José Antonio Reyes

[JazzG]

I wouldn't say R.Madrid's defense is poor, then again I wouldn't say it is that great either! If it is as poor as some make it out then in the CL teams would score a lot more goals against them.

This season Reyes has scored 5 goals and has played 20 games. Most of them as a left winger I believe. Haven't got any stats on how many assists he has though, saw him the other week deliver a superb cross in which someone scored from. He has been on fire, he is much better than Bentley imo. He will will fit in fine in our system, he has pace, vision and great ball delivery.

 

[Chips&CurrySauce]

Comparing Bentley and Reyes is ridiculous. Reyes is Sevillas number 10. He has been a 1st team regular for 2 seasons now. He has scored great goals at the top level and he definately can play both left wing and as a traditional number 10. And he is only 20 years of age! And he has also played for Spain and I believe he has scored a few goals for Spain aswell.

Bentley is just one year younger, never played in a premiership game, never scored a goal for the fist team. He is a very good prospect whom im sure will develop into a good player (certainly not in Bergkamps class) but Reyes has the potential to be a world great! Thats why Wenger has been following him for 3 years and is prepared to break our transfer record to sign him!

 

[JazzG]

He scored yesterday as well for them in the cup.

Yeah he has scored for Spain, scored 2 against Armenia and he came on as a sub!

Like you said Bentley has the potential to be good but Reyes will turn into a great at the rate he is going.

 

[Kyla]

Ljungberg has been an important player for us when Dennis has been too (his run of goals in 01/02). It will be interesting to see what happens when this is not the scenario

It already is the scenario. He's not the goal scoring threat he was b/c he is too dependent on that incisive through ball at the end of a sweeping move and a resurgent run.

PS: I don't want Wengerball to undergo a transition. We played our total football when Bergkamp was hardly in the side early last season didn't we Adam? We we're scoring goals for fun. It was effortless, casual brilliance- and it was an Henry-Kanu combination which won us all the plaudits. So, I don't think Dennis is AS pivotal as you make out. Although I see you're point. Kanu is too inconistent, but can perform the visionary role when he can!

 

[Adam]

He's a great talent - but i believe Bentleys abilities, in his position - are far more rare. Especially as he has been tuned by the Arsenal coaching team to be what he is.

Reyes for me would a perfect replacement for Pires, but as we see youngsters like Clichy, Smith, Thomas, Pennant and Bentley who could all potentially play LM - is it worth splashing the whole 20M on him?

I'd certainly take him over Van Persie, Robben, Van Der Vaart, Etoo, Kluivert et al.

It's harder to judge whether i'd take him over potential youngsters who won't cost a thing, and promise the world.

Bobby has another 2 seasons max at LM. In this time we can judge whether our youngsters are good enough to take his mantle and match what he gave us.

Reyes would guarantee instant success in that position - and some might argue that's what we need if challenging for the CL.

Especially if Wiltord, Bergkamp, and Jeffers leave. On this morning however i am of the thinking that Bergkamp might stay on (depending on end of season form) while Wiltord and Jeffers leave.

Bergkamp is an iffy one to judge - 34, still physically great, dip in form that if it comes back will see him stay on for another year.

Wenger hinted that Kanu will be offered a new contract btw in his post match interview vs Boro.

 

[Adam]

Ljungberg has been an important player for us when Dennis has been too (his run of goals in 01/02). It will be interesting to see what happens when this is not the scenario

It already is the scenario. He's not the goal scoring threat he was b/c he is too dependent on that incisive through ball at the end of a sweeping move and a resurgent run.

PS: I don't want Wengerball to undergo a transition. We played our total football when Bergkamp was hardly in the side early last season didn't we Adam? We we're scoring goals for fun. It was effortless, casual brilliance- and it was an Henry-Kanu combination which won us all the plaudits. So, I don't think Dennis is AS pivotal as you make out. Although I see you're point. Kanu is too inconistent, but can perform the visionary role when he can!

Yes some of the flair football was without Bergkamp - the more clinical and concise type of total football was with Bergkamp in 01/02. The counter attacking was more swift, and less predictable because of Bergkamps on form influence. Kanu is not so swift, and not so economical. Henry played with Wiltord and it wasn't effective - Bergkamp's positional sense and passing is more spinal, and more bennificcial to the team.

I'd also say Bergkamp is part of the best Wengerball. Anfield last season - that football was archetyped by Bergkamp. The through balls in that game are something that Arsène has to find in a player and cannot drum into you on a training ground - he can to an extent, but not to a Dennis level.

Ljungberg thrived on the left in 01/02 because he was more involved. Everyone knows we love the left hand side, and he played better there in that season.

Dennis seems to angle his passes from right to left, even better than left to right. Ljungberg liked that.

Wiltord thrived on the right in the meantime. Bergkamp gave the team a shape which allowed these players to shine in those positions.

Wengerball will have to go through a transition without Bergkamp - the reason we have yet to peak is because he isn't on form.

We have once this season - against Fulham. Remember that through pass to Freddie?

Wow.

Post-Bergkamp football has seen us try to find our fluency up front, but we haven't entirely.

The players are talked about more individually nowadays - rather than the collective style which Bergkamp brought us which made everyone talk about the team and it's style of play... it's now....

Henry this, Pires volley... etc.

Less team goals, but more individually inspired efforts.

Pires in his later years when he has to be physically disciplined in movement may be able to bring us the collective style Bergkamp gives us by playing in the hole - making way for Reyes to come in at LM.

At the moment the team consists of alot of bright shining individual threads, which need to be tied and co-ordinated together offensively by a player - Bergkamp.

Having Vieira back has helped, bringing back our other established spinal player Bergkamp will help even more.

Ljungberg or Pires could be striker solution

"If I need to, I will," he told Arsenal.com. "I have done it before, even at home, and they have both played international football there."

"For me they are more midfielders than second strikers or the real striker," said Wenger. "But more and more teams play five in the middle of the park against us so it could be a solution for me.

"Thierry Henry does not stay central. He tends to drift out wide so he is not the ideal striker to play on his own up front."

Wow, Arsène speaking today - In his own words. If Thierry is there, Dennis has to be central.

Let's hope our evolution post Bergkamp is smooth.

It may start with Pires playing in the hole, and a Reyes replacing him at LM.

 

[lewdikris]

Ok ok ok...

So the question is, why do we need a Reyes/Van Persie type player?

Answer: angles.

I agree totally with JGooner on the notion that this mythical Wengerball thing is now entirely defined by the physical force of Toure, Vieira, Gilberto, Ljungberg and Cole supporting the grace finesse of Henry and Pires.

A couple of seasons back that would have been not only Henry and Pires but Bergkamp too. Bergy was the links between defence and attack in the middle of the park - the fulcrum.

Bring a left footer into that position - much younger, faster, more a dribbler than a passer and what do you get?

Well, first you get the twinned assault of two strikers bearing down on goal with equal dribbling power. Reyes is almost as fluid at holding the ball up as Henry - and could be at the same level in 3-4 years.

I said a longtime ago that I thought Wenger might want to replicate on the right hand side of the park the fluidity that happens on the left. In Toure he now has the perfect right back - who will be BETTER than Cole is, more volcanic, eruptive than anyone not named Roberto Carlos. And he can defend too.

Ljungberg will have to work on his partnership with Toure to secure his longterm future. Toure's too important.

So what about the striker then? A left footer, basically, could do the same thing that Henry does in reverse. If Henry's line of attack goes from the left wing to the centre of the box, then imagine Reyes/Van Persie's possible one as being from the right wing to the centre.

That's one possible way of thinking about it.

Ad- I agree that Bentley is a more conventional number 10 than Reyes or Van Persie. Or rather, more Bergkamp-like. But Reyes and Van Persie are from the Cruyff/Maradonna school of the number 10 - beating the man to create space rather than passing into it. Not saying they'll be even a tenth as good as those two, but Maradonna for Argentina largely played the role I detailed above ... and he weren't bad was he?! And he too, like Cruyff, was primarily left-footed.

I don't think Bentley is ready for the responsibility of being a number 10 yet - and he may not be technically capable of doing that... we'll see.

Of course, having both an Henry in his current playing style, and a Reyes/Van Persie makes us, to say the least, a little unusual. But Wenger seems to think that in a lot of situations you can play two deep-lying strikers and break quickly enough to over-whelm the opposition - or just bewitch them into collapsing. And he's largely right.

We'll need alternative options up front - hence the Kluivert/Defoe rumours will persist, even if we do spend 20 million on Reyes, but this might well be what Wenger wants, alongside the obvious things like proper cover for Bobby etc...

And Bobby does turn 31 this week, so who knows how many years he's got left?

There could still be space for Bentley to be the Bergy-style number 10, with VP or Reyes coming out wide....

Whatever, the thinking is clear enough to me.

 

[Adam]

Reyes as a Maradona number ten who creates space by dribbling is almost Kanu - and as i say - it's not economical or as quick as the Wengerball under Bergkamp and it makes Ljungberg on the right less influential.

That's why it is indeed an evolution of our football if we move for a player like him at CF. Not a typical Wengerball hole player.

It's great to have a number ten who is more positionally disciplined, especially when you have the movement of Henry, Pires and Ljungberg all around you - somebody has to pull the strings and bring the threads together.

A left footer could help Wengerball to search new angles and score differently with the left foot - i agree there. This should ideally come from LM otherwise the balance of the team is disrupted by adding a left footed player up front to what is already a left sided dominant team.

To solve a problem - you don't try and play to your strengths and enhance that area; instead you build on what you could be doing with the other half of the pitch (the right).

Toure will bomb up there i'm sure, and somebody feeding him and Ljungberg centrally would work. Kanu can do this as a number ten, but he is a dribbler too and this means he is not as effective or as economical as Bergy. His positional discipline is not quite the same too.

Arsène may push on for a new LM, and move Pires centrally - you'd want Pires somewhere in the team, and when can't cut it physically on the left; he'd be able to be disciplined centrally.

Reyes for LM? I'd love it. Would see goals scored with the left foot - Henry can do it from that angle ala Inter Milan vs Zanetti, but Pires not so much (left footed side foot against Southampton was one). So basically it would be effective from LM. Another thing to add to the team, but not as important as restoring offensive balance by enforcing our right side.

BTW - Lewd; i have only seen him once for Sevilla but i can see how you make comparisons with Henry (obvious less power however). Are there any other things you believe he would bring (could he do a Dennis?)

 

[lewdikris]

I don't think anyone could do a Dennis - although Bentley has the obvious cheek to try the outrageous whilst basically standing still, which is what Dennis does best.

Reyes or Van Persie are both more Henry than Bergkamp.

Only Totti of the big name players in the world really plays that game, and the comparison's not that great.

I'd think also that a left footer might compensate for letting Pires play constantly with the same kind of freedom that he was, say, in the first half vs Villa - where he was all over the place.

A Reyes or Van Persie could cut into his space on the left - kinda like Cole used to do really, until Wenger imposed on him a better positional discipline that has been part of the reason for our massive defensive improvement.

Arsenal's number 10 basically plays alongside Bobby and Freddie, and a left footer could switch over with Bobby, confusing the ****e out of defenses.

That's what I thought Kewell was gonna do, and I don't change my opinion for Reyes or Van Persie.

I don't know if it will effect Freddie or not to be honest.

We're talking about left footers, but Henry and Bergkamp are both equally capable of killer balls on their left foot - who's to say a left footer wouldn't be equally as capable the other way round?

 

[thegame24]

reyes is a quality player, and yes he can do the bergkamp passes very well as he demonstarted against real madrid.

comparing him to maradona is silly as maradona could win anything in any team. he truley is the greatest player past present future. he won the league and cup double with napoli for goodness sake and the world cup single handedly.

reyes is very very good, far far better than bentley who from what ive seen is SOOO overrated and i dont think has a chance in breaking into the first team (prove me wrong if you can, bentley).

being linked to reyes, kluivert and RVP is very good news.

getting kluivert or reyes/RVP will keep arsenal sorted for another 6 seasons.

reyes can play LM or CF. what does this mean?

well.

if henry is injured he can replace.
if pires is injured he can replace.
if ljungberg is injured, we can move pires to the right and reyes left.
he can also play alongside henry when kluivert (if we buy) is not needed, depending on what kind of team we are playing.

he will also eventually take over pires' role as our star LM, unless we buy RVP as he is touted to be next overmars, thus meaning reyes would eventually be our new STAR striker.

that is why it would make total sence to buy reyes. ONE PROBLEM though, he cant speak english and i heard he cant read.

how can this be solved?

well someone on this board said kluivert could help reyes if we bought him too as he can speak spanish.

and i thought to my self hey that makes sence, however getting kluivert and reyes may also change kluivert.

he supposedly is an out going man drinking et etc.
well if wenger gives him some responsibility by helping reyes few the first months, it could very well help kluivert mature as a man and a player.


dont know if it makes sence to you, but its my opinion.

 

[Adam]

Standing still skill - isn't it great!

So this guy would play as a Bergkamp but also adapt to go left and let Pires have a go in the middle.

Wow, wait your turn lads!

Your last sentence - that's the strange part. Pires, Ljungberg (not as much), Bergkamp and Henry are virtually two footed technicians anyhow.

Would this left footed number ten really be that important?

Is this more important than reinforcing our real debateable problem down the right?

Bentley is as close to Bergkamp as they come. It seems himself and the Arsenal staff are doing all they can to promote him as the replacement.

Aliadiere is a dimunutive Henry who isn't so obsessed with the left, while Reyes is a Pires/Henry hybrid of a number ten.

Bentley appears to be the most shape defining Wengerball player we could draft in. There are other signings as you mention, but still they aren't as crafted as Bentley is to be Bergkamp.

 

[arsenal4life]

ONLY ONE QUESTION

WHO IS BETTER

REYES OR RVP ?


-

 

[Webdesignlab]

that is why it would make total sence to buy reyes. ONE PROBLEM though, he cant speak english and i heard he cant read.

how can this be solved?

well someone on this board said kluivert could help reyes if we bought him too as he can speak spanish.

and i thought to my self hey that makes sence, however getting kluivert and reyes may also change kluivert.

he supposedly is an out going man drinking et etc.
well if wenger gives him some responsibility by helping reyes few the first months, it could very well help kluivert mature as a man and a player.


dont know if it makes sence to you, but its my opinion.

It was me that pointed that out. I do think AW is thinking that Kluivert can
a) Help Reyes if he comes
b) Help RvP if HE comes
c) Be a father figure. This will sort out his wayward streak.

This could all backfire with Reyes or RvP becoming p*ssheads also LOL. Never mind I'll buy em a drink.

 

[thegame24]

i have never seen RVP but ive read he could be the next overmars, so then i reckon they are totally different eg

reyes like pires
RVP like overmars.

adam the thing is getting reyes would easily solve the right side problem.

Ljungberg said himself he is playing through pain. getting reyes would shift the load off ljungberg in the games where he is ineffective.

you know we have those games where we just dont create anything well reyes would help as pires could then go on the right.

and if we get kluivert also we could play

Henry Kluivert

Reyes Silva Vieira Pires

there are more combinations if needed, im bored so i will go through them Considering we get kluivert also.

Reyes Kluivert

Pires silva vieira Ljungberg


henry reyes

pires gs pv ljungberg

henry pires

reyes gs pv lungberg

kluivert henry

reyes gs pv ljungberg


this would be soo good for a team like arsenal.

we play such fast footie that the players must get nackered.
now we could give henry a rest
pires a deserved rest
ljungberg could take it easy on his injuries


ANDS people will stop calling us a ONE MAN TEAM argggg

 

[Webdesignlab]

Lauren is fluent in Spanish also. In fact isn't he actually a Spanish subject?

Adam, Lewdikris, thegame24 ... you are getting everyone very excited about Reyes. I hope something comes from it, for I would love to see him here. I know he would suit our game very well.

My votes for Kluivert are well documented, so I will say no more until / if we see him.

 

[lewdikris]

I do think Kluivert's likelihood of coming increases with the signing of either Reyes or Van Persie.

Like the Game said, he would be the one to ease them in. Senderos, Cesc and Wenger also speak Spanish (I have a vague memory Bobby does as well). If Bergy leaves there'll be no other Dutch speakers at the club except Quincey - but i'd guess Van P, like every other dutchman i've ever encountered speaks pretty decent english...

Buying Kluivert and VP gives us a truly bewildering range of options in attack - not too many, but many different line-ups that could cover for all injuries, loss of form, and needs for a break.

And i'd take Van Persie and Kluivert for obvious financial reasons - I like a bargain!

But it's a question of longterm rather than shortterm value which will decide if Wenger went for Reyes and Defoe (expensive, but could be a profitable investment) or Van Persie and Kluivert (which could be just as productive, but would not garner such great possible financial returns...

 

[thegame24]

RVP is cheaper but i would love both it would sort out arsenal for years.

i read that RVP is like the next overmars, if so then i doubt he would be as rotaional as reyes. another thing is ive never seen rvp but ive seen reyes and hes very good.

what we could do is get reyes and kluivert

then keep RVP at feyenoord and keep track of him so that we can buy him afetr a few years.

i have a feeling freddie is gonna retire earlier than he should cause hes had such a bad injury and he says he is still suffering.

another thing i forgot about kluivert is his age. Hes still very young for a striker, it feels so weird cause hes been around for AGES. same age as van nistlerooy i think and as shearer shows you can still be good even in your mid 30s. kluivert could have 5 top seasons at arsenal and if not we stil got ali who i think is still 20 right?

we would be SORTED!

i really hope all this talk is true.

 

[OoDy]

http://www.joseantonioreyes.com/video.htm

For You Guys Who Haven`t Seen Him Play.. Here`s A Goal He Scored Last Season.. Enjoy :wink:

 

[Alexone234]

At 27 Kluivert is hardly a "father figure" He is however a proven goal scorer at all levels that will get some 20epl goals per season. At 27 he still has 4 good years left at top level football. Reyes on the other hand is an all together different proposition. He is young, and trying to establish himself on the top circuit. He is a long term investment.
I don't think the signing of one effects the singing of the other.

 

[Webdesignlab]

http://translate.google.com/translate?u ... uage_tools

I think the 20m may have been Euros, also that was summer. Now dein seems to have upped the ante.

I wonder if it's too late to get him in Jan? He would be very useful this season as he is not cup tied. Great to try him out against Celta.