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Is The Premier League Tougher Than It Used To Be?

Is It?


  • Total voters
    91

shoom

Member
It’s the average points per game between the two groups.
Yeah but the first group isn't the big six. Just look at the final league tables from those years, the numbers are off. The second group isn't the rest of the league either, that looks like average relegation PPG.
 

Makingtrax

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Player: Saliba
Yeah but the first group isn't the big six. Just look at the final league tables from those years, the numbers are off. The second group isn't the rest of the league either, that looks like average relegation PPG.
Mate the blue line is the top 6 v bottom 14 and the brown line is the bottom 14 v the top 6 . . average points per game per season.
 

shoom

Member
Mate the blue line is the top 6 v bottom 14 and the brown line is the bottom 14 v the top 6 . . average points per game per season.
Ahh I'm with you, that makes sense. Wonder what the last couple of seasons would look like, us and Sp**s have been so **** the gaps probably narrowed.
 

Makingtrax

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Ahh I'm with you, that makes sense. Wonder what the last couple of seasons would look like, us and Sp**s have been so **** the gaps probably narrowed.
Interestingly, the gap of revenues continues to increase between the top 6 and the rest, but you’re right, the managerial problems at Arsenal and Sp**s has probably slowed that trend increase.
 

Dj_sds -

Active Member
And here’s another for you @AbouCuéllar. The number of points it takes to finish in each position of the league. You can see by the spread in the top positions that they’re getting stronger, upward trend lines. But the rest of the teams are getting weaker, downward trend lines.

As usual, I’m not sure you’ll answer any of these points. But you really ought to if you’re going to keep up this nonsense. Or at least provide some data of your own.

8-DF5728-C-AB73-4-A6-A-8-CCF-39-F2614-BDBD3.jpg

Or perhaps those putting likes on your posts, like @Dj_sds - or @drippin would like to comment.

Like I said before, the fact that there is talk of the big six / top 6 proves that the league has gotten harder, there was no talk of the big six 10 years ago. Nobody would have mentioned Sp**s in the same breath as arsenal back then. I also mentioned that a manager with conte's pedigree would have never gone to Sp**s prior to 2015. The exponential increase in revenue and the influx of top foreign managers coming to the premier league was the catalyst for the level of competitiveness we see now. The top clubs have since then had managers who could more efficiently utilize the ever increasing revenues of these clubs. Hence the premier league has again become more dominant in Europe, this wasn't the case between 2010-2016.

The graph shows that the big 6 clubs are becoming more consistent and the level required to get champions league football has gotten higher, there is less margin for error (proof league has gotten harder). It is not surprising that once klopp, pep, pochettino and to a lesser degree mourinho came to the premier league arsenal dropped out of the top 4. Liverpool and Sp**s closed the gap and even surpassed us during this period. This wasn't because of the kroenkes, squad cost or fan pressure. Fault lies solely with the clowns who were running this club (including wenger) and ruining the foundations he built. The man had nothing left to prove after the work he had done up until 2011(- 2014) and it would be logical that he didn't have the same drive, ambition and hunger as when he started his managerial career, this happens in all professions. Wenger just couldn't cope anymore and the sooner you can accept that, the sooner you can move on.
 
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Makingtrax

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Player: Saliba
Like I said before, the fact that there is talk of the big six / top 6 proves that the league has gotten harder, there was no talk of the big six 10 years ago.
Here's the league from 2011 and top 6 are already bossing the league. Positions 1 to 6 in the table.

Nobody would have mentioned Sp**s in the same breath as arsenal back then.
And back then Sp**s were spending more than Arsenal. The only reason they weren't mentioned in the same breath was because of Arsène.

The top clubs have since then had managers who could more efficiently utilize the ever increasing revenues of these clubs. Hence the premier league has again become more dominant in Europe, this wasn't the case between 2010-2016.
We're talking about competitiveness within the league. The relative difference between the Prem and other Europe leagues is totally irrelevant.

The graph shows that the big 6 clubs are becoming more consistent and the level required to get champions league football has gotten higher, there is less margin for error (proof league has gotten harder).
The graphs clearly shows that the top 6 are getting less and less competition from the rest of the clubs.

Fault lies solely with the clowns who were running this club (including wenger) and ruining the foundations he built. The man had nothing left to prove after the work he had done up until 2011(- 2014) and it would be logical that he didn't have the same drive, ambition and hunger as when he started his managerial career, this happens in all professions. Wenger just couldn't cope anymore and the sooner you can accept that, the sooner you can move on.
Just you going off on your usual Wenger hate, got nothing to do with the discussion about the league getting harder. :lol:

All in all that was a pathetic response.
 

AbouCuéllar

Author of A-M essays 📚
Like I said before, the fact that there is talk of the big six / top 6 proves that the league has gotten harder, there was no talk of the big six 10 years ago. Nobody would have mentioned Sp**s in the same breath as arsenal back then. I also mentioned that a manager with conte's pedigree would have never gone to Sp**s prior to 2015. The exponential increase in revenue and the influx of top foreign managers coming to the premier league was the catalyst for the level of competitiveness we see now. The top clubs have since then had managers who could more efficiently utilize the ever increasing revenues of these clubs. Hence the premier league has again become more dominant in Europe, this wasn't the case between 2010-2016.

The graph shows that the big 6 clubs are becoming more consistent and the level required to get champions league football has gotten higher, there is less margin for error (proof league has gotten harder). It is not surprising that once klopp, pep, pochettino and to a lesser degree mourinho came to the premier league arsenal dropped out of the top 4. Liverpool and Sp**s closed the gap and even surpassed us during this period. This wasn't because of the kroenkes, squad cost or fan pressure. Fault lies solely with the clowns who were running this club (including wenger) and ruining the foundations he built. The man had nothing left to prove after the work he had done up until 2011(- 2014) and it would be logical that he didn't have the same drive, ambition and hunger as when he started his managerial career, this happens in all professions. Wenger just couldn't cope anymore and the sooner you can accept that, the sooner you can move on.
Fantastic post.
 

RacingPhoton

❤️ Xhaka ❤️
The way I see it, as long as money flow increases in a league, it's standards will increase. That's true with the Premier League. The TV money and rich investments mean higher ability to buy good players, good coaches and better training facilities.

Overall quality of players and teams has been increasing steadily in the past decade. A club which has retained the same quality for about 3 years will rapidly fall behind other clubs which are improving. This forces clubs to be proactive and keep finding ways to improve. Teams must learn to use their money efficiently.

We fell behind in the last years of Wenger's management, continued the slide under Emery and went further behind in Arteta's first year with signings like Willian. At last, the club management seems to have realised the mistakes they were making in the transfer market and have done well last summer.

The problem with averaging stats like points/goals is that a positive stat for one team is a negative stat for another. So when you average them out and compare, you are not really proving if the league is harder or weaker. We need absolute stats which can be compared with the past. Like distance covered by players per 90 now against the distance covered by players a decade back.
 

Makingtrax

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Player: Saliba
So that's this thread put to bed then. For the top 6 the Premier league is getting easier and easier. And especially for Arsenal. No anecdotal stuff, the data is clear.

Financial disparity
Yes all the clubs have been getting more money but the top 6 have been getting way more. And more importantly the gap is increasing. And for those who doubt this here is a suberb series of tweets by Swiss Ramble to prove it (at the bottom)). And there are plenty of others providing data on this. More revenue equals more wages and better players.

Growing performance gap
It's a complete myth about the middle and lower teams getting better and making it harder for the top 6. They're not. Again there is a mountain of evidence showing the gap growing and here is one of the best articles showing the data getting wider over the years.

Premiership top 6 vs bottom 14

Arsenals position within the top 6
Arsenal have traditionally been investing 5th in their squad for some years. Yet the last 4 years, after sales the club has outlayed the most money out of the top 6 , £341m (transfermarkt), level with United, almost double Liverpool, Sp**s and Chelsea and £120m more than City. Nobody can fault KSE's recent massive investment.

Arsenal have never in the history of club found themselves in a better position to win the league. Finishing 8th has been criminal. With a good manager we should be challenging for the title, as all this data shows.

 

CaseUteinberger

Showering Xhaka with love 😍
Arsenal have never in the history of club found themselves in a better position to win the league.
Are you implying that, if Wenger would have stayed on, and KSE would have invested like they have over the last 4 years, that we would now be challenging for the league title?
 

Makingtrax

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Player: Saliba
Are you implying that, if Wenger would have stayed on, and KSE would have invested like they have over the last 4 years, that we would now be challenging for the league title?
As always just taking a view from real data produced by professionals.
 

Rex Bezos

Here We Go 🤝
Trusted ⭐
Like I said before, the fact that there is talk of the big six / top 6 proves that the league has gotten harder, there was no talk of the big six 10 years ago. Nobody would have mentioned Sp**s in the same breath as arsenal back then. I also mentioned that a manager with conte's pedigree would have never gone to Sp**s prior to 2015. The exponential increase in revenue and the influx of top foreign managers coming to the premier league was the catalyst for the level of competitiveness we see now. The top clubs have since then had managers who could more efficiently utilize the ever increasing revenues of these clubs. Hence the premier league has again become more dominant in Europe, this wasn't the case between 2010-2016.

10 years ago Sp*rs had peak Bale, Walker, Modric and van der Vaart.

They’d finished in the CL places two years in a row and had absolutely tw*tted the reigning CL champions in their own stadium.

They regularly beat us in the NLD and were even in the mix for the title until March of 2012. As someone who lived through it there was absolutely talk of the big 6 back then.
 

Ellamamama

Member
So that's this thread put to bed then. For the top 6 the Premier league is getting easier and easier. And especially for Arsenal. No anecdotal stuff, the data is clear.

Financial disparity
Yes all the clubs have been getting more money but the top 6 have been getting way more. And more importantly the gap is increasing. And for those who doubt this here is a suberb series of tweets by Swiss Ramble to prove it (at the bottom)). And there are plenty of others providing data on this. More revenue equals more wages and better players.

Growing performance gap
It's a complete myth about the middle and lower teams getting better and making it harder for the top 6. They're not. Again there is a mountain of evidence showing the gap growing and here is one of the best articles showing the data getting wider over the years.

Premiership top 6 vs bottom 14

Arsenals position within the top 6
Arsenal have traditionally been investing 5th in their squad for some years. Yet the last 4 years, after sales the club has outlayed the most money out of the top 6 , £341m (transfermarkt), level with United, almost double Liverpool, Sp**s and Chelsea and £120m more than City. Nobody can fault KSE's recent massive investment.

Arsenal have never in the history of club found themselves in a better position to win the league. Finishing 8th has been criminal. With a good manager we should be challenging for the title, as all this data shows.

Great analysis and visuals in that link. Can’t help but be sad reading though, makes me wonder what will change over the next decade if any.
 

Makingtrax

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Player: Saliba
Great analysis and visuals in that link. Can’t help but be sad reading though, makes me wonder what will change over the next decade if any.
Thanks bro. It's not going to change anytime soon. Football is completely broken for the likes of Norwich. All those clubs below the top 6 now have a ceiling that only a very very occasional fluke can break through.
 

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