OFFICIAL Ben White

Worse Deal?

  • Ben White for £50m

  • Harry Maguire for £80m


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dashsnow17

Sounds Like Hairspray
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Yeah, like I think ben White might actually be a good signing, and yeah of course we're going to bring in a midfielder BUT we need to probably bring in 2-3 midfielders of quality, if we lose ESR weve no attacking midfielder, if we lose Partey we have to play Elneny. So I think everyone would jsut like to see a bit more movement in other positions.

Sure, sure, but like, no one else has signed anyone either. Plenty of time to freak out later. For now i'm just quite interested in guessing what Arteta wants, cos you go into a summer talking about Bissouma, Buendia and Aarons and absolutely none of those guys actually come here lol. We have no clue what the plan is.
 

Goonger

Well-Known Member
Does Gabriel worry anyone else? He makes me nervous anytime he has to do something. Don't get me wrong, there have been flashes of a dominant centre back, but i always feel like he'll cost us a goal. I'm not sure that'll ever change for him either, its in his personality, everything he does is done at 100mph, lacks calmness and composure.

You do get that feeling sometimes. Perhaps that's where White can come in & help, where he is good is that he's calm, good on the ball, so the build up from the back should improve.

It can't be easy to look calm & assured in a new team when you have Leno, Holding & Bellerin & Xhaka surrounding you fecking up playing out from the back constantly. Would be enough to make anyone nervous.

You've got to say Onana, White, new right back & whoever we pick up in central midfield should be a fair upgrade in terms of playing out from the back.
 

HairSprayGooners

My brother posted it ⏩
Sure, sure, but like, no one else has signed anyone either. Plenty of time to freak out later. For now i'm just quite interested in guessing what Arteta wants, cos you go into a summer talking about Bissouma, Buendia and Aarons and absolutely none of those guys actually come here lol. We have no clue what the plan is.

We shouldn't know what the plan is really. I am very happy that Orny is yet to say we have to sell to buy. In fact he's insinuating the complete opposite. Saying a 40-50M fee for a CB is like water off a ducks back.
 

GunnerBP

Well-Known Member
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Based on positions White has played over the past two seasons, I think it is kind of misleading to pigeonhole him as a CB instead of emphasizing his versatility.

At Leeds he primarily played as the CB in a back three, but he also played midfield and during practice he always practiced with the midfielders. When Kalvin Phillips was suspended or injured, White moved up into midfield.

This season at Brighton, he primarily played RCB in a back three, and when they played a back four he played mostly at RB. When TAA got injured for England, Southgate called up White to replace him.

White definitely has the physique of a CB and can play the position, but he seems more than capable of playing other positions too. I don't think he's at the level of Carles Puyol or Sergio Ramos, but both of them started their careers at RB before transitioning to CB. They both have the size of a CB, but the pace and technical ability to play RB. White appears to be in a similar mold.

If we sign White it may mean the end of Saliba or we may end up selling Holding, but it also possible that we see him line up at RB or DM. He's only 23, so a season or two at RB or DM before playing exclusively at CB would make sense.
 

yousif_arsenal

King of Twitter Rumours
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Get him in and let him compete with Gabriel and Saliba not only building good competition but we'll have 3 cb who have an elite potential. Holding was close to leave last season so you don't rule this out even if he signed new contract
 

Rimaal

Questionable Taste
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No doubt we have a lot of issues. But look at Liverpool or City or United or Chelsea they've all spent big money on their defence. VVD, Allison, Dias is City's record signing (before looking at full backs), Maguire and Awb, Chilwell and Mendy and they've gave Silva a massive wage and they've all been the better for it.

Understandably then it might be a pressing issue because if you cant get the ball from defence the way you like the attack suffers. And if you can't set the defence up to defend the way you want you have to compensate elsewhere.
Just see Liverpool this season who suffered immensely in the pressing and attacking play. It may not be sexy or glamorous but if you lack the foundations the rest suffer.

I'm tired of this argument, no one said defence isn't important, but our defence isn't the problem our midfield is a problem. Football matches are won and lost in midfield, and we don't have one. Priority is midfield, surely. Then in defence it's the wings not the centre that needs upgrading, we need RBs & LBs. That's 4-5 player right there. You'll see our CB players improve simply by improving the structure in front of them and to their sides. They'll be able to do their jobs much more efficiently and confidently.

We have issues in our squad, defence is the least of them.

Next year there's no Euro footy, so we can't support a big squad. We need to pick the right players for the right positions if we're gonna make a run for the league. We need to be surgical. And all these clubs you mentioned built their core from the front working their way back over several windows.

The only reason we're linked to so many CBs is because we a have a Moyes protege who thinks he's Pep as our manager. So let's not imagine for one minute that if White gets here he'll be playing Bielsa football. He won't, he'll play Moypeta footy.
 
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Monstar-Gunn4r

Well-Known Member
Sure, sure, but like, no one else has signed anyone either. Plenty of time to freak out later. For now i'm just quite interested in guessing what Arteta wants, cos you go into a summer talking about Bissouma, Buendia and Aarons and absolutely none of those guys actually come here lol. We have no clue what the plan is.
I think its just our track record has been so poor I have a tough time having much faith in the plan atm, the fact we bid for Beundia but then let him go isnt filling me with much confidence either.

I think Leicester and Liverpool have already made moves to improve but i havent been paying too much attention, and while I agree mostly to your point we just have so so much work to do
 

Mitch

Bellerin Upgrade Advocate
Forget the money though, none of our CBs play for their country's senior team, surely that's a good marker of quality and/or experience.

It's hardly a coincidence that we only have 4 players at the Euros this year (one of whom could be sold very soon) at the same time as we've had consecutive 8th place finishes, it generally indicates the quality of the squad isn't what it used to be.

I rather have my CB be consistent and produce good peformance after good peformance for the club and not be selected by the half wit England manager rather than (B) have my CB be extremely error prone, have over half of club fan base calling for him to be dropped for half the season due to his poor peformances and then be selected by England.

Got to go peformances rather than media reputation.
 
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bingobob

A-M’s Resident Hunskelper
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I'm tired of this argument, no one said defence isn't important, but our defence isn't the problem our midfield is a problem. Football matches are won and lost in midfield, and we don't have one. Priority is midfield, surely. Then in defence it's the wings not the centre that needs upgrading, we need RBs & LBs. That's 4-5 player right there. You'll see our CB players improve simply by improving the structure in front of them and to their sides. They'll be able to do their jobs much more efficiently and confidently.

We have issues in our squad, defence is the least of them.

Next year there's no Euro footy, so we can't support a big squad. We need to pick the right players for the right positions if we're gonna make a run for the league. We need to be surgical. And all these clubs you mentioned built their core from the front working their way back over several windows.

The only reason we're linked to so many CBs is because we a have a Moyes protege who thinks he's Pep as our manager. So let's not imagine for one minute that if White gets here he'll be playing Bielsa football. He won't, he'll play Moypeta footy.
We shall see but respectfully I disagree.
 

Garrincha

Wilf Zaha Aficionado
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We shouldn't know what the plan is really. I am very happy that Orny is yet to say we have to sell to buy. In fact he's insinuating the complete opposite. Saying a 40-50M fee for a CB is like water off a ducks back.
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Rasmi

Well-Known Member
Based on positions White has played over the past two seasons, I think it is kind of misleading to pigeonhole him as a CB instead of emphasizing his versatility.

At Leeds he primarily played as the CB in a back three, but he also played midfield and during practice he always practiced with the midfielders. When Kalvin Phillips was suspended or injured, White moved up into midfield.

This season at Brighton, he primarily played RCB in a back three, and when they played a back four he played mostly at RB. When TAA got injured for England, Southgate called up White to replace him.

White definitely has the physique of a CB and can play the position, but he seems more than capable of playing other positions too. I don't think he's at the level of Carles Puyol or Sergio Ramos, but both of them started their careers at RB before transitioning to CB. They both have the size of a CB, but the pace and technical ability to play RB. White appears to be in a similar mold.

If we sign White it may mean the end of Saliba or we may end up selling Holding, but it also possible that we see him line up at RB or DM. He's only 23, so a season or two at RB or DM before playing exclusively at CB would make sense.
we seen with AMN, chambers and Dier for example versatility is more of a curse than blessing as you keep moving around and never fully develop in one position, if he is a cb who can play rb or vice versa. Thats Chambers role in the team. Ben white is rumoured to cost what Kounde will cost while one is seen as one of Europes elite young defenders. Ben white aint even known outside of England
 

SingmeasongSong

Right Sometimes
Saliba and White could play together. The idea you need a Left and right footed pair is nonsense. Dias and Stones are both right footed. VVD and Gomez are both right footed.

Go into next season with White Saliba Gabriel Mari/Holding

It's not the theory that's the issue here, it's the past and likely present with Arteta and how he's going to treat Saliba and other youngsters.
 

Rasmi

Well-Known Member
Better in the air comes up again, I keep saying White is small for a CB.
He lost more areal duels last season than he won. 49 won 50 lost, So he is -1. Gabriel in this department is +16 and Holding is +12. I have looked for about 30 PL CBs so far and i have not found a single one who has lost more areal duels than they won. so if we replace Holding with a guy who is 2 inches shorter and significantly worse in the air, but gain a better passer of the ball. Does our defence become better?Not that our defence is great, but we did have statistically 3rd best performing defence last season
 

KJSB97

Active Member
CB certainly isn't a pressing issue as I feel Holding/Mari/Gabriel were fine defensively last season. However, I can recall numerous occasions where when playing out from the back, we'd have an extended short pass sequence between the back four which would ultimately end with our CB's in wide positions attempting long balls that would reach no one. This was ultimately the downfall to our attacking play throughout the season (albeit we improved after Christmas with ESR & Ødegaard) as Arteta would persist with the playing out from the back even though our CB's lacked the ability to progress the ball through the centre and more often than not relied on Tierney in wide areas.

Playing out from the back starts with the GK & CB's and relies on the players being comfortable enough to progress through the centre of the pitch either by committing a man and beating the press or playing a forward pass through the lines. Whilst 40-50m could probably be better spent elsewhere, White does have the qualities on the ball which I feel would help in improving our transition from the GK to attack. If we also sign Onana (who seems assured on the ball), we'd have much better outlets on the ball who would look to be more incisive in getting the ball up the pitch.

Taking all of that into account, I feel conflicted on this transfer as it could end up utilising money we could spend on improving our midfield. On the other hand, I can see the benefit to our overall play if we were to sign a player with White's profile. It's clear that Arteta likes a choreographed routine from the defence to attack and I believe with Onana-White-Partey, you create a spine of players who have the bravery and ability to execute that routine - no more square pegs in round holes!
 
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