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Declan Rice: Cooking Again

outlawz

Active Member
A year of intense pressure just to come away with nothing is devastating. It's a testament to these guys' character that they believed there was a chance until the end. They never gave up.

While the fans were throwing in the towels, these guys were fighting. Criticizing them for showing that kind of passion is incredibly illogical to me - they're doing exactly what fans have always wanted; they ****ing care.
In terms of playing style, strengths and weaknesses, what separates Vieira and Rice?



That's ridiculous :lol: Rice was one of the first names on the team sheet in the best Arsenal team since the Invincibles, there isn't much separating them.

As I said, Vieira has 10x the career and is for that reason well clear of Rice in terms of his legacy etc, but they do very similar things on the pitch. Vieira wasn't an elite playmaker, as much as your nostalgia might want that to be the case, but he was an unreal physical force with amazing defensive instincts and world class off the ball movement. His main attacking threat was his bursting runs from deep.

Again, this isn't a debate worth having anyway as I'm fighting nostalgia and a career's worth of achievements. You're lying to yourself if you don't think they operate on the pitch in very similar ways though.
I grew up watching Vieira and in Rice we have finally replaced him. That's the best compliment you can give the guy.
 

Riou

In The Winchester, Waiting For This To Blow Over

Country: Northern Ireland
It’s as simple as that. We are missing the X factor in this team who will conjure goals out of nothing. We scored loads of goals this season but primarily as a result our system. The problem is when the system is shut down, who can grab a goal like a 30 yard piledriver or with a bit of magic feet in the box?

Henry was the X factor in all the Arsenal teams he played in.

I am so lucky that I got to watch him play as a fan, absolute honour to be made an Arsenal fan by The King!

Imagine kids today, first person that pops in their head about the number 14...is Eddie 😅
 

Kobi

I Know Who You Are
I grew up watching Vieira and in Rice we have finally replaced him. That's the best compliment you can give the guy.

I think stylistically Vieira is the best comparison I can think of, we need to forget left eights and just get him a partner.
Vieira wouldn’t have been a great single pivot that’s why we had Gilberto, Petit or Edu.
Rice played with Soucek at West Ham, even Southgate had him paired with Phillips he isn’t Rodri or Busquets.
We should go back to that 442 with the two false nines, Havertz left space, Ødegaard right space and get a younger Partey/Jorginho to partner Rice, be it Guimaraes or somebody else.
We looked really good when we played like that.
 

Tnegs

Well-Known Member
Vieira was much better than Rice as a footballer just go watch a couple of videos. That first touch replete with tricks and flicks I love Rice but he not close to Vieira as a footballer. Off the ball and as a defensive
midfielder it’s close but overall Vieira belongs in conversations with the likes of Pirlo not Rice. Again no disrespect to Rice who I rate very highly but there are levels to this and Vieira is on the top shelf.
 

Tnegs

Well-Known Member
No one has said otherwise. They're just fairly similar stylistically, what they bring to a team, how they operate etc. Doesn't mean Vieira didn't do it better, he's a legend for a reason.
I wouldn’t say they were that similar especially on the ball. Vieira was skillful and silky with the ball while Rice is more similar to Keane than Vieira. You make it seem like the difference between them is largely down to trophies and nostalgia. I’m telling you as someone who watched most of the games Vieira played for us from the age of 20/21 onwards that he was levels above Rice and the comparisons are never going to be favorable to Rice. Partey at his very best which is about 4-5 games a season is the closest we have come to Vieira as a player.
 

BigPoppaPump

Reeling from Laca & Kos nightmares
Vieira was much better than Rice as a footballer just go watch a couple of videos. That first touch replete with tricks and flicks I love Rice but he not close to Vieira as a footballer. Off the ball and as a defensive
midfielder it’s close but overall Vieira belongs in conversations with the likes of Pirlo not Rice. Again no disrespect to Rice who I rate very highly but there are levels to this and Vieira is on the top shelf.
I didn't want to say anything since everyone thinks I'm a Rice hater but he's nowhere near Vieira's level on the ball. The thing with Rice is he's popular so people praise him for any and everything but come on Vieira would be the best midfielder in the league by far these days.
 

A_G

Rice Rice Baby 🎼🎵
Moderator
IMG_3064.jpeg

John Oliver Reaction GIF by MOODMAN
 

Dokaka

AM's resident closet Arsenal fan
I wouldn’t say they were that similar especially on the ball. Vieira was skillful and silky with the ball while Rice is more similar to Keane than Vieira. You make it seem like the difference between them is largely down to trophies and nostalgia. I’m telling you as someone who watched most of the games Vieira played for us from the age of 20/21 onwards that he was levels above Rice and the comparisons are never going to be favorable to Rice. Partey at his very best which is about 4-5 games a season is the closest we have come to Vieira as a player.

I have said several times now than Vieira is better than Rice :lol: I don't know why people keep trying to convince me when I've already said he's better.

I only made the comparison because if you plugged Vieira out of his prime years and plopped him into the current Arsenal game he'd fit seamlessly into the same role Rice played for the majority of the season because they offer a lot of the same things.

Would Vieira generally offer more? Sure, especially on the ball.
 

Riou

In The Winchester, Waiting For This To Blow Over

Country: Northern Ireland
Very good player and seems a nice guy, tbh.

But English players are the best at reminding you how dim footballers usually are 😅
 

GoonerJay24

Well-Known Member
Like it or not, our best performances this season came with him playing as an 8 imo. I honestly don't believe his ceiling is that high as our lone 6 🤷‍♂️

He could if we bypassed the midfield during build up and played more direct, but that's not our philosophy. As an 8 though, for me he's even less involved in the games. Prefer him as 6 or double pivot.
 

UpTheGunnerz

Vrei sa pleci dar una una iei

Player:
Very good player and seems a nice guy, tbh.

But English players are the best at reminding you how dim footballers usually are 😅

Sure you got your Jack Grealishes out there, but I reckon the average professional footballers IQ is higher than the average joes. The game plays at such a tempo that I think it’s hard to become a top professional without being smart
 

Batman

Head of the Wayne foundation for benching Nketiah

Country: USA

Player:Saliba
Sure you got your Jack Grealishes out there, but I reckon the average professional footballers IQ is higher than the average joes. The game plays at such a tempo that I think it’s hard to become a top professional without being smart
Well what you have to remember is that there are different kinds of intelligence. IQ really measures a fairly narrow ability to recall information in a standardized test environment. Athletic intelligence is almost more in line with what you might expect from a savant.

For example, American football players have a very specific kind of intelligence to be able to read what an offense or defense is doing based upon how they're set up and be able to remember intricate plays based on particular verbiage and terminology. Now you may listen to them and they sound fairly unintelligent in a classic sense with their command of grammar sentence structure not being the best but they are very intelligent within the confines of their profession.

Einstein had obviously a very high IQ but you wouldn't necessarily back him to be able to read a cover 2 defense and make the right decision with a football any more than you'd bet on an NFL player understanding the theory of relativity.
 

DJ_Markstar

Based and Artetapilled

Player:Martinelli
No one has said otherwise. They're just fairly similar stylistically, what they bring to a team, how they operate etc. Doesn't mean Vieira didn't do it better, he's a legend for a reason.

Think there's probably a level between them right now, no more. Vieira is obviously a club legend who had tons of upside...but...its almost become heretical to say he had flaws in his game, which he obviously did since a perfect footballer has never existed.

Lots of people like ****ting on Rice as well for one reason or another, even though he's pulled out tons of MOTMs in his first season with us and took to our midfield like a duck to water. Rice could yet get to Vieira's level if he goes up another gear or two as well, don't think its even that controversial to say that at this point although I guarantee I'll get hate for saying it.
 

DJ_Markstar

Based and Artetapilled

Player:Martinelli
Well what you have to remember is that there are different kinds of intelligence. IQ really measures a fairly narrow ability to recall information in a standardized test environment. Athletic intelligence is almost more in line with what you might expect from a savant.

For example, American football players have a very specific kind of intelligence to be able to read what an offense or defense is doing based upon how they're set up and be able to remember intricate plays based on particular verbiage and terminology. Now you may listen to them and they sound fairly unintelligent in a classic sense with their command of grammar sentence structure not being the best but they are very intelligent within the confines of their profession.

Einstein had obviously a very high IQ but you wouldn't necessarily back him to be able to read a cover 2 defense and make the right decision with a football any more than you'd bet on an NFL player understanding the theory of relativity.

IQ testing isn't really what intelligence researchers care about tbh, they tend to use it as a proxy for G loaded sub parts of an IQ test to look for an underlying "general intelligence" (G-loaded just means some IQ tests correlate better to general intelligence than others). At that point it gets very deep into statistics and the researchers themselves disagree on what effect "general intelligence" has on specific day-to-day applications.

Anyway...perhaps this is best left to the general chat, its just a subject I'm interested in if you want to chat more about it elsewhere.
 

DJ_Markstar

Based and Artetapilled

Player:Martinelli
I wouldn’t say they were that similar especially on the ball. Vieira was skillful and silky with the ball while Rice is more similar to Keane than Vieira. You make it seem like the difference between them is largely down to trophies and nostalgia. I’m telling you as someone who watched most of the games Vieira played for us from the age of 20/21 onwards that he was levels above Rice and the comparisons are never going to be favorable to Rice. Partey at his very best which is about 4-5 games a season is the closest we have come to Vieira as a player.

Perhaps there are some similarities in first touch and ability to beat the first line of a press but most of the rest of their games aren't similar IMO. Vieira had a much better engine, ability to finish, late running into the box, ball carrying etc. which are all facets of Rice's game and not Partey's. Vieira was much more B2B who could tackle, Partey is arguably more creative and has much more of a DLP/destroyer feel to his game.

Dunno just can't see the comparison.
 

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