Did we do good business last summer?

Was the summer business good?

  • Yes

    Votes: 54 72.0%
  • No

    Votes: 21 28.0%

  • Total voters
    75

Makingtrax

Planes, Trains & Social Media Rants
Ah come on man....managers get criticism all the time. The Wenger out faction was huge even while we were finishing top four.

The reason it got bigger was because Wenger's poor management started turning more and more neutrals/Wenger In people against him until the majority of the fans wanted him out. That was a consequence of his actions not the cause.
The reason it got bigger is the band wagon effect. The world is full of examples from religion to politics. Thinking for yourself is the only way to sift through the crap. Up until 2015/16 Wenger was superb by nearly every metric going for his spend. The arguments against him were just background noise.
 

Makingtrax

Planes, Trains & Social Media Rants
Says a lot for me that Wenger stopped finishing in the top four once United, Chelsea, and Liverpool sorted themselves out. Many of us saw it coming.
You didn't see it coming, you made it happen. There's a massive difference.
 

Trilly

Full-Time Respecter Of Women
Trusted
The reason it got bigger is the band wagon effect. The world is full of examples from religion to politics.
Nah it got bigger because we started losing/drawing games we would usually win?

Teams below us started to improve their squad cost meaning that beating them wasn't as probable as it used to be. Teams around us started to outperform their squad cost and we couldn't keep up.

That essentially a manager's role right? Leverage your squad cost against smaller teams and outperform as it as much as you can against more expensive teams.

Wenger was never really able to outpeform his squad cost against the top teams but it was the loss of his ability to leverage his own squad cost that started to kill him.
 

Trilly

Full-Time Respecter Of Women
Trusted
You didn't see it coming, you made it happen. There's a massive difference.
We could go in circles all day but if I have you arguing that the Wenger-outers are what caused Wenger's decline then I'll take that as a moral victory.:lol:

It's one of the wildest defences I've seen on here.
 

GDeep™

Cute and Clever
Can we not keep this thread centred around last summer and the season? I’m just interested to know why we finished 8th.
 

Makingtrax

Planes, Trains & Social Media Rants
We could go in circles all day but if I have you arguing that the Wenger-outers are what caused Wenger's decline then I'll take that as a moral victory.:lol:

It's one of the wildest defences I've seen on here.
It's not wild, it's not a defence, it's just an observation of what happened. A guy was put under enormous pressure and he folded. It happens in every walk of life. Lets move on.
 

Trilly

Full-Time Respecter Of Women
Trusted
Can we not keep this thread centred around last summer and the season? I’m just interested to know why we finished 8th.
Emery!

If we all accept that Emery wasn't the right man for the job then we can't blame us being 10th on the summer signings can we? A poor manager is still a poor manager.

Arteta comes in and with the same squad ranks in the top four for points since January and also wins silverware. Unfortunately we don't know what Arteta would have done as manager last season but I think its safe to say that our summer business didn't make us worse, Emery did.

The fact that a rookie manager came in and took a broken low on confidence squad and did what he did implies to me that we actually made our squad better. A little better in the short term imo but much better in the long term (time will tell).
 
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BigPoppaPump

Points Out The Obvious
People who voted yes, know their stuff and understand football isn't always a short term game...they see that even though we had a difficult season (for reasons not to do with our transfers really) we signed some players with bags of potential that could see us easily get back in the Champions League soon.

People who voted no, clearly aren't over Arsène leaving and are using anything they can to prove that we were wrong to move on from him...even though we had clearly reached a point of no return with him and were obviously right to do so, they just can't get over themselves sadly...and although we got his replacement wrong in Emery, he doesn't mean we weren't right to change...sometimes when something is broken (which this team was under Bog Wengz in the end) it takes time to completely heal, we look on the right track now though.

Simples!

Riou you agree with whatever the popular opinion is, I don’t get why you’re acting so arrogant :lol:
 

BigPoppaPump

Points Out The Obvious
Emery!

If we all accept that Emery wasn't the right man for the job then we can't blame us being 10th on the summer signings can we? A poor manager is still a poor manager.

Arteta comes in and with the same squad ranks in the top four for points since January and also wins silverware. Unfortunately we don't know what Arteta would have done as manager last season but I think its safe to say that our summer business didn't make us worse, Emery did.

The fact that a rookie manager came in and took a broken low on confidence squad and did what he did implies to me that we actually made our squad better. A little better in the short term but much better in the long term.

It’s the players fault for being sh*t, dunno why people never want to point the finger that way.
 

BigPoppaPump

Points Out The Obvious
Wolves still only won 15 games out of 38. How is that different to what happened in the past? 2017/18 Burnley won 14 games, 2016/17 Everton won 17 games, etc. All with similarish no. of points 50s or 60s. You can go back and find plenty of examples like that.

If you're saying, But wait there's two teams doing well now Leicester 62 points, and Wolves 59

There's still plenty of examples of that too. 2015/16 Leicester 81, Southampton 63, West Ham 62. 2014/15 Southampton 60 Swansea 56, 2013/14 Everton 72, Southampton 56 etc

There's nothing new or harder about this year, except Arsenal and Sp**s have fallen through the floor. Saying it was easier for Arsenal in the past in not correct.


It wasn't that poor a points total, 81. They had a great team with Kante and Mahrez on top form. We've won it on less points and United have won it on less 4 times.

In fact if you look at the points the winners are getting it's going up. It was a lot less years ago, which shows how much easier it's been getting for the money teams. In the 90s, teams won on 70+ points 3 years running.


It's always been a big six for years. Look at ten year spend 2008 to 2018
8559478-A-0-F62-4-A1-B-9-E56-1-EA40-E163896.jpg

I bet you’re jealous @HairSprayGooners has me on ignore.
 

Furious

Emery Gone, Telly Back On
As for my own take, it's pretty simple:

The business was poor in relation to improving on the previous season; based on what we know now, we let too many players go without replacing them. The importance of guys like Kos, Monreal and Ramsey who had been doing it for years was understated. Likewise Pepe alone wasn't enough to help us offensively.

However, most of the signings in isolation are good. Tierney has shown great promise. Pepe, whilst expensive, will be a good player for us. Ceballos, whether he stays is another matter, but should be adjusted fully now. Saliba is a good talent. Luiz whilst making way too many mistakes is somehow still our best CB.
 

Macho

Has Trust Issues With Processes
Trusted
As for my own take, it's pretty simple:

The business was poor in relation to improving on the previous season; based on what we know now, we let too many players go without replacing them. The importance of guys like Kos, Monreal and Ramsey who had been doing it for years was understated. Likewise Pepe alone wasn't enough to help us offensively.

However, most of the signings in isolation are good. Tierney has shown great promise. Pepe, whilst expensive, will be a good player for us. Ceballos, whether he stays is another matter, but should be adjusted fully now. Saliba is a good talent. Luiz whilst making way too many mistakes is somehow still our best CB.
Whilst I think we had a good window myself, this is a fair assessment.
Too many future signings not enough for now. That goes for contract renewals too.
 

Macho

Has Trust Issues With Processes
Trusted
Can we not keep this thread centred around last summer and the season? I’m just interested to know why we finished 8th.
In short, Emery.

I don’t think he’s a bad coach and I will follow his progress in Spain. I think its safe to say he completely lost the plot and his communication skills let him down - with the squad and the media/the public.

I dunno about top 4 but we could have definitely finished a couple places higher with this squad as it is.
 

Trilly

Full-Time Respecter Of Women
Trusted
It’s the players fault for being sh*t, dunno why people never want to point the finger that way.
Some of them are no hopers for sure. But I think Mustafi, Ceballos and Xhaka are good examples of players who did better under Arteta.

We will always have a ceiling due to some players but Emery was nowhere near that ceiling.
 

Trilly

Full-Time Respecter Of Women
Trusted
Luiz whilst making way too many mistakes is somehow still our best CB.
This is the funniest one for me.

I think there's a decent CB there. He has the tendency to try and tackle players who are through on goal which when combined with our defensive issues are a recipe for disaster. Ignoring Emery's time here and the Liverpool disaster class (came on cold and wasn't fit) he hasn't been that bad.
 

Oxeki

New Threads, Old Tweets
Quick question: In two years when guys like Saliba, Tierney, Ceballos (if we make him permanent) and Pepe start tearing it up will last summer window considered a good window?

Personally, I think it should. The biggest mistake we made was appointing Emery.

I think last summer was our best window in almost a decade.

In a few years, we're going to look back at last summer as the turning point of our fortune
 

Ash10

A-M's Skip Bayless
It was a window focusing more on the future rather than the here & now. Bad management & the dross we've had from before didn’t help either

Can't say it’s a good window unless the signings work out in the end
 

krengon

One Arsène Wenger
Trusted
Can we not keep this thread centred around last summer and the season? I’m just interested to know why we finished 8th.

People will obviously put all the blame on Emery, but what did he get to work with after his first season?

Missed out on top 4 by one point and made the Europa final, a huge bottle job to miss out sure, but top 4 was right there for the taking next season with the right improvements and considering the competition.. We needed to improve our defence, what did Emery get? A cb he can't use, a lb who was going to miss months before he could play, and another cb worse than one legged Koscielny, instead of improving we downgraded for the season. Midfield and attack needed upgrade and he got a loanee that needed adaption and a player he didn't want. Not to mention that he lost huge personalities in the team and main creative forces from previous season without being replaced, again instead of improving we downgraded for the season.

You can say we'll improve long term, but we wasted a golden opportunity to get back into top 4 for this, so unless they get top 4 next season it was a failure that set us back further.
 

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