Lautaro Martinez

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Troopz

Established Member
Martinez don’t have pace, power, areal ability nor is he clinical. He is a grafter with decent skills. If we want striker leading the line vlahovic is better or British one Tammy who isn’t overall great. But is a natural striker.

I wouldn’t mind Tammy replacing Nketiah but for 35-40m there’s absolutely no value in that deal.
 

Rasmi

Well-Known Member
It's clear you haven't watched him much. He has a high level of technical quality for a forward. There's a reason Barça wanted him (they still do, but can't even begin to afford him).

Your narrative is also nonsense. Lautaro is someone everyone in Europe has known about since he was 18 or 19. No one needed the Barça link to 'hype' him, because he's been one of the most important young names for strikers for a long time now. He was (is) a major talent who has translated his talent into early success in his career, and still has room for growth.
Yes he was known about since his racing days. But van der beek has been known across Europe same age and was once linked with real. There were people who were always skeptical about him stepping up. Came to the pl and has struggled to keep up. He was linked with Barca and 2 years later he goes to a pl team that finished 8th twice. It proves my point about not develop last two years
 

Barry

Well-Known Member
you not missing anything. 18 months ago he was linked with Barca and he got a lot of hype. So his name got huge bump. But he was 21 and most of the hype was how he will get better with age. He is the same player he was 2 years ago. When Conte got the Inter job he made a condition on taking the job that he gets a striker that can help him win.

Combination of good agent, coming from huge football country and staving at inter with big reputation as the next big Argentinian striker plays big role in him having big name reputation. At his height I’m not expecting him to bully cbs, but you are so right about lack of explosiveness.

Another myth is him being this technician, he is not and is rather sloppy on the ball. His passing completion is 70%. Laca is 80% and the frustrating Auba is 79%. Last 3 years he has less assists than Auba and same as laca. But most importantly he is being painted as this big player for inter. How often has a big player only completed 90 mins 8 out of 38 games? He does work hard, but tend to run out of steam late in games

I honestly have an open mind on this at the moment but agree with you that his conversion rate of 21% looks pretty bad and he doesn't compare that well to Laca either. He seems to be very highly rated by lots of people though so prepared to accept that I might be missing something.

 

Sebastes

Statbomb Merchant
Trusted ✔️
I honestly have an open mind on this at the moment but agree with you that his conversion rate of 21% looks pretty bad and he doesn't compare that well to Laca either. He seems to be very highly rated by lots of people though so prepared to accept that I might be missing something.

Iirc benchmarking shot accuracy historically the 32.5% Lacazette has isn't sustainable over a long period of time. Would rather look at npxg and xa where Martinez is on 0.49 and 0.16 resp for a combined "expected goal contribution" of 0.65 whereas Lacazette scores 0.35 and 0.13 resp for a total of 0.48.

For further reference Auba has 0.35 and 0.11 last season and Nketiah 0.47 and 0.12 (two last seasons for bigger sample).

Shot conversion, number of shots p90 and shot/touch % are all linked to some extent and if we look at xG/shot we see Martinez being lower than Laca, Auba & Nketiah. But they also shoot much less which would indicate that Arsenal players probably instructed to be more restrictive with taking shots from outside of the box for example.

Interestingly enough Laca, Auba comes in at much, much higher percentiles (mid 80's) of link up play than Martinez who I think is in the 20th percentile (link up data from Smarterscout - I don't quite know exactly how this is calculated though).

Lautaro looks to be in the Aguero mould but his scoring record is far from the latter's and with that in mind, comparing the two is a bit disrespectful of Aguero imho.

All in all I think it's a high risk, high reward signing that you attempt since he looks to fit the mould of what Arteta wants from a striker

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AbouCuéllar

Wishes to get banned elsewhere
Iirc benchmarking shot accuracy historically the 32.5% Lacazette has isn't sustainable over a long period of time. Would rather look at npxg and xa where Martinez is on 0.49 and 0.16 resp for a combined "expected goal contribution" of 0.65 whereas Lacazette scores 0.35 and 0.13 resp for a total of 0.48.

For further reference Auba has 0.35 and 0.11 last season and Nketiah 0.47 and 0.12 (two last seasons for bigger sample).

Shot conversion, number of shots p90 and shot/touch % are all linked to some extent and if we look at xG/shot we see Martinez being lower than Laca, Auba & Nketiah. But they also shoot much less which would indicate that Arsenal players probably instructed to be more restrictive with taking shots from outside of the box for example.

Interestingly enough Laca, Auba comes in at much, much higher percentiles (mid 80's) of link up play than Martinez who I think is in the 20th percentile (link up data from Smarterscout - I don't quite know exactly how this is calculated though).

Lautaro looks to be in the Aguero mould but his scoring record is far from the latter's and with that in mind, comparing the two is a bit disrespectful of Aguero imho.

All in all I think it's a high risk, high reward signing that you attempt since he looks to fit the mould of what Arteta wants from a striker

This is where stats really aren't telling much of the story and system is really biasing them a great deal. You watch Lautaro and you know he isn't really in the Agüero mould so much as he is in the young Benzema mould (Benzema a generational talent and probably a good deal better at his age, but in terms of type).

It's what I mentioned with the Neves debate as well. We really have to pay attention to how drastically a team's playing style is going to affect these sort of graphs.
 

LG10

Well-Known Member
Then who is going to replace Nketiah, Laca and Auba?

There are not many strikers available out there who can drop deep, control the ball well, and create good passing play.

Or maybe we can be smarter to find the next Martinez, just like how Inter found him in the first place.
Laca and auba aren’t going anywhere
 

Sebastes

Statbomb Merchant
Trusted ✔️
This is where stats really aren't telling much of the story and system is really biasing them a great deal. You watch Lautaro and you know he isn't really in the Agüero mould so much as he is in the young Benzema mould (Benzema a generational talent and probably a good deal better at his age, but in terms of type).

It's what I mentioned with the Neves debate as well. We really have to pay attention to how drastically a team's playing style is going to affect these sort of graphs.
Yep. I meant to write about system as well but forgot. I mean having Auba in the 85th percentile for link up play and Martinez in the 20th you can easily say from the eye test how it’s not a stat that in this case reflects their respective ability when it comes to linking play.
 

Hleb's Sirush

Well-Known Member
I thought you like Hleb. And the beautiful football of Van Persie, Hleb, Fabregas, Flamini and Rosicky.

Spain didn’t create enough quality chances. Their build up quality are not good enough. If your players play poorly, any style of football will fail.

It’s not about the amount of build up involvement but also the quality of the involvement. Laca for example, he does drop deep and involve but they are all simple passes and basic stuff.
I do like those players. Really loved to see the likes of Rosicky, van Persie, Pires etc play. You can't have a whole team of just those players though. Imagine having a team of Hleb's? You would probably have 90% possession and wonderful intricate play but none would be able to finish a chance even if their life depended on it.

You need to get over trying to have 11 players who are all technical, brilliant manipulators of a ball.
 

Hleb's Sirush

Well-Known Member
Worst example ever. Spain lost on penalties in the semis which is just super unfortunate.
Busquets, Pedri and Olmo absolutely destroyed Italy, they win that game more often than not.
How is that a bad example. You say they destroyed Italy but were just unfortunate. That is my whole point, they dominated every team they played against but won only 1 game within 90 minutes. When it keeps happening again and again it can't be just unfortunate, it comes down to a lack of an end product. Spain had the highest xG in the whole Euro's.

Btw @Football Manager how can you agree with the above post when it is actually saying the opposite of what you said. That post is saying Spain played great just unlucky. Your reply to me was that Spain didn't create good enough quality chances and that their build up wasn't good enough. So which one do you believe to be true.
 

yorch44

Well-Known Member
How is that a bad example. You say they destroyed Italy but were just unfortunate. That is my whole point, they dominated every team they played against but won only 1 game within 90 minutes. When it keeps happening again and again it can't be just unfortunate, it comes down to a lack of an end product. Spain had the highest xG in the whole Euro's.

Btw @Football Manager how can you agree with the above post when it is actually saying the opposite of what you said. That post is saying Spain played great just unlucky. Your reply to me was that Spain didn't create good enough quality chances and that their build up wasn't good enough. So which one do you believe to be true.
Stop it man, you are arguing with facts VS biased opinions. You will never win that. They are so close minded they think football is played only in one way.
 

Let's play Aubamawang

Well-Known Member
Stop doing this to yourself, Lautaro is not coming here.
but Ødegaard probably will, since Real would go all in for Martinez (just as every major club with CL football)
Real are trying to balance the books so they can make room for Mbappe or perhaps Haaland. Not going to waste their resources on this guy, they want bigger fish.
 

Barry

Well-Known Member
Iirc benchmarking shot accuracy historically the 32.5% Lacazette has isn't sustainable over a long period of time. Would rather look at npxg and xa where Martinez is on 0.49 and 0.16 resp for a combined "expected goal contribution" of 0.65 whereas Lacazette scores 0.35 and 0.13 resp for a total of 0.48.

For further reference Auba has 0.35 and 0.11 last season and Nketiah 0.47 and 0.12 (two last seasons for bigger sample).

Shot conversion, number of shots p90 and shot/touch % are all linked to some extent and if we look at xG/shot we see Martinez being lower than Laca, Auba & Nketiah. But they also shoot much less which would indicate that Arsenal players probably instructed to be more restrictive with taking shots from outside of the box for example.

Interestingly enough Laca, Auba comes in at much, much higher percentiles (mid 80's) of link up play than Martinez who I think is in the 20th percentile (link up data from Smarterscout - I don't quite know exactly how this is calculated though).

Lautaro looks to be in the Aguero mould but his scoring record is far from the latter's and with that in mind, comparing the two is a bit disrespectful of Aguero imho.

All in all I think it's a high risk, high reward signing that you attempt since he looks to fit the mould of what Arteta wants from a striker

Cheers Sebastes, top notch analysis as always. This is what I needed to hear I think! I had missed that he has been underperforming both XG & XA - also his pressing and interception numbers are really high which is promising. Still not sure about the reported fee, but can see why we would be interested.
 

Ash10

Softer than Granit 🤩
Jesus is not a poacher. Otherwise pep wouldn’t love him so much. Pep don’t like poacher. Didn’t even like lewa
It's like people never watched him play. The guy works hard af & is decent at doing a lot of things except for the ones needed for a striker lol

Disagree with you on Martinez tho. Watched him & inter quite a bit last season. No matter how you look at it, he is good.
 

ThePortugueseGunner

Well-Known Member
I think it's very unrealistic to think Lautaro would want to join Arsenal. I know I tend to say this about any decent player that shows up on the Rumours thread, but the truth is, if I were Lautaro, the only thing that could make me want to join Arsenal would be my affection for the club, which he obviously doesn't have.

He's a great striker, playing for the Italian champions and about to play Champions League football, I don't know why he would want to move to Arsenal, even if he wanted out of Milan. He could certainly find better, more organized projects for him.

That being said, of course I would love to have him. Would prefer him to any striker we have.
 

yousif_arsenal

King of Twitter Rumours
Moderator
Bringing lautaro or even Abraham will improve our goal scoring record massively auba can't do it anymore and his form is worrying we can't depend on him laca should leave pepe saka Martinelli i don't think all 3 surpass 25 goals combined
 

truth_hurts

Rob Balding Superfan
Wish people will stop with these pointless percentile stats. He's better at pressing than any forward we have bar Martinelli, technically better than any as well. He does need to score more goals, but he's in his early 20s.

He'd be an incredible signing.
 
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