Charlie Patino

MutableEarth

Reiss' Dad
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What’s the definition for generational anyways? To me, I always thought it meant a player or two that define a generation. Like Messi, Ronaldo, Ronaldinho, R9, Van Basten, Maradonna, Pele etc. But now any teenager that plays for a top 6 club is considered a generational talent ffs.
Words lose their relevance once they're overused in hyperbole.
 

RunTheTrap

Nobody laughs on my "jokes" 😫
Tbf, Patino and Azeez look a pair of phenomenal young talents.

How would Arsenal get them in midfield together? They both look like they want the same position though; that single pivot in a 4-3-3 looks tailored made for them. Maybe one of them develops into an 8. I don’t know yet but I hope it doesn’t cause any problems and we end up losing one of them.
What are your thoughts @MutableEarth ?
 

RunTheTrap

Nobody laughs on my "jokes" 😫
Words lose their relevance once they're overused in hyperbole.
One day, I’ll make a thread asking all the posters what their definitions are of terms like “world class”, “elite”, “generational”, “top class” etc because it confuses the hell out of me.
 

Macho

Has Trust Issues With Processes
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One day, I’ll make a thread asking all the posters what their definitions are of terms like “world class”, “elite”, “generational”, “top class” etc because it confuses the hell out of me.

World class = would get into any team in the world. Different criteria for different people, probably the main source of confusion as it’s impossible to unanimously agree on the criteria.

Generational talent = I’ve seen this used in two ways - either a stand out player in their age group or era (e.g Mbappe, David Silva or RvP) or someone who has maintained dominance for a prolonged period of time (Messi). I like the first one.

Elite = A bit vague? Typically used to describe a nailed on starter for a CL club in a strong league I think is safe to say? (Di Maria, Rakitic?)

Top Class = a made up term by Wenger and mainly used by Arsenal fans. Typically used to describe a good player that you can’t outright call World class or a borderline World Class player who’s not quite there (has been used describe Ramsey, Wiltord and Giroud by Wenger for example).

Im not the law, this is just my interpretation of it but probably would be cool to discuss.
 

m-due

Well-Known Member
Top Class = a made up term by Wenger and mainly used by Arsenal fans. Typically used to describe a good player that you can’t outright call World class or a borderline World Class player who’s not quite there (has been used describe Ramsey, Wiltord and Giroud by Wenger for example).

I remember he used to describe Iwobi as someone who could become ‘Top Class’ IF he added more goals and assists to his game.
 

MutableEarth

Reiss' Dad
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How would Arsenal get them in midfield together? They both look like they want the same position though; that single pivot in a 4-3-3 looks tailored made for them. Maybe one of them develops into an 8. I don’t know yet but I hope it doesn’t cause any problems and we end up losing one of them.
What are your thoughts @MutableEarth ?
It depends on their development. They're still in very much fledgling phase, both with work to do on their game.

At the moment, I would arguably say that Patino has the more refined game despite being younger, and he appears to more embody the traits of a #6 - can do the dirty work, mobile, takes up slightly better positions defensively, moves the ball well from deep. He's obviously got a LONG way to go, especially in terms of winning duels but his technical quality is really high.

Azeez is more physically developed and the better athlete. He certainly is equal if not better than Patino in terms of pure technique and is an excellent ball-progressing midfielder. However, he very much seems more #8-like than Patino and despite being good at winning duels he isn't as smart defensively and does struggle a bit as the lone #6. He has improved in terms of his intensity in games, most likely due to playing at a more competitive level.

They've played together quite a bit as a pairing and Patino is usually the deeper lying player of the two, although they alternate quite frequently. Due to their technical ability they complement each other pretty well offensively, with Patino picking up and distributing the ball in deeper areas and Azeez driving play further forward just ahead. Defensively they're not quite as strong but I wouldn't expect them to be yet and it's part of their development.

I don't think we should worry too greatly about losing either of them. Both of them are extremely highly rated and the club clearly sees a future with both of them in it, hence their early deals. I'd be more worried about the other scholars and young midfielders! In terms of individual talent, this is probably our overall best intake since '08 and we are certainly going to lose a huge chunk of them IMO. The bulk of them will go on to be very good players IMO.
 

American_Gooner

Not actually American. Unless Di Marzio says so.
Moderator
You think? I mean he is highly rated but this is nothing compared for e.g. Wilshere or some other young folks coming through the academy in AW years.
Feels like Patino's hype has gone into overdrive relatively quickly, at least with Wilshere you heard whispers about him training with the first team as a 15 year old in 07/08 and then we saw him impress at the Emirates Cup.
 

Keplaz

Well-Known Member
When the team isn't playing well and the club is struggling, people will always look for something to cling to. The promise of better days. If Arsenal was in better shape the hype around him would be much less.
 

berric

Established Member
Feels like Patino's hype has gone into overdrive relatively quickly, at least with Wilshere you heard whispers about him training with the first team as a 15 year old in 07/08 and then we saw him impress at the Emirates Cup.

Yeah might be the social mefia effect. I kinda feel his hype is too short to be that immense hype.

Feel Balogun had more pressure when he was supposed to make his debut.
 

Maybe

Established Member
What's the hype really here? He will get some 20 minutes against Wimbledon (if that)? Too much pressure? He's gonna be 18 in a couple of days and for anyone who wants to be an Arsenal player it shouldn't really be too much of an effort to play that type of game being 18. Wenger was doing this stuff all the time, there were just fewer Twitter bums explaining to us how that was wrong at the time
 

American_Gooner

Not actually American. Unless Di Marzio says so.
Moderator
What's the hype really here? He will get some 20 minutes against Wimbledon (if that)? Too much pressure? He's gonna be 18 in a couple of days and for anyone who wants to be an Arsenal player it shouldn't really be too much of an effort to play that type of game being 18. Wenger was doing this stuff all the time, there were just fewer Twitter bums explaining to us how that was wrong at the time
You say this while Arsenal fans are turning on Saka and ESR already :lol:
 

Haphazard

Active Member
The hype is 90% media driven. He isn't going to be some generational talent, bossing u-23 games is very different to the PL.

Besides look at what Arteta has done to the remainder of the squad considering every player has regressed under him do we really want him being instructed by Arteta to just pass the ball to Tierney to create a goal scoring chance?
 

Maybe

Established Member
You say this while Arsenal fans are turning on Saka and ESR already :lol:
That's a lie, nobody is turning against them and they have massive support from all the fans. I will be the first to criticize when they are ****e, but I still see them as valuable members of the squad even at their age. They are first team players now and there is no hiding behind their age anymore, but I think they are enjoying that fact
 

Trilly

Full-Time Respecter Of Women
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Meh, if Barcelona and co haven’t tried to sign him at least once then how good is he really?

We basically had to smuggle Cesc out of Barcelona and wasn’t Wilshere already running rings around midfielders for Bolton at this age.

Sell.
 

field442

Hates Journalists Named James
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I watched the Chelsea U23 game the other day. Without wishing to be guilty of hyping him up he was quite easily the best player on the pitch. He just made the opposition look like Sunday league players. It already looks like that standard of competition is too easy for him. I’d be inclined to have him on the bench for the first team but there seems to be some new thing in football where everything has to be a slow process. Ramsey, Wilshere, Cesc etc were just chucked in because they were deemed good enough.
 
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