start to change now and with 2 or 3 top quality additions we can definitely compete this season.

Bring it on!

I posted the above 1 min before kick off, my mind hasn't changed too much but it does highlight how important the next 2 weeks are. 2 or 3 top players and I will continue to back him, excuses and I will not.

What really pissed me off today, apart from obviously losing, is that Moyes has been in the job 2 months, and he gets a great away win, emphatic. So much for people thinking the new managers will need time to settle.

Sort it out Wenger, please!

 

[law90026]

Depends really, do you believe Wenger has done the absolute best that is possible by this club recently or over the past few years?

Depends really whether he has been give money before to replace gaps in the team and that is something only Wenger himself will be able to tell us. He has had his fair share of bad luck with leg breaks and players he grew abandoning him when we looked to be on the verge of success.

The FA/League Cup should of been taken alot more seriously and probably would of caused less of atmosphere that currently hangs between supporters but I can't blame him for the tittle when you look at how much money has been spent.

We couldn't beat Bradford City.

 

[Penn_]

Depends really whether he has been give money before to replace gaps in the team and that is something only Wenger himself will be able to tell us. He has had his fair share of bad luck with leg breaks and players he grew abandoning him when we looked to be on the verge of success.

The FA/League Cup should of been taken alot more seriously and probably would of caused less of atmosphere that currently hangs between supporters but I can't blame him for the tittle when you look at how much money has been spent.

We couldn't beat Bradford City.

Your point being?

 

[law90026]

Depends really whether he has been give money before to replace gaps in the team and that is something only Wenger himself will be able to tell us. He has had his fair share of bad luck with leg breaks and players he grew abandoning him when we looked to be on the verge of success.

The FA/League Cup should of been taken alot more seriously and probably would of caused less of atmosphere that currently hangs between supporters but I can't blame him for the tittle when you look at how much money has been spent.

We couldn't beat Bradford City.

Your point being?

For all the talk about how hamstrung Wenger has been, he couldn't put out a side that was able to beat Bradford City last season. And there have been other occasions when the team has just failed against lesser opposition.

 

[Kroket]

Yeah I appreciate the good times, now get out

 

[Wrighty4eva]

Ill start appreciating wenger when he starts appreciating the fans , and doing whats right like spending some of that money from the hiked up tickets at the emirates on some quality squad additions .....

 

[bingobob]

Trophies matter a great deal, if you don't think they do you have never been to a trophy parade and joined in the celebrations. Showing up with no tension, no antagonism, just the idea of a party and nothing else on your mind, it is the pinnacle of a season, it matters, and if it doesn't matter for that reason then it matters to get the monkey of 8 seasons off our back. We need to get rid of that a Carling Cup, no matter how much you or anyone belittles it, does that. It gives the fans a great day out, it is a trophy and believe me you will celebrate it.

Arsène has given us a lot I don't think anyone anywhere will ever deny that but nothing is forever, nothing is bigger than the club. People believe what Wenger espouses about the Champions League being the pinnacle, I would swap that for a run in the Europa League and winning it (remember how gutted you were after the UEFA cup final, or if you can remember back as far as the Cup Winners Cup final), or going to the F.A cup final and winning it. Winning cups and leagues is what football is all about dismiss the F.A cup and the League Cup at your peril because the end result is the current stagnation we have seen where we aren't good enough for the league, we aren't good enough for the CL and it leaves us stuck in this limbo where we dismiss the cups because we think we are too big but yet aren't big enough to win anything bigger and its cost us, its cost us players, its cost us our reputation, and it causes me and others no end of arguments when discussing football.

If you cannot win the league the minimum should be a cup not qualification for the Champions League unless you are good enough to win it which history has shown us we are not.

 

[jay-d]

Lol @ this thread. Wenger is finished as a top flight manager. Totally irresponsible and negligent regarding our club. Get out now before you are hated rather than remembered for the great manager you WERE. Football has moved on and you can't.

 

[redwhiteAustrian]

I just take this Thread as an ill-timed joke.

 

[MDGoonah41]

great thread. would read again.