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Lisandro Martinez

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MikelHadADream

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People bringing up Cannavaro, that's 1 CB in the last 20 years... other short CBs I can think of are Alaba/Puyol/Mascherano. All those guys played in dominant teams that very rarely ever had to defend their box, and even then its a handful of players. Not exactly a large sample size to justify a short CB.

I hope we get this lad, and I hope he plays left back for us. He'd get more time on the ball, be allowed to move into central positions, and would have the deal with the physicality as much. There is no shame in playing fullback, especially in the modern game.
 

TinFish

Well-Known Member
So? Sagna was one of our smallest players and an absolute beast in the air.
Cannavaro was also short for a CB but bossed it in a generation of elite CF's.
If we sign martinez I want him to play CDM. The man has a killer pass. I’m not against this signing.
 

lomekian

Well-Known Member
I have a theory, probably bollocks but eh I'll throw it out there. A few months back Edu talked about different Summer transfer plans depending on where we finished in the league and which competition we qualified for.

With Champions League I think we would have looked at more specialist players.

With Europa League and reduced budget we are looking at versatile players that can fill a few roles.

Vieira, Martinez and to a lesser extent Raphina and Jesus all fit this pattern so far.
But also players that have the potential to be specialists in their best positions - though we all know Arteta craves flexibility.
 

lomekian

Well-Known Member
People bringing up Cannavaro, that's 1 CB in the last 20 years... other short CBs I can think of are Alaba/Puyol/Mascherano. All those guys played in dominant teams that very rarely ever had to defend their box, and even then its a handful of players. Not exactly a large sample size to justify a short CB.

I hope we get this lad, and I hope he plays left back for us. He'd get more time on the ball, be allowed to move into central positions, and would have the deal with the physicality as much. There is no shame in playing fullback, especially in the modern game.
Well, given that we are aspiring to be a team of that nature, it makes sense. Alaba is a decent comparison (though the Austrian is the better player, particularly when breaking forwards).
Either way, this chap wouldn't displace Gabriel at CB except maybe for games we are expecting to be really dominant in possession
 

Garrincha

Wilf Zaha Aficionado
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People bringing up Cannavaro, that's 1 CB in the last 20 years... other short CBs I can think of are Alaba/Puyol/Mascherano. All those guys played in dominant teams that very rarely ever had to defend their box, and even then its a handful of players. Not exactly a large sample size to justify a short CB.
one of his coaches for the national team is Roberto Ayala who had a very similar build
 

Idiotologue

Established Member
People bringing up Cannavaro, that's 1 CB in the last 20 years... other short CBs I can think of are Alaba/Puyol/Mascherano. All those guys played in dominant teams that very rarely ever had to defend their box, and even then its a handful of players. Not exactly a large sample size to justify a short CB.

I hope we get this lad, and I hope he plays left back for us. He'd get more time on the ball, be allowed to move into central positions, and would have the deal with the physicality as much. There is no shame in playing fullback, especially in the modern game.
Baresi, Ayala, Córdoba. There's far more of them than you might think.
 

MikelHadADream

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Well, given that we are aspiring to be a team of that nature, it makes sense. Alaba is a decent comparison (though the Austrian is the better player, particularly when breaking forwards).
Either way, this chap wouldn't displace Gabriel at CB except maybe for games we are expecting to be really dominant in possession
one of his coaches for the national team is Roberto Ayala who had a very similar build
Baresi, Ayala, Córdoba. There's far more of them than you might think.

Good examples. Over the last 20 years though, the amount of good > 6ft CBs far far far surpasses the amount of good <6ft ones.

Also has there ever sub 6ft CB that's seen success in the PL in a back 4? Can't really think of any.

Height and physicality matters in certain positions, just is a fact of sport. I think we get a lot more from LM from LB anyway.
 

SA Gunner

Hates Tierney And Wants Him Sold Immediately
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Watching the "Martinez pockets Haaland" video you can see why we would be interested in Lisandro. The game shows Ajax consistently pushed up and Martinez being and partner (Blind?) being able to marshal Ajax's high line with ease, as well as restart play by finding players between the lines.

Looks a good signing, a fourth ball playing center back, with height options in Gabriel and Holding.
 

MikelHadADream

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Chelsea and Barca are fighting for Kounde aren't they? He is 178.
CM.

Chelsea play with a back 3, it's far more manageable and in some cases advantageous having a short guy playing one of these wide Cbs positions as they can get out to the wide areas better and are more agile.

Barca have historically been able to incorporate smaller cbs because of the way they play the game and the style of the league they're in.
 

drippin

I reject your reality, I substitute my own !!
Chelsea play with a back 3, it's far more manageable and in some cases advantageous having a short guy playing one of these wide Cbs positions as they can get out to the wide areas better and are more agile.

Barca have historically been able to incorporate smaller cbs because of the way they play the game and the style of the league they're in.
We have Gabriel, we have Saliba, Tomiyasu, White.

We have Partey Xhaka.

Regarding defending from open play, it's more about timing and this guy has it.
 

SA Gunner

Hates Tierney And Wants Him Sold Immediately
Moderator
Chelsea play with a back 3, it's far more manageable and in some cases advantageous having a short guy playing one of these wide Cbs positions as they can get out to the wide areas better and are more agile.

Barca have historically been able to incorporate smaller cbs because of the way they play the game and the style of the league they're in.

Barca dominated both their league and world football for 2 years, if not more, with a 178cm center back.

As much as height matters, is it also about the system being played, and the strengths the player brings to that system.
 

MikelHadADream

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Barca dominated both their league and world football for 2 years, if not more, with a 178cm center back.

As much as height matters, is it also about the system being played, and the strengths the player brings to that system.

They had 80% of the ball every game, the dynamics of their matches will be completely different to ours, they hardly ever had to defend the box. Pep uses 3 CBs at City, all of them are well above 6ft...
 

SA Gunner

Hates Tierney And Wants Him Sold Immediately
Moderator
They had 80% of the ball every game, the dynamics of their matches will be completely different to ours, they hardly ever had to defend the box. Pep uses 3 CBs at City, all of them are well above 6ft...

And we have that too, if you think about it. White, Gabriel, Saliba, Tomi and Holding are all center back options over 6ft each. Martinez adds to that, and gives us options at left back and center midfield.

That's good rotation and an alternative tactical option.
 

drippin

I reject your reality, I substitute my own !!
They had 80% of the ball every game, the dynamics of their matches will be completely different to ours, they hardly ever had to defend the box. Pep uses 3 CBs at City, all of them are well above 6ft...
We have Gabriel as 1st choice LCB. He isn't bought for that if we get him, but quality rotation for overall season and likely starting LB.
 

MikelHadADream

Established Member
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And we have that too, if you think about it. White, Gabriel, Saliba, Tomi and Holding are all center back options over 6ft each. Martinez adds to that, and gives us options at left back and center midfield.

That's good rotation and an alternative tactical option.

Yeah I agree with this. I actually think he'd probably be an option at LCB in certain EL/Cup games. But in the majority of PL games I can't see this guy being an credible option over Gabriel.

I think if you look at the makeup of the squad, and the Nuno rumours, all points to him being primarily a LB, but let's see (if we even get him)...
 
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