Arsène Wenger: Same Old Class

[RUS arsenal]

Ferguson said RVP was offered more at City as did Wenger. Wenger said City offered him 300K pw. So it's disingenuous to say he left for money. He may have got more at United but he got offered substantially more at City. He went to where he thought he was more likely to win trophies and in fairness he was proven right.

He could've won trophies at a club which was not Arsenal's most hated direct rival...

Plus I'm sure it was a combination of trophies and money and not the former exclusively.

Forget the fact that if it was any other club of our stature, RvP would've been long gone and trying to resurrect his career with some mid-table club or at a lesser European league. By the time he proved himself again, he would've been past it to make an impact at a top club.

 

[Makingtrax]

You are just speculating.

I'm not speculating at all.

I just posted that most of the players that left Arsenal in recent years left to earn more money. I'm also saying that's what professional footballers do.

People jumped in and said some went for trophies. That may well be true. But that is speculation. The money aspect is fact.

Nothing else to say on this.

 

[Makingtrax]

What's that got to do with it?

I agreed with your post and added a bit about Mourinho being lucky enough to get another job after the sacking you mentioned. Is that somehow not relevant?

 

[carlito'sway]

I think the only real example of a player leaving us for money was Ashley Cole ans that's because he thought he had a verbal agreement for a higher wage with us.

All the others left for trophies and I think it's an uniformed easy cope out to say they left for money. It's the political equivalent of saying immigrants are at fault for everything.

It's been well documented Man City offered Van Persie more money than United yet he still opted for United. Fabregas waived a four million pound loyalty bonus and less well documented reportedly took a pay cut to join Barcelona.

IIRC, Van Persie wages at Utd were much higher than anything we could have offered him. Let's be honest, all of the guys who left Arsenal did it for a combination of money and ambition.
The only exception was Cesc who waived a loyalty bonus but still want to Barca an obviously bigger and more ambitious club than AFC.

 

[OG J0E]

I agreed with your post and added a bit about Mourinho being lucky enough to get another job after the sacking you mentioned. Is that somehow not relevant?

If you're saying that Utd's way of dealing with failure is questionable because they hired a guy who'd failed last season as well, then you may be right. Going to take time to tell though, and so far they're performing better than under van Gaal.

 

[Jury]

What's this about football managers being 'lucky enough' to get another job because they were sacked from their last job? Should we be ever indebted to Nagoya Grampus 8 for trusting Wenger after he got sacked from Monaco?

 

[Jury]

True, but the sacked Chelsea manager was rewarded with a plum job of £10 million a year with a £15 million bonus thrown in for CL silverware. Not bad for taking the second most expensive squad in the league almost down to the relegation zone.

One **** season doesn't make a **** manager ffs. If it did, you'd have to torch your shrine to Wenger. About 10 times.

 

[Makingtrax]

One **** season doesn't make a **** manager ffs. If it did, you'd have to torch your shrine to Wenger. About 10 times.

You'll have to refresh my memory of when Wenger last took a squad as good as that outside the top four, let alone down to the depths Chesea plummeted to

Edit: Wenger certainly never had a squad worth that much.

 

[Jury]

You'll have to refresh my memory of when Wenger last took a squad as good as that outside the top four, let alone down to the depths Chesea plummeted to

Edit: Wenger certainly never had a squad worth that much.

Mate, 5th... 15th... If things go wrong for a season, they go wrong. I wouldn't have wanted Wenger sacked if, in his pomp, we had an absolute disaster of a season. If you can see the how's and whys, it's easier to remain confident and regroup.

I wouldn't have hired Mourinho because I think he's done and is going through the motions, but mostly because he's a ****.

 

[rich 1990]

You'll have to refresh my memory of when Wenger last took a squad as good as that outside the top four, let alone down to the depths Chesea plummeted to

Edit: Wenger certainly never had a squad worth that much.

But when did he last take a squad that good to win a league? Dunno why you're using other clubs predicaments to justify Wenger's shortcomings.

 

[Makingtrax]

I wouldn't have hired Mourinho because I think he's done and is going through the motions, but mostly because he's a ****.

I nearly wrote, "That's easy for you you to say because Wenger never had an absolute disaster of a season". And then I thought 'f*** it', had enough of this ground hog day Wenger ping pong.So I highlighted the part of your post above I agreed with.

Let's just enjoy the matches. Looking at the Swansea thread there seems to be a bit of excitement returning.

 

[Makingtrax]

But when did he last take a squad that good to win a league? Dunno why you're using other clubs predicaments to justify Wenger's shortcomings.

F***ing, f***, f*** . . . . I'm not replying.

 

[Mark Tobias]

Surely the last four or five posts highlight Wenger's mediocrity. Never an abysmal failure but seldom on top either.

 

[Makingtrax]

Surely the last four or five posts highlight Wenger's mediocrity. Never an abysmal failure but seldom on top either.

Check the definition of mediocre in dictionationary mate, it means 'middling' or in football terms 'mid-table'.

 

[Tir Na Nog]

At least I'll know not to come on here in 4/5 weeks when there's another international break.

 

[Jury]

Wenger has consistently finished mid table out of the clubs that are competitive. 3rd and 4th in a 7 team league, and that's being generous.

 

[Jury]

Let's just enjoy the matches. Looking at the Swansea thread there seems to be a bit of excitement returning.

We're always excited in early October, and it's never a bad thing. Can't escape that feeling of Groundhog Day though.

 

[Trilly]

You can look at it two ways: In the three years since the financial shackles were lifted we've won two trophies and shown constant improvement in league position. We've also signed 1-3 world class players (depending on your view), two players with world class potential and on paper have one of the best squads in the league and Europe. All of that in three years is impressive.

On the other hand we seem to have a glass ceiling that prevents us from even challenging for the title. We have a manager who makes the most obvious mistakes year on year (which we inevitably get punished for) and last season went into new found territory by actually blaming the fans for his failings. We see the same mental fragility from the squad every year and have unacceptably failed to make it past the R16 in the CL for the past 356464 years.

It's crazy how those two paragraphs describe the same squad and manager. I'm convinced that any good manager (Koeman for example) could come in and improve Arsenal but taking that risk is something I couldn't do. I'm willing to stick with his consistency but I also think we won't be winning a PL/CL under him.

One year rolling contracts while making moves for an elite manager, that's what I would do.

 

[bingobob]

IIRC, Van Persie wages at Utd were much higher than anything we could have offered him. Let's be honest, all of the guys who left Arsenal did it for a combination of money and ambition.
The only exception was Cesc who waived a loyalty bonus but still want to Barca an obviously bigger and more ambitious club than AFC.

That doesn't mean he just left for money. At the time it was documented he said he would stay with us after we signed Cazorla and Podolski but he burnt his bridges with that statement.

He could've won trophies at a club which was not Arsenal's most hated direct rival...

Plus I'm sure it was a combination of trophies and money and not the former exclusively.

Forget the fact that if it was any other club of our stature, RvP would've been long gone and trying to resurrect his career with some mid-table club or at a lesser European league. By the time he proved himself again, he would've been past it to make an impact at a top club.

Where else was he to go? The only other serious offer was Juventus and RVP rightly viewed the Italian league as a step down. He could have gone to Celtic and won trophy after trophy but again that wouldn't have offered the prestige he was wanting. So I fail to see, after all the offers were on the table, were else he could have gone. If it was purely money it would have been City. They also offer a good chance of success. He went to United for less money than he had on the table but in his view a better chance of success at the highest level.

That's my take. RVP, Fabregas and Nasri didn't leave for money they left for success.

 

[carlito'sway]

That doesn't mean he just left for money. At the time it was documented he said he would stay with us after we signed Cazorla and Podolski but he burnt his bridges with that statement.


Where else was he to go? The only other serious offer was Juventus and RVP rightly viewed the Italian league as a step down. He could have gone to Celtic and won trophy after trophy but again that wouldn't have offered the prestige he was wanting. So I fail to see, after all the offers were on the table, were else he could have gone. If it was purely money it would have been City. They also offer a good chance of success. He went to United for less money than he had on the table but in his view a better chance of success at the highest level.

That's my take. RVP, Fabregas and Nasri didn't leave for money they left for success.

You need to pick on .... Either, "that does not mean he left just for money" or "they didn't leave for money, they left for success".

Let me help here, if you want to phrase it that way, they left for both money and ambition, as I mentioned in an earlier post. I am willing to bet my mortgage that 99% of players will not just leave for an hypothetical success if not tied to some serious financial gains.