Mesut Özil: 2019/20 Performances

[bingobob]

Great poll. Answer is B Higuain. Even if he became an overweight blowtard he was what we needed then.

 

[roz]

Who do we listen to? Former assistant manager of Mourinho and Conte and the current assistant manager of the England national team or Oxeki from Arsenal-Mania.com?

Definitely Oxeki. **** anything to do with Mou or the guy that wears a wig

 

[Riou]

Say Mes left us in 2018 instead of signing a new deal, went to PSG for example...I wonder if he would have been more loved at Arsenal in that scenario.

 

[krackpot]

Say Mes left us in 2018 instead of signing a new deal, went to PSG for example...I wonder if he would have been more loved at Arsenal in that scenario.

I think people take out their frustrations of AFC on him.

AFC haven't been anywhere near the top-4 in the past few seasons, and people somehow blame him. Understandeable, I guess.

 

[roz]

I think people take out their frustrations of AFC on him.

AFC haven't been anywhere near the top-4 in the past few seasons, and people somehow blame him. Understandeable, I guess.

Fans dislike him because they see their highest paid player in history more than happy to take his massive paycheque for the absolute minimum effort. His contributions have been close to zero for the past few years and yet he would have everyone believe how much he cares for The Arsenal. To say he’s a lightning rod for criticism of the club is silly imo, just further portraying Özil as some sort of victim.

He’s been made unavailable throughout the season by every manager since Wenger. Its normal to dislike a player with questionable motivation/drive. He brought this on himself, its not some conspiracy or other such excuse we’ve heard shouted out by Özil apologists. He’s been semi retired for years and its hurting the club.

 

[Monstar-Gunn4r]

Say Mes left us in 2018 instead of signing a new deal, went to PSG for example...I wonder if he would have been more loved at Arsenal in that scenario.

He was kind of looking terrible at the time he signed the contract, we would've also had an extra 18 million on his base salary alone to spend. I dont think PSG would've taken him and I think one of the reasons he stayed with us was because of his lack of other options.

He probably would've split opinions with most people thinking we were right to leave him go at the time.

 

[krackpot]

Fans dislike him because they see their highest paid player in history more than happy to take his massive paycheque for the absolute minimum effort. His contributions have been close to zero for the past few years and yet he would have everyone believe how much he cares for The Arsenal. To say he’s a lightning rod for criticism of the club is silly imo, just further portraying Özil as some sort of victim.

He’s been made unavailable throughout the season by every manager since Wenger. Its normal to dislike a player with questionable motivation/drive. He brought this on himself, its not some conspiracy or other such excuse we’ve heard shouted out by Özil apologists. He’s been semi retired for years and its hurting the club.

Even if you are right, who is at fault for the downturn in his performance? Who gave him the contract? Why does he keep getting dropped after the cringy tweets that he is ready?

 

[scytheavatar]

I think people take out their frustrations of AFC on him.

AFC haven't been anywhere near the top-4 in the past few seasons, and people somehow blame him. Understandeable, I guess.

We made him our top earner and one of the best paid midfielders in the league because we expect him to be the one leading us to a top 4 position. Instead he ends up being a snowflake that needs to be sheltered by his teammates. This is what it means to be an ace of a team, you can be the best player of the team and it is still your fault if the team loses. Your opponents can be better and it is still your job to carry the team on your own past the finishing line. Guys like Henry, Cesc, RVP, Sanchez, did that in the past for us. Özil isn't capable of doing that which was why it's such a dumb idea to give him his big contract.

 

[krackpot]

We made him our top earner and one of the best paid midfielders in the league because we expect him to be the one leading us to a top 4 position. Instead he ends up being a snowflake that needs to be sheltered by his teammates. This is what it means to be an ace of a team, you can be the best player of the team and it is still your fault if the team loses. Your opponents can be better and it is still your job to carry the team on your own past the finishing line. Guys like Henry, Cesc, RVP, Sanchez, did that in the past for us. Özil isn't capable of doing that which was why it's such a dumb idea to give him his big contract.

check my post above.

 

[roz]

Even if you are right, who is at fault for the downturn in his performance? Who gave him the contract? Why does he keep getting dropped after the cringy tweets that he is ready?

Only one person that’s responsible for his downturn of form, himself.

Sure we shouldn’t have given him his contract (hindsight is great eh?) but we were vulnerable and I can understand why the club did give in to his demands, It was a statement, no more losing our best players. If we hadn’t there would have been uproar and we couldn’t really handle that at the time considering how things were going. The club doubled down on Özil and lost but they weren’t to know he would decide to essentially hang up his boots.

We’ve been told numerous times he doesn’t play because he’s not putting himself in the frame to be selected. Every manager we’ve had has basically said the same thing. When he has played he’s been crap anyways bar the odd game here or there. Must be incredibly frustrating for any manager to have your most gifted player half arsing it.
The fact is he is responsible for his actions (or lack of in this case) & as a result is no longer a top level player, festering too long allowing his level to drop.
When you see him posting on social media like you mentioned it only enhances my view and comes across as snide and calculating.

 

[musoke]

Please provide some evidence that I slagged off Arteta or delete your comment.

My lawyers have been informed and are on standby.

Talking about LAWYERS.
Arsenal-Mania’s own resident LAWYER “@Kav would also have to be notified. He knows a thing or two about these sports laws.

 

[musoke]

...can't believe he got an extension!

...one for my boy @GDeep™

But mouthy Mourinho has had 3 opportunities to put his mouth where his mouth is on this whole Özil hype, but he always seems to do the opposite.
He does all this big Özil talk all the time but when the moments keep presenting themselves for him to Walk The Talk he is nowhere to be seen. If he is that great like you keep assuring us then why haven’t you signed him for all the clubs he has been at since Madrid? Lol

Example One.

Mourinho is sacked by Madrid in 2013, goes to chelsea, Özil is shown the door that same summer. Mourinho pretended as if Özil was not available. Waited the next summer and got Cesc instead.

Example Two

Mourinho is sacked by Chelsea. Goes to Man United. Özil runs down his contract. Mourinho in giving it his the normal “Özil is such a good player, he needs love and a manager that can...blah blah”. But instead of signing Özil he opted for Sanchez even if Özil was also available.

Example 3.

Gets sacked by Man United. Move to Sp**s. Arsenal are making it obvious that they are ready to offer Özil to whoever is willing to take him off their hands. As always, is Mourinho gonna just Talk the big hype Talk or Walk Özil talk this time?

It’s just curious and weird. So much hype talk when it comes to Özil but no action to back it up.

 

[Hunta]

He’ll be very active on social media this week to try and get himself a cheap medal.

Should be a fun thread.

 

[musoke]

Peak Özil won't make much more difference than currently Özil in this present arsenal side imo

I have always rated the likes of Cesc, Nasri, Hleb, fit Rosicky, fit Wilshere over Özil in the EP for Arsenal. One of those guys in his prime would have made a big big difference to our team right now. They are more a technical/ dominant type that we are missing.

You did not need any stats to make an argument for all those player. All you needed was your own eyes watching them in each game.

Before Özil moved to Arsenal I swear I had never heard of some of the Stats we are drowning in today.. The only stats I could have a quick glance at before the Özil era were maybe the Goals scored, Possession, assists, shots. But not with a fine brush like how people are doing nowadays. Just a glance.

The first time I heard about the “Chances Created” stat was in 2010 when Cesc was angling for a move to Barcelona. I think back then he was in the Top 3 chances created with the likes of Messi. But once he moved to Barcelona I never heard about it again. The moment we signed Özil this Stat was reignited on steroid. We have now become Stat robots. Poor performances you can see with your own eyes are now covered by “But, you are talking rubbish. You know nothing about football. You don’t know what you are talking about. Look at this stat, look at that stat and that stat etc, it shows that so and so has had a brilliant game.”

Can never argue about football like we used to before this Stat madness was introduced. Imagine during the Henry, Vieira, Bergkamp times. We absolutely did not argue Stats back then. We argued actual performances that we witnessed with our own eyes per each game.

Nowadays it’s YouTube clips and fringe Stats that win arguments. Lol

 

[Big Poppa]

The problems in our squad cannot be solved with one "actual top creative midfielder".......... people like you need to understand the days of a Cesc running the show on his own is ancient history. We need better players across the pitch to solve our "creative problem", and yes better defenders would allow Arteta to be less defensive and commit more players high up the pitch. Which is why playing Özil is not going to make any difference, is Özil going to be able to make up for the fact that Kolasanic is ****?

Yep the game has evolved. Creativity is a combination of strong collective on and off the ball play.

Forcing errors from opponents while mitigating their attempts to do the same. You can’t just have a guy walking around passively waiting to play through balls anymore and call that a solution.

A strong defensive base liberates attackers. After that, the pockets of space are in the wide areas where centrebacks hate going, and wingers hate tracking back which is why so many wide players are annihilating assist records.

Teams with the best wingers/wingbacks generally create the most goalscoring opportunities in their leagues.

 

[musoke]

Who do we listen to? Former assistant manager of Mourinho and Conte and the current assistant manager of the England national team or Oxeki from Arsenal-Mania.com?

But that’s their own personal opinion.
Their opinion about Özil is opinion like any normal fan. We all watch football and have our own interpretation of what we witness.
Aren’t their former players or managers that say te opposite to what is being said in that video?

 

[musoke]

This thread still going on? My God, let it rest folks. As much as id like to see Özil in an Arsenal shirt bringing some life to Arteta's dire football, that ship sailed as soon as Özil exercised his right to decline the paycut. Its done boys. Let it go.

Özil. Is. Done.

But that is not how life operates.
As long as Özil is still an Arsenal player taking £350,000 a week and not giving a monkeys about our club and putting in the work to warrent his wages then this thread will keep going.

Remember Rooney at United? Was on £300,000 about week. Over stayed his welcome at united and was just happy to get his wages. Same situation as Özil right now, £350,000 a week but just happy to sit on it and spend most of his time playing online Video games. Rooney was the talk of the media and United fans until he left.

Same with Wenger, over stayed and he was the talk amongst us Arsenal fans and media. Once he left the talk left too.

Same with Bale at Madrid. They have had enough of him. But he is happy taking his massive wages. And he is the talk in Madrid. But once he is gone then hardly anyone will ever mention his name ever again.

And if Özil was not on such massive wages, was not a social media propagandists and didn’t have the over the top hype from his fans then I don’t think we would be spending so much time talking about him. Constant poor performances, poor attitude and mentality all for £350,000 a week is a tough pill to swallow me as an Arsenal fan.
That’s all.

 

[Football Manager]

I have always rated the likes of Cesc, Nasri, Hleb, fit Rosicky, fit Wilshere over Özil in the EP for Arsenal. One of those guys in his prime would have made a big big difference to our team right now. They are more a technical/ dominant type that we are missing.

You did not need any stats to make an argument for all those player. All you needed was your own eyes watching them in each game.

Before Özil moved to Arsenal I swear I had never heard of some of the Stats we are drowning in today.. The only stats I could have a quick glance at before the Özil era were maybe the Goals scored, Possession, assists, shots. But not with a fine brush like how people are doing nowadays. Just a glance.

The first time I heard about the “Chances Created” stat was in 2010 when Cesc was angling for a move to Barcelona. I think back then he was in the Top 3 chances created with the likes of Messi. But once he moved to Barcelona I never heard about it again. The moment we signed Özil this Stat was reignited on steroid. We have now become Stat robots. Poor performances you can see with your own eyes are now covered by “But, you are talking rubbish. You know nothing about football. You don’t know what you are talking about. Look at this stat, look at that stat and that stat etc, it shows that so and so has had a brilliant game.”

Can never argue about football like we used to before this Stat madness was introduced. Imagine during the Henry, Vieira, Bergkamp times. We absolutely did not argue Stats back then. We argued actual performances that we witnessed with our own eyes per each game.

Nowadays it’s YouTube clips and fringe Stats that win arguments. Lol

You are absolutely right.
We need players who are good both on and off the ball. We need that technical/dominant type of players.

 

[Macho]

Wonder where you find those that we can afford.

 

[Big Poppa]

Exactly mate. The games has evolved.

In this tactically detail orientated era, Özil is a huge tactical liability. He can only operates well in one phase of the game (in the final third). And if our team are struggling to get into the final third, he won’t contribute to help our team progressing into this phase. His problem is far from just defending.

These weaknesses of Özil was always there. Even if todays Özil is the same Özil 5 years ago, he will still be out of Arteta’s plan.

Since tactics has started to become more and more complex in the early 2010, there will only be one fate of these kind of players.

(I'm not talking about other #10. Most of them have the dribbling ability and they always helping the team in general play, which makes them still very useful players in todays game. I'm talking about players who focus on just one phase of the game, failing to contribute in other phases.)

Agreed. Failure to adapt to this paradigm shift was a big reason Neo-Wengerball was thwarted by teams that combined the same technical proficiency of his players with tactical discipline and off the ball work rate. As you say, using players who could influence more than just one phase of play.

If Özil was prepared to adjust his game the way Silva did, our midfield would be sorted. But yeah he’s a final third player and that’s pretty much it.