Mikel Arteta: Mid-table Mikel

Do you think that Arsenal should continue with Arteta for the next season?

  • Yes

  • No


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Iceman10

Well-Known Member
Did I say I agree with Arteta’s tactical approach? No. I made a post pointing out his tactical flaws.

He can be the worst manager in the world, but it doesn’t stop the fact that we have a shxt squad. Our squad is utter shxt.

@Arsenal1508

Our CM needs work and full back positions are problematic with Bellerin lacking edge and Tierney out so much. We should be more productive than we are with our attacking players though. We should still be 6th to 7th overall in PL at least, and so we are underachieving.

I don’t think it is so much technical quality of players though as it is to do with an overall rotten culture and softness in the dressing room that still needs to be fixed, but cannot be until we thin out further the senior ranks in the squad that are just picking up fat paycheques rather than being good role models for our younger players. Regardless of what happens to Arteta this culture needs to be fixed, not just a repeat of what happened with Özil with other players where time is wasted with a “clean slate” where players play well for a new manager for a few months before reverting back to type.
 

Iceman10

Well-Known Member
We sacked our entire scouting department which cost us less than 5 M per year. 11 M is a high enough number to be a factor I think. But we will see.

To fix underperformance it is probably a lot for owners/board lacking ambition, but if it is underperformance with a dressing room spiraling out of control I don’t think it will stop action being taken. It all depends on whether Arteta loses the dressing room to levels Emery did.
 

Football Manager

Copy & Paste Merchant
Our CM needs work and full back positions are problematic with Bellerin lacking edge and Tierney out so much. We should be more productive than we are with our attacking players though. We should still be 6th to 7th overall in PL at least, and so we are underachieving.

I don’t think it is so much technical quality of players though as it is to do with an overall rotten culture and softness in the dressing room that still needs to be fixed, but cannot be until we thin out further the senior ranks in the squad that are just picking up fat paycheques rather than being good role models for our younger players. Regardless of what happens to Arteta this culture needs to be fixed, not just a repeat of what happened with Özil with other players where time is wasted with a “clean slate” where players play well for a new manager for a few months before reverting back to type.
Who? We lack creative quality in our midfielders. We lack creative quality and quantity in our attackers. That’s why we can’t build up. No build up, no possession, no possession, no chance, no chance, no goal. Who the fxxk cares if you are world class in finishing?
This is what I have posted in the auba thread, read and you will understand:

Just look at how Citi plays. They have a team of creative players. It does not matter who is finishing the chances, because if you create enough of them, your team WILL score a lot of goals.

Citi could have anyone playing the striker role, could be KDB or anyone, and the striker don’t even have to score a lot. The main point is, their whole team is creating plenty of chances. The rest just comes down to having anyone to simply get into the box at the end and tap-in an easy goal.

We need a skillful striker, someone like Suarez/Firmino/Van Persie/Sanchez, or can be a Ødegaard with better finishing (you know what I mean). Someone who could work well with other technical players in the team. Auba, Nketiah or even Laca, are too much of a poacher to me. They are not skillful enough.

Having Auba on the pitch means one player down in the build up, meaning less possession, less chances created, more possession lost, more opportunities for the opponent to counter attack.

In other words, if auba plays, we will struggle to create chances, simply because we have one less creative player on the pitch playing against the same number of opponent defenders. And more importantly, it does not only reduce the number of chances we create, the quality of our chances will also be lowered (having 4 creative players vs a block of defenders, is very different to having 5 creative players against a block of defenders).

I would rather have the above mentioned striker scoring no goals for the season, than a 30 goals Auba. Because it means we would have a much more dangerous attacking force as a team.

People have been asking why Auba was not scoring enough. They asked how many goals would Pepe score this season. They compare the scoring stats of Laca to strikers in other teams........

These questions doesn’t mean much to me. In fact, it’s not just down to the individual performance of the player you questioned. It’s not about if their finishing is/isn’t on spot, or if they have/haven’t scored a lot. It doesn’t matter. If your team have created enough chances, your attacking players WILL score.

It’s the fact that we do not have enough creative talent in the team, which has limited the quantity and quality of chances we created. So my criticism is not that these players are not performing (on an individual level), but rather, they are not a creative player so they have limited our chance creation.

There are only few moments in a match that a striker would score goals. How about the other 87 minutes? Being useless in those minutes?

Strikers are also responsible for creating overload, making good combination passing play in the build up, dribbling defenders to create your own space/chance...basically creating possession/chances, and also helping with pressing if needed.

Auba is a great goal scorer, but he is useless in the other 87 minutes. Having a better footballer in the team instead of auba, who would contribute in those minutes would massively improve the quality/quantity of our chance creation.

There is no place for poacher in modern football. What’s the point of having a great goal scorer but he is useless in the remaining 87 minutes? Why not having someone who could contribute a lot in the build up while also good at finishing? (I know these players comes expensive, but my point is, modern football demand strikers to be more than just scoring goals).
Football is more than just doing nothing for the 87 minutes, and then make a great final pass/finish a great goal.

In these minutes, you have to

1) get the team from your own box to the half way line
2) from the half way line to the opponent box
3) finding a way to break down the opponent defence
4) to pass the ball into the 6 yard box with your striker unmarked.
5) finish the chance

Without 1) to 4), how could you possibly going to get 5)?

Look at how we struggle to even get across the half way line against liverpool. We need more technical/skillful players in the team, with better passing ability, close control.....in order to complete 1) to 4), creating chances after chances.

Having auba and laca on the pitch is like 2 man down in that process, that’s why we failed to create anything.

I was against the signing of auba, laca and Özil back then. And never liked Nketiah. Simply because they are the type of players who are only good at 5) (near the final stage of getting the goal). But they are completely useless in the other 87 minutes. We need more Sanchez, Van Persie, Cazorla, Nasri, Hleb, Fabregas, Arshavin, Rosicky.....who would make huge impact in creating space/possession/chances/break down opponent’s defence, before we arrived the opponent box.

After all, it’s not just about finishing. Just look at City. If you have enough creative players to create plenty of high quality chances, you just need anyone to get into the box to make an easy tap-in. They don’t have to be world class finishers. Auba in the team is limiting the quantity and quality of our chance creation, simply because we are one man down in the build up/chance creation process, we are less capable to break a solid defence down.
 

Football Manager

Copy & Paste Merchant
We need at least 5 purchase to be done in the summer to fix the squad.
Edouard will be a great auba/laca replacement.
Gouiri is phenomenal. We can play him as a inside forward with Pepe/Saka on the opposite side (or a false 9 if Edouard is not playing).
Aouar as the attacking midfielder (or Puig).
And also with Buendia in the midfield alongside Partey.
Then our upgrade for attackers/midfielders are completed.
And then we just need to get Hakimi, and play him with Gabriel, Saliba, Tierney.

No more walcott, giroud, chamberlain, Özil, ramsey, Auba, Laca, Nketiah.........these one dimensional limited dogshxt, get the fxxk out of my club. We need more Hleb, Fabregas, Cazorla, Sanchez, Van Persie, Nasri, Arshavin......
 

Iceman10

Well-Known Member
Who? We lack creative quality in our midfielders. We lack creative quality and quantity in our attackers. That’s why we can’t build up. No build up, no possession, no possession, no chance, no chance, no goal. Who the fxxk cares if you are world class in finishing?

If you’re telling me Arteta is tapping potential with Saka, ESR, Pepe, Martinelli, Auba, Laca (and Ødegaard), I cannot agree. Remember this is a thread primarily about Arteta’s job performance. For squad analysis there will be room for improvement, but those attacking players we already have should be more than good enough for Top 6. I’ll let others argue this out with you if they wish, this is not an argument that interests me really. I think there is too much thinking here at A-M in general about getting in premium players rather than questioning so much why we aren’t getting more from whatever we have.
 

Football Manager

Copy & Paste Merchant
If you’re telling me Arteta is tapping potential with Saka, ESR, Pepe, Martinelli, Auba, Laca (and Ödegaard), I cannot agree. Remember this is a thread primarily about Arteta’s job performance. For squad analysis there will be room for improvement, but those attacking players we already have should be more than good enough for Top 6. I’ll let others argue this out with you if they wish, this is not an argument that interests me really. I think there is too much thinking here at A-M in general about getting in premium players rather than questioning so much why we aren’t getting more from whatever we have.
I have said it again and again. I have pointed out Arteta’s tactical flaws.
He can be the worst manager in the world, but this doesn’t change the fact that our squad is shxt.

I think you have seen what I have posted about auba. Never rated him, never wanted him to join. We went from Bergkamp, Henry, Van Persie, Sanchez, and then now......Aubameyang. His on the ball ability is not even league 2 level.

I don’t care if he is finishing/not finishing his chances. He is being a walcott for the other 87minutes, and our build up is hugely affected because of that. It then resulted in huge reductions of possession/chance creation...Add laca(who is only marginally better) and nketiah into the equation and the suffering is exponentially magnified.
 
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Arsenal1508

Mods are unethical! Özil, come assist me please!
We need at least 5 purchase to be done in the summer to fix the squad.
Edouard will be a great auba/laca replacement.
Gouiri is phenomenal. We can play him as a inside forward with Pepe/Saka on the opposite side (or a false 9 if Edouard is not playing).
Aouar as the attacking midfielder (or Puig).
And also with Buendia in the midfield alongside Partey.
Then our upgrade for attackers/midfielders are completed.
And then we just need to get Hakimi, and play him with Gabriel, Saliba, Tierney.

No more walcott, giroud, chamberlain, Özil, ramsey, Auba, Laca, Nketiah.........these one dimensional limited dogshxt, get the fxxk out of my club. We need more Hleb, Fabregas, Cazorla, Sanchez, Van Persie, Nasri, Arshavin......
You spent a lot of time on this post - well done :)

Do you honest think these players would want to join a team that is midtable and not even in Europe? You'd have to question their ambition.

Only probably Buendai has we're a step up. The others you mentioned - why would they want to join us -.....only if we gave them silly wages really.
 

Football Manager

Copy & Paste Merchant
If you’re telling me Arteta is tapping potential with Saka, ESR, Pepe, Martinelli, Auba, Laca (and Ödegaard), I cannot agree. Remember this is a thread primarily about Arteta’s job performance. For squad analysis there will be room for improvement, but those attacking players we already have should be more than good enough for Top 6. I’ll let others argue this out with you if they wish, this is not an argument that interests me really. I think there is too much thinking here at A-M in general about getting in premium players rather than questioning so much why we aren’t getting more from whatever we have.
I am good with people saying Arteta is shxt.
We can criticise his man management, tactics, vision.....We can say he is shxt in all that.

But what I can’t stand is that some fans are claiming our players are good enough as a point to target Arteta. I am not having that.
 

Macho

Has Trust Issues With Processes
Trusted
I am good with people saying Arteta is shxt.
We can criticise his man management, tactics, vision.....We can say he is shxt in all that.

But what I can’t stand is that some fans are claiming our players are good enough as a point to target Arteta. I am not having that.
Good enough for what?
Did I say win the league?
Or even top 4?

Think what you want about the players but they are better than 10th, Wenger and Emery got 5th/6th with the same guys you are calling sh*t. Emery was only 2 seasons ago.

Then you wonder why people ignore your posts.
 
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yorch44

Well-Known Member
I am good with people saying Arteta is shxt.
We can criticise his man management, tactics, vision.....We can say he is shxt in all that.

But what I can’t stand is that some fans are claiming our players are good enough as a point to target Arteta. I am not having that.
Because you have teams like Leicester or even Leeds doing great things with players you could call average (Leeds) or good.

I don't think Madison is better than Ode, Saka or ESR. I think those 4 are at similar levels. Even Pepe you could see he has potential but he needs consistency which it's impossible to get playing 20 mins once a week.

Tielmans I agree, he is a very good player which is one position we need to reinforce, but Partey I don't think he is below Ndidi. Perez definitely not above Ode or ESR. Auba was performing so well before the team started to play **** and Arteta put him as LW.
 

yorch44

Well-Known Member
I am good with people saying Arteta is shxt.
We can criticise his man management, tactics, vision.....We can say he is shxt in all that.

But what I can’t stand is that some fans are claiming our players are good enough as a point to target Arteta. I am not having that.
We are competing for points against this players. They just ascend from championship. You telling me they have same level or better than us?
 

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Football Manager

Copy & Paste Merchant
Good enough for what?
Did I say win the league?
Or even top 4?

Think what you want about the players but they are better than 10th, Wenger and Emery got 5th/6th with the same guys you are calling sh*t. Emery was only 2 seasons ago.

Then you wonder why people ignore your posts.
How much better than 10 do you think? 7? 6?
You think I am trying to down play Arteta’s fault? No! I think he has huge problems in his tactics.

But at the same time, our players are shxt. I have waited for 10 years to ship out the trash in our squad. What did we do? We sell one out and get two in. This is why our squad is piled up with these unskillful shxt. 10 years of my waiting time is not enough to express my anger towards the club’s recruitment?
 

Football Manager

Copy & Paste Merchant
Good enough for what?
Did I say win the league?
Or even top 4?

Think what you want about the players but they are better than 10th, Wenger and Emery got 5th/6th with the same guys you are calling sh*t. Emery was only 2 seasons ago.

Then you wonder why people ignore your posts.
What does it have to do with Wenger/Emery?
Because they were over achieving, the players can not be shxt?

They are shxt, regardless of the manager anyway. Otherwise I would not be wasting 10 years of my time waiting for the club to get them out.

That doesn’t mean Arteta has less to be blamed.

We have two problems, 1) the manager, 2) the recruitment/players.
 

Oxeki

New Threads, Old Tweets
Its funny you should say that.

Do you know who's top of the list of the best statistical dribblers this season? Adama Traore. One of the more average dribblers in the league, however he beats players through sheer pace and power, so he's up there. You know who else is in the top 4 dribblers in the league? Lookman and Zambo Anguissa. So I assume because the stats say so, you also think Zambo Anguissa is one of the best dribblers in the league? Better than Salah? Better than Zaha? Better than Grealish?

What exactly are you basing that on then? I'd like to know. Because Pepe was also poor under Emery, in fact he's been better under Arteta. He might just not be right for this league? Saka has been outstanding under Arteta so your argument is about as dead as your posting.

I know you dislike my opinions, but for the love of God formulate a decent argument instead of going on the offensive and instead of just jumping on the back of someone else's argument against mine.
Yeah, it doesn't stop the fact that Pepe is was statistically one of the best dribbler no matter how you try to twist fact and do your mental gymnastics.
I thought you used to like stats?
Only when it suits your agenda I guess.
 

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