Mikel Arteta: Aston La Vista To The Title?

[Macho]

We lost three league games all season, we reached that landmark literally three games in last season.

I actually did not know this.

 

[GDeep™]

I think I must be an outlier on the Adebayor stuff then. I just never really saw it with him, though he did score a decent amount of goals admittedly. Rated RVP and Eduardo over him, though both had significant injury issues around that time.

I think for me it was because I never viewed him as clinical, even when he was scoring a lot he'd miss quite a lot of really good chances. I found him quite a scruffy player too.

Lacked the grace of a Henry too, but I guess anyone was going to look like a downgrade after Thierry.

Scruffy lol. He was far from scruffy. I would say at his peak he was our Drogba.

Henry, Bergkamp, RvP, Ade, Auba, Giroud etc. would be my ranking if we’re talking our consistent starting strikers, not including the subs or short lived guys like Kanu, Anelka, Eduardo.

 

[GDeep™]

@Blood on the Tracks is always on the sniff though, with his long drawn out paragraphs and weirdo takes.

 

[sergio_giorgini]

Scruffy lol. He was far from scruffy. I would say at his peak he was our Drogba.

Henry, Bergkamp, RvP, Ade, Auba, Giroud etc. would be my ranking if we’re talking our consistent starting strikers, not including the subs or short lived guys like Kanu, Anelka, Eduardo.

Bergkamp was never really a striker for us though was he.

I wouldn’t place Adebayor ahead of Auba for us neither. I don’t see how anyone can really.

 

[Macho]

Henry, Bergkamp, RvP, Ade, Auba, Giroud etc.

Spot on ranking. I'd imagine Jesus will eventually leapfrog quite a few but given he's been here 5 minutes I will refrain.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

You've mentioned this a bunch of times but it doesn't make a lot of sense to me. How are you excited about Arteta and this team then?

That 07/08 was way better than anything else we've seen Arsenal put up in the Emirates era and played some exciting and successful football. We lost three league games all season, we reached that landmark literally three games in last season.

Well I see an Arsenal side on the up currently. Albeit from a weaker position. I don't know where it's going to plateau. That makes me somewhat optimistic.

We went from a top, top side challenging for titles from 97-05i-ish to a top 4 side that given the wind blowing the right way could have a bash at the title every now and then during the vast majority of the Emirates era. It's why I don't care for most of that era. It wasn't as good as I was used to or meeting the expectations the club had taught me to have for it, even if there were reasonable reasons for it. Stadium move, finances, Chelsea under Roman etc

It probably is down to changing expectations tbh. If you're winning the title or at least challenging for it most seasons, dropping down even a little feels bad.

Going from 8th to 5th and starting this season fairly well feels good as it's progress even if it's objectively at a lower level.

I think it's perfectly natural on an emotional level to feel that way. Going up feels better than down irrespective of start point, even if it's not that logical.

 

[jones]

@Blood on the Tracks is always on the sniff though, with his long drawn out paragraphs and weirdo takes.

Witnessing @Blood on the Tracks getting abused by @GDeep™ is easily a top five reason to log into AM.

 

[<<reed>>]

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Spoiler

 

[jones]

Well I see an Arsenal side on the up currently. Albeit from a weaker position. I don't know where it's going to plateau. That makes me somewhat optimistic.

We went from a top, top side challenging for titles from 97-05i-ish to a top 4 side that given the wind blowing the right way could have a bash at the title every now and then during the vast majority of the Emirates era. It's why I don't care for most of that era. It wasn't as good as I was used to or meeting the expectations the club had taught me to have for it, even if there were reasonable reasons for it. Stadium move, finances, Chelsea under Roman etc

It probably is down to changing expectations tbh. If you're winning the title or at least challenging for it most seasons, dropping down even a little feels bad.

Going from 8th to 5th and starting this season fairly well feels good as it's progress even if it's objectively at a lower level.

I think it's perfectly natural on an emotional level to feel that way. Going up feels better than down irrespective of start point, even if it's not that logical.

We were on the up in 08 though. 05/06 we finished 4th but at least got to the CL final, 06/07 was horrible with us finishing 4th, never having been in the title race and getting kicked out by PSV in the Ro16. 07/08 we got some 20 points or so more and were in the title race until the very end.

"Going from 8th to 5th to starting the season well" is pretty much the same thing we've done back then except obviously on a much higher level.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

Scruffy lol. He was far from scruffy. I would say at his peak he was our Drogba.

Henry, Bergkamp, RvP, Ade, Auba, Giroud etc. would be my ranking if we’re talking our consistent starting strikers, not including the subs or short lived guys like Kanu, Anelka, Eduardo.

Not sure why you'd put Adebayor on there and not Kanu. He played more games for Arsenal than Ade.

Anelka deserves to be on that list even though he was only here a couple of years I feel.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

@Blood on the Tracks is always on the sniff though, with his long drawn out paragraphs and weirdo takes.

Coming from the guy who couldn't fathom how to use a knife and fork till he was nearly 23.

The only reason you rate him is that he went on to play for Sp**s anyway.

 

[Macho]

Not sure why you'd put Adebayor on there and not Kanu. He played more games for Arsenal than Ade.

Anelka deserves to be on that list even though he was only here a couple of years I feel.

He did say starting. If we're talking starting and 3 seasons minimum that would be my list as well.

 

[jones]

Not sure why you'd put Adebayor on there and not Kanu. He played more games for Arsenal than Ade.

Anelka deserves to be on that list even though he was only here a couple of years I feel.

Kanu was a sub for most of his time here. He might've had more games but I'm pretty sure Adebayor played more minutes for us in fewer seasons.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

He did say starting. If we're talking starting and 3 seasons minimum that would be my list as well.

Maybe. I'm not sure Bergkamp played 3 seasons as an out and out striker though.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

Kanu was a sub for most of his time here. He might've had more games but I'm pretty sure Adebayor played more minutes for us in fewer seasons.

Yeah, that's true.

By this criteria though no-one from the Henry era is making the list because they just wouldn't have the game time irrespective of how good they were.

Sure Kanu was a bit part but so would Ade have been if he were of the Henry era.

 

[Macho]

Maybe. I'm not sure Bergkamp played 3 seasons as an out and out striker though.

Whilst he had a more creative role under Wenger (and probably beyond not gonna pretend to know) I think arguing whether he was a striker or not is arguing semantics. The man himself referred to his position as shadow striker.

Bergkamp in his own words

It's 20 years since Dennis Bergkamp signed for Arsenal - read his programme notes from his testimonial

www.arsenal.com

I’ve been lucky to have partnerships all over the pitch, not just with forwards – that’s so important in football. The best example might be how I played with Wim Jonk at Ajax. If you have a certain feeling with a player, when he controls the ball, and makes eye contact with you, you know exactly what to do then. In those cases the opposition can do nothing about it. Before Wim even received the ball, we would make eye contact. So I was two steps ahead, because even before he got the ball, I could make the run because I knew what he was going to do. You just can’t stop that.

I have had that relationships with a striker, a midfielder, a winger – you just need the connection. I won’t name names, but there have been players in my career too that I know haven’t got it. They receive the ball and keep their head down, control it, look up, then see the player move, then pass. That’s too late. That might be a reason that I stopped scoring at stages in my career, for the national team as well. If you don’t have that eye contact, you don’t get the service and it takes away part of my game.

Either way, Bergie was so iconic and class he deserves to top as many lists as we can think of. Left the extra bit about players "not having it" because I love a bit of shade plus he explains why his goals were sporadic at points and he didn't blame his position. Just his team mates instead.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

Anyway, I'll concede I was probably a bit harsh on Adebayor. He was good just not really to my taste.

Another ( maybe) controversial opinion on the subject of these guys. Better agent work from his brother and a clearer career path and I think Nicholas Anelka could have have an Henry level career. He was that talented.

 

[Macho]

I think Nicholas Anelka could have have an Henry level career. He was that talented.

Their French national team mates at the time openly acknowledged Anelka was better than Henry, particularly at youth level and talent wise. You ever watched Anelka's documentary on Netflix? I reckon you'd love it despite it not being too Arsenal focused.

Really made sense of his nomadic career and reminded me it was actually way better than I remembered in terms of achievements.

 

[jones]

Anyway, I'll concede I was probably a bit harsh on Adebayor. He was good just not really to my taste.

Another ( maybe) controversial opinion on the subject of these guys. Better agent work from his brother and a clearer career path and I think Nicholas Anelka could have have an Henry level career. He was that talented.

When they were together at Clairefontaine Anelka was definitely rated ahead of Henry. Distinctly remember neither were rated the highest though, the top talent in their age bracket was Louis Saha. Goes to show how player development is rarely lineal

 

[Makingtrax]

Scruffy lol. He was far from scruffy. I would say at his peak he was our Drogba.

Henry, Bergkamp, RvP, Ade, Auba, Giroud etc. would be my ranking if we’re talking our consistent starting strikers, not including the subs or short lived guys like Kanu, Anelka, Eduardo.

Sanchez is in there somewhere. His goals per game is greater than Giroud’s and at times he was fantastic to watch. Been sh!t since but Wenger made him shine.