Bukayo Saka: Return of the Sak

[db10_therza]

I agree, I was just wondering if there were numbers to back it.

Recovery sprints is the one that matters really. No one cares if he is making tackles and blocks high up the pitch thats the job of EVERY winger. It's if he's being asked to make more recovery sprints than usual for an attacker that we can start to raise eyebrows.

I haven't seen the stats fyi. Given we control possession in a lot of games I don't actually know if it will be that high.

The tactical deficit he plays under is the strict requirement for him to stay wide where it's harder for him to influence the game. Contrast with Salah who has much more positional freedom. This is the bigger issue than the tracking back stuff for me. My gut says his recovery sprints might even be less than average for wingers just because we dominate possession in most games.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

See this could be a result of him being particularly good at tackles and blocks, we do press high and he’s particularly strong and good defensively for a winger. It is evidence though.

I’d be more interested in any stats that show he’s covering more distance, sprinting more, or spending more time in our defensive third.

This is an excellent point.

I think we tend to assume that players having strong defensive orientated numbers means they are spending a lot of time in the defensive third. That's not what these stats prove though.

Though the eye test does tell me that Saka spends quite a bit more time on defensive third duties than the average winger.

What would be interesting would be to compare recovery sprints / general distance covered etc with Martinelli or whoever is on the left wing.

 

[HattoriHanzo]

I do think Arteta sacrifices a bit of our attack to aid our defence but based on the debate in the Ethan thread is there any statistical evidence that Saka is tracking back too much?

Honestly based on the eye test I can’t say I’ve noticed it like I have with someone like Nelli.

In Tifo podcast few weeks ago they have shown the table for EPL clubs how much they track back.
In general table Arsenal wasn't at the top, it was Newcastle at the top and Liverpool higher than Arsenal, therefore they track back more.
But when they gave table of tracking back per position (defenders, midfielders and forwards), it was different.

Liverpool midfielders track back much more than Arsenal's.
But Arsenal forwards track back much more than Liverpool's and that's the problem.
If Saka has to track back a lot, he is close to opponent's goal less than he should be, therefore less chance he will score or assist. And more chance that he will be injured (what we are witnessing right now).
Same can be said about Havertz.
This is Arteta's mistake, he should give Saka certain freedom not to track back so much, because he is our best player.
Salah doesn't have to track back so much, he stays closer to opponent's goal, therefore he scores a lot.


I have posted that particular Tifo podcast, probably in Arteta's thread because these facts about tracking back intrigued me.

 

[EmeryCouldnt]

The owners are billionaires. Are you one of those that support greedy billionaires over the athletes that are bringing revenue to the team? Saka has been the best thing to happen to Arsenal since 2005 lol.

The amount of wealth the owners have is irrelevant with FFP. The club has to operate within parameters of their finances, not the Kroenkes’. This isn’t 2012 anymore.

 

[Dennis_Bergkamp_10]

 

[Yousif Arsenal]

Seem he'll be on bench against Fulham. Knowing Mikel he'll start him

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

You could tell by the way that Arteta was joking around in the post match press conference, pretending to run off when asked about it that Saka's return was imminent.

No way he would have behaved like that if Saka wasn't very close.

I fully expect him to be in the next squad, on the bench.

 

[Gooner Zig]

You could tell by the way that Arteta was joking around in the post match press conference, pretending to run off when asked about it that Saka's return was imminent.

No way he would have behaved like that if Saka wasn't very close.

I fully expect him to be in the next squad, on the bench.

Agree

 

[Tnegs]

2 more games left before the RM tie. Hopefully he gets some game time by then and is ruled fit to start that one.

 

[Batman]

2 more games left before the RM tie. Hopefully he gets some game time by then and is ruled fit to start that one.

Hopefully the club priortizes his long-term health rather than rushing him back to play against a Madrid team we have about a 3% chance of getting past.

 

[Tnegs]

Hopefully the club priortizes his long-term health rather than rushing him back to play against a Madrid team we have about a 3% chance of getting past.

If he’s fit I’m sure he will be pushing for a start. A QF against Madrid is where the best players want to be.

 

[Batman]

If he’s fit I’m sure he will be pushing for a start. A QF against Madrid is where the best players want to be.

Every player should be pushing to start but the medical and coaching staff have got a duty to look after the player's welfare and that means not pushing them too much too quickly.

 

[Tnegs]

Every player should be pushing to start but the medical and coaching staff have got a duty to look after the player's welfare and that means not pushing them too much too quickly.

We are saying the same thing here. He should play if he’s fit. I hope he is.

 

[Rasmi]

Seem he'll be on bench against Fulham. Knowing Mikel he'll start him

He will play 90 minutes. Maybe 87 if we are up by 3

 

[Red London]

Tough one. Don’t really wanna rush him. If we want him to start vs Madrid it would need to be 30m off the bench on the weekend and then 60 before starting the Madrid game. But that seems like it’s a rush.

I don’t trust Arteta with these kind of things, he is so obsessed with winning each game as they come that he sacrifices long term factors. I hope the medical team are very forefront with their opinion here and we make the right decision.

 

[El Duderino]

Hope the club is not rushing him.

 

[El Duderino]

Tough one. Don’t really wanna rush him. If we want him to start vs Madrid it would need to be 30m off the bench on the weekend and then 60 before starting the Madrid game. But that seems like it’s a rush.

I don’t trust Arteta with these kind of things, he is so obsessed with winning each game as they come that he sacrifices long term factors. I hope the medical team are very forefront with their opinion here and we make the right decision.

Season on the verge of being over, I honestly don't see the point to rush him if he's not 100% on his recovery yet.

Not that we should throw the CL game, but I rather finish the PL strongly in second place.

 

[outlawz]

See this could be a result of him being particularly good at tackles and blocks, we do press high and he’s particularly strong and good defensively for a winger. It is evidence though.

I’d be more interested in any stats that show he’s covering more distance, sprinting more, or spending more time in our defensive third.

The stats @A_G shared is a clear example of people looking at stats and having no understanding about how we actually play. You can forgive a neutral for drawing inaccurate conclusions but for Arsenal fans watching its unforgivable. We have the best press in the league and that's because our front 4 are superb at dispossessing opposition defenders of the ball. As such, it is going to result in higher tackles and interceptions relative to peers because we're so effective at it. We go through countless games where we camp entirely in the opponents half and both press and counter press incredibly well to suffocate the opponent.

The more pertinent stats would be what you've mentioned. Tackles and interceptions doesn't tell you a lot. A Saka tackle next to our penalty area is completely different to a Saka tackle in the opponents area, and we all know most of his tackles are the latter.

It's obviously a problem with the system when all the attackers are injured cause of all the running the have to do covering for players paid to control the game in the midfield or to defend, it's not coincidence that Saka, Havertz and Martinelli all suffered hamstring injuries.

Stretched to the limit: why hamstring fails are curse of the Premier League

Academics and medics are working to understand why hamstring injuries are keeping players sidelined for longer

www.theguardian.com

There were 100 hamstring injuries this season. Someone did a comparison and Tottenham, Chelsea, City and Liverpool all had more hamstring injuries than us. Rodrygo, Mbappe and Vini Jr all had hamstring injuries this season.

There isn't a problem with the system.

Not directed at you, but people are way too obsessed with victimising Saka. My guy's making millies living his best life and his fans are all talking like he's a coal miner being abused with no rights.

 

[Geofranco]

The stats @A_G shared is a clear example of people looking at stats and having no understanding about how we actually play. You can forgive a neutral for drawing inaccurate conclusions but for Arsenal fans watching its unforgivable. We have the best press in the league and that's because our front 4 are superb at dispossessing opposition defenders of the ball. As such, it is going to result in higher tackles and interceptions from them because we're so effective at it. We go through countless games where we camp entirely in the opponents half and both press and counter press incredibly well.

The more pertinent stats would be the stats you've mentioned. Tackles and interceptions tell you nothing. A Saka tackle next to our penalty area is completely different to a Saka tackle in the opponents area, and we all know most of his tackles are the latter.

Stretched to the limit: why hamstring fails are curse of the Premier League

Academics and medics are working to understand why hamstring injuries are keeping players sidelined for longer

www.theguardian.com

There were 100 hamstring injuries this season. Someone did a comparison and Chelsea, City and Liverpool all had more hamstring injuries than us.

There isn't a problem with the system.

Not directed at you, but people are way too obsessed with victimising Saka. My guy's making millies living his best life and his fans are all talking like he's a coal miner being abused with no rights.

He also gets kicked to pieces in most games with no protection from the refs. You add all these things together and it accumulates. People were saying for months that it was only going to be a matter of time before he gets injured. It was the most predictable thing ever.

 

[Geofranco]

Hopefully the club priortizes his long-term health rather than rushing him back to play against a Madrid team we have about a 3% chance of getting past.

If Jesus, Havertz and Saka were healthy and in form, I'd give Arsenal a good chance to beat Real Madrid.