"How vital is Thierry Henry to the Gunners's cause?&quo

[BannedKwame]

maybe i'm a romantic old fool but i don't beleive in this henry being a talisman for our club thing, i think he quite hinders the club, i mean if i'm honest, the way he addressed the goals of the game on Saturday.henry is no where near as exciting as Wright was, or as van Persie is, i don't know why, but he's not, it's a nice name to have and the fact he's undisputebly 'world class' helps in the marquee stakes but if we're honest, the honours that have evaded him, have evaded him for a reason.

non sequitur.
So how he celebrated the goals he scored yesterday-- two world class goals by any account wasn't to your liking. Perhaps he was too lax, too arrogant, but what does that have to do with the quality of the goals?
The honours have evaded him because of how he celebrates his goals?? If not, explain or illustrate why the honours have evaded him.

the team until this year and the mass emergence of yongsters was full of chockers; ljungberg, pires, paddy, gilberto, lauren, campbell and bergkamp. all of those players had trouble when the going got tough and if a better team has been built at the right times then questions like this wouldn't even come up.

You've provided your list of chokers, and I don't see Henry, so it's a waste of space. Additionally, your set of chokers have won the premiership, FA cup, world cp, european cup, African cup of nations, Olympics, etc. A bunch of chockers. And to reiterate, I see no Henry.

at the moment, Fabregas is far more important imo, he enables us to attract youngsters almost ready to make huge impacts because they beleive that if they're good enough they'll play.

Cesc is more important because he allows us to attract youngsters??? Youngsters who of course win us championships, yes? And then when interviewed speak about Henry, not Cesc, as the main attraction-- playerwise.

Henry is a big name for this club, but if we replaced him properly (i.e. not a hopeful, but someone we know cna get atleast 20 goals a season) Henry would quickly full into the legend category as opposed to the dreadfully missed category, in the same way paddy fell straight into the legend category when he left.

And of course it's easy to find a 20 goal a season striker, which is why after having spent 300 million pounds Chelsea still lack one. Take a quick look at the scoring charts in the top four best leagues around Europe

give me a team featuring reyes, hleb, eboue, cole, fabregas, van Persie, senderos and toure, and trust me, you'd be suprised at how well we do.

Yea, a team aiming for the lowest finish in the Wenger era, and without Henry's goals most likely lower.

at this club we like to hold onto players based on what they could give, put them players in a team together and they'll give you results.

Which is why Wenger is giving Henry a contract extension for 5 years. At his age, Henry is in his prime, and a late blossomer, still has 3/4 years at the highest level. We should all thank whomever we worship that you are not the manager.


Quite frankly, I think you lack the ability to fully realize your ideas before posting them; I think your prejudices for/against certain players hinders your good judgment, and as whole (#posts/#quality posts), you are one of the worst posters around here. Just my opinion.

 

[USArsenal]

Quite frankly, I think you lack the ability to fully realize your ideas before posting them; I think your prejudices for/against certain players hinders your good judgment, and as whole (#posts/#quality posts), you are one of the worst posters around here. Just my opinion.

ok, he may talk a lot of **** sometimes, but i wouldnt go that far..... you talk a bit of smack yourself from time to time..



that said, sabre, you are talking out of your ass... Henry is one of the major reasons we havent had a lower than 2nd finish for the past 8 seasons and won the league 3 times and the FA cup 3 times...

 

[14teranga]

Thank you very much Kwame!

 

[choi12911]

Sabre... You think getting " someone we know cna get atleast 20 goals a season" is easy?

How many strikers do you know have gotten 20 goals a season consistently for.. let's say more than 3~4 years and have gotten as many assists as Henry?

....No one....
Henry's goal and assist stats speaks itself. Why try to defy such an obvious fact? Henry is the single most important player in our team no matter how you put it.

Did Walcott join us because he likes Cesc? Maybe.. But the number one reason why Walcott joined us is because we have the one of the best strikers in the world and Walcott wanted to learn and be as successful as Henry.

Simply put, I think you've been spoilt by the fact that Henry makes such exquisite goals seem so easy. You are disillusioned, if you think some prospect from the Ligue 1 is going to be just as good as Henry and will cost us less than our entire summer transfer budget.....

 

[Tony Montana]

maybe i'm a romantic old fool but i don't beleive in this henry being a talisman for our club thing, i think he quite hinders the club, i mean if i'm honest, the way he addressed the goals of the game on Saturday.henry is no where near as exciting as Wright was, or as van Persie is, i don't know why, but he's not, it's a nice name to have and the fact he's undisputebly 'world class' helps in the marquee stakes but if we're honest, the honours that have evaded him, have evaded him for a reason.

non sequitur.
So how he celebrated the goals he scored yesterday-- two world class goals by any account wasn't to your liking. Perhaps he was too lax, too arrogant, but what does that have to do with the quality of the goals?
The honours have evaded him because of how he celebrates his goals?? If not, explain or illustrate why the honours have evaded him.

the team until this year and the mass emergence of yongsters was full of chockers; ljungberg, pires, paddy, gilberto, lauren, campbell and bergkamp. all of those players had trouble when the going got tough and if a better team has been built at the right times then questions like this wouldn't even come up.

You've provided your list of chokers, and I don't see Henry, so it's a waste of space. Additionally, your set of chokers have won the premiership, FA cup, world cp, european cup, African cup of nations, Olympics, etc. A bunch of chockers. And to reiterate, I see no Henry.

at the moment, Fabregas is far more important imo, he enables us to attract youngsters almost ready to make huge impacts because they beleive that if they're good enough they'll play.

Cesc is more important because he allows us to attract youngsters??? Youngsters who of course win us championships, yes? And then when interviewed speak about Henry, not Cesc, as the main attraction-- playerwise.

Henry is a big name for this club, but if we replaced him properly (i.e. not a hopeful, but someone we know cna get atleast 20 goals a season) Henry would quickly full into the legend category as opposed to the dreadfully missed category, in the same way paddy fell straight into the legend category when he left.

And of course it's easy to find a 20 goal a season striker, which is why after having spent 300 million pounds Chelsea still lack one. Take a quick look at the scoring charts in the top four best leagues around Europe

give me a team featuring reyes, hleb, eboue, cole, fabregas, van Persie, senderos and toure, and trust me, you'd be suprised at how well we do.

Yea, a team aiming for the lowest finish in the Wenger era, and without Henry's goals most likely lower.

at this club we like to hold onto players based on what they could give, put them players in a team together and they'll give you results.

Which is why Wenger is giving Henry a contract extension for 5 years. At his age, Henry is in his prime, and a late blossomer, still has 3/4 years at the highest level. We should all thank whomever we worship that you are not the manager.


Quite frankly, I think you lack the ability to fully realize your ideas before posting them; I think your prejudices for/against certain players hinders your good judgment, and as whole (#posts/#quality posts), you are one of the worst posters around here. Just my opinion.

Excellent ****ing post Kwame.

 

[Tony Montana]

Double post, sorry.

 

[mood]

Henry is probably the best player in the world. His important is great to any team.

It's not like we can not do it without Henry. In my opinion, we have the ability to win games without him.. and we've shown that before. If it wasn't for Fabregas and Hleb, Henry wouldn't have scored that goal vs Juventus

 

[cc]

I'm with sabre. henry's goals are vital to the team, but we will find ways of scoring without him just like what happened since vieira's departure, though we may pay price for it. henry is a team player which means the whole team serves for him. he would never be such prolific had he not got such support that arsenal gave him. his performance in france national team proved it. I doubt whether he could get such a priority at any club other than arsenal. he is our default start striker as long as he is healthy, simply avoiding rotation no matter how awful he is (though it doesn't happen frequently ). he influenced the team tactic a lot. I hate to see any player above the club. it's really annoying when somebody saying henry is too good for the team. ****! I like this guy as long as he dedicates to arsenal, but I like arsenal more. Arsenal has never been and will never be a one-man team. (well, if it is, the man is Arsène, not Titi :wink: )

 

[FRESHK_GOONER4LIFE]

Its all Rubbish

Hi this is my 1st post-

I have to agree with you guys that people exagerate when they call us a one man team. Henry's a great player but people forget that:

Wenger won his first double without Henry,

People forget that before he came to Arsenal he wasnt that great. Wenger and Arsenal made him into the player he is today and we can do the same for Theo/ V Persie and Reyes.

People forget that they said the same thing years ago when Wrighty was around ignoring players like Winterburn/ Adams/ Parlour etc.

People foget that he missed them sitters against Liverpool in that cup final a few years ago and in the UEFA cup against Galatasary.

His the best in the world but his human and his not the entire Arsenal team.

 

[Lukazan]

maybe i'm a romantic old fool

Dunno about the 'romantic' and 'old' part but you've got the rest spot on. :wink:

 

[Liberace]

great post kwame 8)

 

[Liberace]

maybe i'm a romantic old fool

Dunno about the 'romantic' and 'old' part but you've got the rest spot on. :wink:

 

[Rudeboy]

Henry is a one of a kind player, and person. there is no one elce like him and arsenal will not be the same. but just like when Vieira left Fabregas stept in his place wenger will know the right person to take up the best player in the worlds shoes.

 

[1970*Gooner]

The problem is that Henry is on another planet and everything goes through him when we are playing. Therefore when he's not playing there is that uncertainty from the players as to what to do when we need to score.

Teams need to adjust when a top player is missing and its hard at first. The same goes for Ronaldinho at Barca, Gerrard at Liverpool.

I agree with you on the players feeling a bit insecure when he is not playing however, its a must that they start addressing this henry-ism and look to perform well within their own right. All they need is a self belief and confidence, RVP has a self belief and the confidence that's why I like him so much, not saying I don't like the rest of the team but RVP is one of the players I like best.

 

[sabret00the]

non sequitur.
So how he celebrated the goals he scored yesterday-- two world class goals by any account wasn't to your liking. Perhaps he was too lax, too arrogant, but what does that have to do with the quality of the goals?
The honours have evaded him because of how he celebrates his goals?? If not, explain or illustrate why the honours have evaded him.

Not sure how to approach this, you've started off your disection of my post by making stuff up. i have not once expressed any dissatisfaction with Henry's performance against Villa and actually really enjoyed both goals. i loved the first one more due to the fact that in a season when his first touch has been so hit and miss, it was just so HIT in such a glorious moment that left me in awe, despite the fact he's done it a few times.

You've provided your list of chokers, and I don't see Henry, so it's a waste of space. Additionally, your set of chokers have won the premiership, FA cup, world cp, european cup, African cup of nations, Olympics, etc. A bunch of chockers. And to reiterate, I see no Henry.

yes you're right they do all have honours, but forgive me for mistaking football as a game that requires eleven players on the pitch for one team, playing for each other.

Cesc is more important because he allows us to attract youngsters??? Youngsters who of course win us championships, yes? And then when interviewed speak about Henry, not Cesc, as the main attraction-- playerwise.

you have to look at this in the long terms, i stated that i feel Henry hasn't got that long left, yes call it bias but when i watch him that's what i see in what he's able to give, we'll never be a team who will go out and spend decent money on players under Wenger, look at how much we needed a midfielder and we returned with Diaby, that beleif that young players will come and play, will serve us a whole lot more than getting a superstar and then trying to instill into him that he's just another number, another cog in the machine.

And of course it's easy to find a 20 goal a season striker, which is why after having spent 300 million pounds Chelsea still lack one. Take a quick look at the scoring charts in the top four best leagues around Europe

course it's not easy, and let's not talk about Chelsea, i don't patronise you when i read your abundant mundane posts, don't patronise me. it's clear to even the blindest man, that Mourinho couldn't be trusted to go and buy the ****ing weekly food shopping, let alone buy a team. Ranieri bought the functioning members of that team, Mourinho strictly motivated them.

Yea, a team aiming for the lowest finish in the Wenger era, and without Henry's goals most likely lower.

many people felt the same when Wrighty left and again when Anelka left, i hope you was around back then, you were right?

Which is why Wenger is giving Henry a contract extension for 5 years. At his age, Henry is in his prime, and a late blossomer, still has 3/4 years at the highest level. We should all thank whomever we worship that you are not the manager.


Quite frankly, I think you lack the ability to fully realize your ideas before posting them; I think your prejudices for/against certain players hinders your good judgment, and as whole (#posts/#quality posts), you are one of the worst posters around here. Just my opinion.

You see this isn't a thing about bias, it's about the growth of a team. my thoughts and feelings are well documented in regards to Henry and in fact i have raised none of the 'feelings' here, i merely state that in order for the team to move forward we need to have in our locker, the opportunity to rotate our strikers between 2 spots. i also state that Henry's time at the top is limited due to his achillies injury that has no healed and has been hampering him more and more over a two season course. i also state that the money can be used to replace him, in the same way we used Anelka's money to replace him. i also state that for a bunch of award and honour winning winners, they all seem to rely on Henry and other people and don't seem to go it alone (case in point, the inability to retain a title).

you talk about not scoring goals without Henry, we done that, then he came back (prematurely) and left again and we couldn't do it again. it could be lack of abililty or it could be knocked confidence, i don't know, but i would say the players we have are good enough to get goals at this level.

it's undeniable that Cesc hitting form has coincided with Henry's form, along with Manu's presence, these go to show that it's not a one man thing, it's a team effort and players of the calibre we have, will maintain that.

When we have van Persie's goals dragging us through CL games, Cup rounds and Premiership games, we weren't labelled a one man team, but he was without a doubt our shinning star and yet we went to away games and played him on the left wing, that's a problem for me.

What you fail to realise, is that i want the best for the team, and i can see that possibly...it's very possible, that the best for the team is life after Henry.

It wasn't long ago, people were talking about our right side not being replaced after i made a long post listing how it wasn't good enough, it's amusing, i was told stuff like "freddie and lauren are good servants", "it's foolish to beleif we should have the same production rate from the right side" and all other types of foolishness. now you look at the team and all but the blindest man, will be wanting Lauren there over Eboue. it's just a matter of evolution. if you're not improving you're going backwards, you only need to look at our transfer activity after the unbeaten run to see that.

And last but not least, Henry's goals of individual brilliance (start to finish) are fast in decline, he's not largely assist dependant, while i would've previously felt that in lou of this fact, i never had a leg to stand on and would've been happy to just state my opinion, rather than debate for it's recognition, fact's like this, do have to make you question, how much can he offer in two seasons time when his pace has dwindled? another bergkamp? **** that. we need two striking strikers to compete at the very top.

 

[Gooner83]

And last but not least, Henry's goals of individual brilliance (start to finish) are fast in decline, he's not largely assist dependant, while i would've previously felt that in lou of this fact, i never had a leg to stand on and would've been happy to just state my opinion, rather than debate for it's recognition, fact's like this, do have to make you question, how much can he offer in two seasons time when his pace has dwindled? another bergkamp? f**k that. we need two striking strikers to compete at the very top.

Thats not true, his real madrid goal was individual brilliance, also his pace is back and i can still see him being average pace when hes 33 not slow as hes very athletic.

Hes also intentionally changed his game since hes captain, hes leading the line more so hes up there waiting for it.

His finishing is first rate and hes probably still even improving there... he'll probably just stay up front 90mins when hes over 30.

 

[Gunner15]

Henry will always be a crucial member of the team. He really is a iriplacable player and a strong link in the chain

 

[choi12911]

And last but not least, Henry's goals of individual brilliance (start to finish) are fast in decline, he's not largely assist dependant, while i would've previously felt that in lou of this fact, i never had a leg to stand on and would've been happy to just state my opinion, rather than debate for it's recognition, fact's like this, do have to make you question, how much can he offer in two seasons time when his pace has dwindled? another bergkamp? f**k that. we need two striking strikers to compete at the very top.

Well there you go. You just said he creates the goals for himself.
Not only does he create most of his goals by himself, but he is also renowned for his unselfish pass. If it wasn't for crap finishings by the like of Ljungberg, Pires, Reyes and Adebayor, Henry would have gotten a few more assists.

Also, there is no evidence of Henry's individual brilliance is fast in decline. Because guess what? The player of the month is likely going to be Henry. Have you not seen his individual brilliance against Real, Juventus, Villa?

All players have a dip in form and I believe Henry suffered from that a bit some time ago. But even then, he was scoring goal when our team was playing like **** and nobody else was scoring. Now that he's gotten over that Achilles injury, he's running with the ball for fun. (Remember that run against Viera and Zebina in the first leg vs. Juventus? Or how about Henry outpacing Cannavaro and getting himself into 1-on-1 situation with Buffon in the second leg?) The point is, Wenger thinks Henry can be at the top level for another four years and I believe that too. Recently, he's shown the fans that he's still got the pace. But even with the Achilles injury, he still manages himself in the top scorer position every year.......Seriously, how good is Henry when he manages to be the top scorer in EPL even without one of his best assets? I mean, can you imagine Ruud without his positional sense of play? (which I think is one of his best assets) He'd literally be horseshit......

I'm not saying Arsenal is a one-man's team. But to claim Henry is easily replaceable and he "quite hinders the club" is just ludicrous. Henry broke Wright's record in what? In 6 years? Imagine what he could do if he was given another 4 years when he is at his peak.

I would say thinking that in couple of years, Henry will be like Bergkamp of now (FFS, he's 37 now) is the very example of your ignorance as I think Bergkamp has hit his peak in his late 20's and early 30's.

So how exactly is Henry hindering our club again?

By scoring exquisite goals that seem so easy? By being the unbenchable (if there is such a word) player because he is so goddamn reliable? By being the person who you know is going to make something out of nothing? By being the magician on the pitch that races past 4 players before rattling the second best keeper in the world in front of 70,000 Real Ultras in Bernabeu?