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Mikel Arteta: Top Of The Klopps

Riou

In The Winchester, Waiting For This To Blow Over

Country: Northern Ireland

Player:Gabriel
Sanchez, Cazorla and Özil not winning one player of the month in their time here, only 1 Arsenal player in the team of the year in 1998 despite winning a Double, that Arsène one above this post...etc.

Some weird decisions with awards not being given to Arsenal players/coach, considering how good we have been, tbh.
 

Oxeki

Match Day Thread Merchant
Trusted ⭐

Country: Nigeria

Player:Saliba
Sanchez, Cazorla and Özil not winning one player of the month in their time here, only 1 Arsenal player in the team of the year in 1998 despite winning a Double, that Arsène one above this post...etc.

Some weird decisions with awards not being given to Arsenal players/coach, considering how good we have been, tbh.
Salah hasn’t won the Premier League player of the month since March 2018, in that time he’s scored 72 goals and provided 27 assists in 121 appearances.

Saw this stuff on twitter. Not sure how true it is.
 

Lidl_Reed

Wants a new name
2.67 PPG from teams not the Champions of Europe or a league in England.

First MOTM since Wenger was sort of okay in 2015

Progressive style of football

3-0 win against Sp**s

Arsenal and Artetaball are back with youth at its head. We're gonna win the league by 2024, bookmark this post
 

Paperino

It’s Timo Time

Country: Sweden
2.67 PPG from teams not the Champions of Europe or a league in England.

First MOTM since Wenger was sort of okay in 2015

Progressive style of football

3-0 win against Sp**s

Arsenal and Artetaball are back with youth at its head. We're gonna win the league by 2024, bookmark this post

A rather repulsive post.
 
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AbouCuéllar

Author of A-M essays 📚
I will say this about Mikel--aside from another big disappointment of mine with him, the lack of success in implementing an aggressive and consistent press--which I'm reminded watching my Spain under Luis Enrique: I want to see more bravery in playing out from the back. I expected much less conservativism in this aspect and it just hasn't been that way. We are way, way too quick to lump it long, something that would seem to go against his ideas (I remember his quote: "I will be worried if we kick it long", in response to a question if playing out from the back against pressure worried him for the problems it sometimes created us--which sounded out of the mouth of Pep).

Watching us tonight and in general under Enrique you see us even passing out to midfielders when they have a midfielder right on their back (a bit like the pass from Ramsdale to Xhaka that resulted in a goal for us, even though the pass was not the best-- we didn't see anything like that or any confidence to do that kind of thing against Brighton, tbh...perhaps the conditions played some role in this, in fairness...). I know in Spain we have this culture now in our DNA and have the benefit that every single kid in the team has come through in this culture and in this way of playing throughout every youth rank, something that makes it easier for Enrique and poorer managers of the past like Del Bosque, but still, at Arsenal now we have very strong, capable in receiving under pressure and playing out, and relatively press-resistant players in our back 6--even if they lack some of the calm and decision making of some of our players for Spain (Busquets mainly, I guess Alonso a bit more than Tierney as well)--I am tired of seeing us take the easy route out so much, leaning towards conservativsm in our way of playing (it seems a feature of Arteta's coaching for our players to be risk-averse, and avoid passes in our own half to players relatively marked or under pressure--I don't like this, it goes too conservative and hurts us in our control of matches and indeed our creation of chances that come from playing out boldly in these situations and breaking a press).

It's early days with this group of players and this back 6, but I am really hoping that the idea behind signing White and Tomiyasu was in part to be a bit more bold and strong in this aspect of our football, and of course Thomas being fit means it's essentially 3 new players of far better quality in this aspect (between Xhaka and Lokonga it's much of muchness, IMO, so I just say these 3) to what we were normally playing with last season. I want to see improvements in this in the coming games...for now Brighton is just a worrisome one-off but if we don't see better in the next few games I will quickly lose patience.
 

Kav

Established Member
I will say this about Mikel--aside from another big disappointment of mine with him, the lack of success in implementing an aggressive and consistent press--which I'm reminded watching my Spain under Luis Enrique: I want to see more bravery in playing out from the back. I expected much less conservativism in this aspect and it just hasn't been that way. We are way, way too quick to lump it long, something that would seem to go against his ideas (I remember his quote: "I will be worried if we kick it long", in response to a question if playing out from the back against pressure worried him for the problems it sometimes created us--which sounded out of the mouth of Pep).

Watching us tonight and in general under Enrique you see us even passing out to midfielders when they have a midfielder right on their back (a bit like the pass from Ramsdale to Xhaka that resulted in a goal for us, even though the pass was not the best-- we didn't see anything like that or any confidence to do that kind of thing against Brighton, tbh...perhaps the conditions played some role in this, in fairness...). I know in Spain we have this culture now in our DNA and have the benefit that every single kid in the team has come through in this culture and in this way of playing throughout every youth rank, something that makes it easier for Enrique and poorer managers of the past like Del Bosque, but still, at Arsenal now we have very strong, capable in receiving under pressure and playing out, and relatively press-resistant players in our back 6--even if they lack some of the calm and decision making of some of our players for Spain (Busquets mainly, I guess Alonso a bit more than Tierney as well)--I am tired of seeing us take the easy route out so much, leaning towards conservativsm in our way of playing (it seems a feature of Arteta's coaching for our players to be risk-averse, and avoid passes in our own half to players relatively marked or under pressure--I don't like this, it goes too conservative and hurts us in our control of matches and indeed our creation of chances that come from playing out boldly in these situations and breaking a press).

It's early days with this group of players and this back 6, but I am really hoping that the idea behind signing White and Tomiyasu was in part to be a bit more bold and strong in this aspect of our football, and of course Thomas being fit means it's essentially 3 new players of far better quality in this aspect (between Xhaka and Lokonga it's much of muchness, IMO, so I just say these 3) to what we were normally playing with last season. I want to see improvements in this in the coming games...for now Brighton is just a worrisome one-off but if we don't see better in the next few games I will quickly lose patience.
How any one can look at the performance against Brighton and conclude that it was a one off performance is truly mind boggling.

This kind of thinking ignores the fact that not only did we loose Brentford, Chelsea and City but that we were comfortably out played in all those games. That Burnley played better than we did. So that only leaves us with Norwich and Sp**s as games where we performed well enough. 5 poor performances and 2 good ones and they want to make it seem like Brighton was the anomaly Lol. 😆

Edit: I agree with the rest of your discussion about how we are risk averse and our application of pressing but as stated elsewhere that is only one aspect of defending as an art and in every other respect we have been just average.

The bigger issue for me is tempo and directness of play. The truth is we are not a possession side but a counter attacking one and our best play over the last Two years has always been on the counter. Arteta knows this and he is trying to change it but he’s not getting the results he wants.
 

The_Playmaker

Established Member
Trusted ⭐
I will say this about Mikel--aside from another big disappointment of mine with him, the lack of success in implementing an aggressive and consistent press--which I'm reminded watching my Spain under Luis Enrique: I want to see more bravery in playing out from the back. I expected much less conservativism in this aspect and it just hasn't been that way. We are way, way too quick to lump it long, something that would seem to go against his ideas (I remember his quote: "I will be worried if we kick it long", in response to a question if playing out from the back against pressure worried him for the problems it sometimes created us--which sounded out of the mouth of Pep).

Watching us tonight and in general under Enrique you see us even passing out to midfielders when they have a midfielder right on their back (a bit like the pass from Ramsdale to Xhaka that resulted in a goal for us, even though the pass was not the best-- we didn't see anything like that or any confidence to do that kind of thing against Brighton, tbh...perhaps the conditions played some role in this, in fairness...). I know in Spain we have this culture now in our DNA and have the benefit that every single kid in the team has come through in this culture and in this way of playing throughout every youth rank, something that makes it easier for Enrique and poorer managers of the past like Del Bosque, but still, at Arsenal now we have very strong, capable in receiving under pressure and playing out, and relatively press-resistant players in our back 6--even if they lack some of the calm and decision making of some of our players for Spain (Busquets mainly, I guess Alonso a bit more than Tierney as well)--I am tired of seeing us take the easy route out so much, leaning towards conservativsm in our way of playing (it seems a feature of Arteta's coaching for our players to be risk-averse, and avoid passes in our own half to players relatively marked or under pressure--I don't like this, it goes too conservative and hurts us in our control of matches and indeed our creation of chances that come from playing out boldly in these situations and breaking a press).

It's early days with this group of players and this back 6, but I am really hoping that the idea behind signing White and Tomiyasu was in part to be a bit more bold and strong in this aspect of our football, and of course Thomas being fit means it's essentially 3 new players of far better quality in this aspect (between Xhaka and Lokonga it's much of muchness, IMO, so I just say these 3) to what we were normally playing with last season. I want to see improvements in this in the coming games...for now Brighton is just a worrisome one-off but if we don't see better in the next few games I will quickly lose patience.
I agree apart from the one off comment. Irrespective of whether we have new players or not. I think we have seen what Arteta is about to be honest. Possession based positional play, with no press and a mid block. I think this team definitely has another level, but he won't find it. It's 5 lanes of attack and 5 lanes or defense with Tierney in the 5 lanes. If he had it his way, his CF would be DCL. He prefers creators rather than finishers. Hence Martinelli and Pepe being marginalised. It is all very choreographed. Players need to be in a certain position dependant on the ball.

What I find irritating is that he cuts off his nose to spite his face. I think it is so obvious that Lacazette suits the way he wants to play much better than Auba. Auba will constantly underperform for us this season unless the game just happens to turn into a transition game like the Sp**s one. Even then, we have more players who are suited to a transition style than we do possession based.

If you forget the CF. Saka, Pepe/Martinelli, ESR, Tierney, Partey. That's 5 players who want to run into space and have quick ball. Ødegaard is the only player who actually suits a possession based style.

What I find interesting is that technical security is required to play under pressure while being risk averse. Playing the ball to players under pressure who just retain and go sideways or backwards. Our players lose the ball a lot. Even Ødegaard. He gets muscled of it quite easily. It's like everything needs to be right for certain players. We don't have players who excel at keeping the ball. It would make more sense to give the ball to the opposition, win it off them and then spring considering we have Centre backs with pace.
 

TornadoTed

Established Member
How any one can look at the performance against Brighton and conclude that it was a one off performance is truly mind boggling.

This kind of thinking ignores the fact that not only did we loose Brentford, Chelsea and City but that we were comfortably out played in all those games. That Burnley played better than we did. So that only leaves us with Norwich and Sp**s as games where we performed well enough. 5 poor performances and 2 good ones and they want to make it seem like Brighton was the anomaly Lol. 😆

Edit: I agree with the rest of your discussion about how we are risk averse and our application of pressing but as stated elsewhere that is only one aspect of defending as an art and in every other respect we have been just average.

The bigger issue for me is tempo and directness of play. The truth is we are not a possession side but a counter attacking one and our best play over the last Two years has always been on the counter. Arteta knows this and he is trying to change it but he’s not getting the results he wants.
I felt the same about the supposed 'strong end' to last season. A few months back I broke down our last 15 games of the year in quite a lengthy post and from memory I picked out three games where we played really well, six where we were unconvincing and six where we were really poor.

The results were OK, much like Burnley and Norwich but three good performances out of 15 wasn't a 'strong end' to the season at all in my opinion.

One good performance and two OK ones this season out of seven games just isn't good enough either, I just don't see any improvement at all.
 

Makingtrax

Worships in the house of Wenger 🙏
Trusted ⭐

Country: England

Player:Saliba
Sad thing is that a lot of them still cry over over Wenger and "the mess" he left behind :lol:
Don't forget the leagues so much harder in the last couple of years, that's why any manager can't get top 4 with Arsenal. :lol:
 

MikelHadADream

Established Member
Trusted ⭐
I will say this about Mikel--aside from another big disappointment of mine with him, the lack of success in implementing an aggressive and consistent press--which I'm reminded watching my Spain under Luis Enrique: I want to see more bravery in playing out from the back. I expected much less conservativism in this aspect and it just hasn't been that way. We are way, way too quick to lump it long, something that would seem to go against his ideas (I remember his quote: "I will be worried if we kick it long", in response to a question if playing out from the back against pressure worried him for the problems it sometimes created us--which sounded out of the mouth of Pep).

Watching us tonight and in general under Enrique you see us even passing out to midfielders when they have a midfielder right on their back (a bit like the pass from Ramsdale to Xhaka that resulted in a goal for us, even though the pass was not the best-- we didn't see anything like that or any confidence to do that kind of thing against Brighton, tbh...perhaps the conditions played some role in this, in fairness...). I know in Spain we have this culture now in our DNA and have the benefit that every single kid in the team has come through in this culture and in this way of playing throughout every youth rank, something that makes it easier for Enrique and poorer managers of the past like Del Bosque, but still, at Arsenal now we have very strong, capable in receiving under pressure and playing out, and relatively press-resistant players in our back 6--even if they lack some of the calm and decision making of some of our players for Spain (Busquets mainly, I guess Alonso a bit more than Tierney as well)--I am tired of seeing us take the easy route out so much, leaning towards conservativsm in our way of playing (it seems a feature of Arteta's coaching for our players to be risk-averse, and avoid passes in our own half to players relatively marked or under pressure--I don't like this, it goes too conservative and hurts us in our control of matches and indeed our creation of chances that come from playing out boldly in these situations and breaking a press).

It's early days with this group of players and this back 6, but I am really hoping that the idea behind signing White and Tomiyasu was in part to be a bit more bold and strong in this aspect of our football, and of course Thomas being fit means it's essentially 3 new players of far better quality in this aspect (between Xhaka and Lokonga it's much of muchness, IMO, so I just say these 3) to what we were normally playing with last season. I want to see improvements in this in the coming games...for now Brighton is just a worrisome one-off but if we don't see better in the next few games I will quickly lose patience.

If anything I think we are too predictable under Arteta. We persist with playing from the back, but when this fails and the opposition successfully presses us into a corner, we then resort to the hoof. I think it's easy for the opposition to do this as well have certain set ways of moving the ball from the back, and lack variety. It's easy for them to plan for us before games.

We should utilise the direct ball more often, as Liverpool do. If you watch them, they are really good at playing from the back, but often when the fullbacks have it especially, they play a direct ball in behind for Salah/Mane to run onto. It makes them less predictable, and teams naturally drop off. We have the players up front to do this: Auba/Saka/Pepe all are a big threat in behind, but we never really utilise this.
 

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