Mikel Arteta: Miktoria Concordia Crexit

[farzad4daarse]

Some weird couple of pages, wishful thinking about Wenger coming back just to maybe make you feel better about your Wenger out past? It's not like you're going to apologize to Wenger directly for your past sins.

You got it wrong, it happens.

Ok you convinced me don’t bring him back. Who cares, my conscience is clear buddy in life and as a football fan. I frankly won’t even mention his name anymore because he hasn’t been at the club for well over three years. If the club rightly or wrongly fired him years ago it is kind of irrelevant to me now. This is a silly conversation. Let’s get to talking about things that really matter like XG.

 

[Makingtrax]

Ok
tbh Arteta has struggled &certainly had difficulties but i also think he has shown he can be decent manager at times.
Now what im hoping hoping is that he develops into a top one.


Now. It may be a stretch but what about if Tets & his young team actually does well?

Will you just keep moving the goal posts for what is a decent manager?

Im guessin you still keep quoting third rate stats that suit your agenda

I don’t have an agenda. Made my position clear a long time ago. When we‘re playing entertaining football and regularly in the top 4 like we were before it wasn’t good enough for our fans, I’ll be very supportive. The odds for winning the league spending 5th are long so it’s not exactly a self entitled position.

 

[Kav]

If Arsenal lose heavily against Man U, does it undermine the work done over the last 11 games or so?

A single result should not be used to judge an entire season. However we have already got a few pastings this season. Surely we ought to be doing something about it by now?

 

[farzad4daarse]

If Arsenal lose heavily against Man U, does it undermine the work done over the last 11 games or so?

A single result should not be used to judge an entire season. However we have already got a few pastings this season. Surely we ought to be doing something about it by now?

Not really we almost always lose at OT and and Anfield even when the club is strong. I actually think we will win, we did them last year at OT I think we are better this year and they are worse. I like the fact that we are tied on points with 4th and have youngest side in the league. That should be enough to give people something to cheer for, or you would think at least.

 

[El Duderino]

If Arsenal lose heavily against Man U, does it undermine the work done over the last 11 games or so?

A single result should not be used to judge an entire season. However we have already got a few pastings this season. Surely we ought to be doing something about it by now?

Not really. I think the GD is a bigger problem than losing to United.

Mind you, they're certainly beatable and we should be aiming for 4 points at least between them and Everton.

If we fix the change creation problem, we can get top 4.

 

[farzad4daarse]

Not really. I think the GD is a bigger problem than losing to United.

Mind you, they're certainly beatable and we should be aiming for 4 points at least between them and Everton.

If we fix the change creation problem, we can get top 4.

Yep we start scoring and create a few more chances I think we got a top side in the making.

 

[Riou]

If Arsenal lose heavily against Man U, does it undermine the work done over the last 11 games or so?

A single result should not be used to judge an entire season. However we have already got a few pastings this season. Surely we ought to be doing something about it by now?

We shouldn't be losing heavily to this United team, tbh...a tight loss won't change much, but a heavy defeat will raise questions about what we can do this season (especially after how poor Arteta was last season)

Liverpool are a level above us...they are going for the title, we are going for Europe...the team we are playing on Thursday are definitely not a level above us.

 

[mirrorstares]

Feels pretty obvious at this point he'll stay the full length of his contract, the project needs new forwards so that means he'll be around next season even if we fail to get Europe again, and results are better than our last season around this time so there's your "improvement".

 

[AbouCuéllar]

You make some valid points.
I will always give massive credit to what Arsène did for many years with his hands tied financially.
However I have also said Sp**s & Leicester surpassed us on Arsenes watch when he had good money & spent .

The last great chance we had to win the title was the year Leicester won it.
The current big 4 were all in transition at the same time (that will likely never happen again)
It was the perfect storm & opportunity for us as a stable club with a top manager to win.

We never actually got close to even challenging. We sneaked 2nd coz Sp**s imploded at the end.
Arsène great as he is/was then dropped out of the top 4 when the ( Big 4) got their act together.

We then became a 5th-8th place team which is what we have been now for 5 seasons.
Because of the current level & spending that is where i expect us to stay.
I do think we are hopefully on an upward curve though & should get back in Europe & top 6 again after a really poor couple of league campaigns.

Agreed about 15-16, naturally.

My point about 10-16 is more theoretical; 10-11 not so much because we had the talent to win the title that season, a more talented squad than United's that season, for me. But between not having the assertiveness to make a defensive signing and perhaps an experienced midfield signing that might've made the difference, and muscular injury problems that we can't deny were endemic to Arsène's reign / perhaps outdated at that point training, preparation, and injury prevention methods, we didn't end up close.

11-15 is more in the alternative history where we did the right things to win the title in 10-11, and we could've pushed on from there and kept some of our star players; though I think 14-15 to some extent was even on the cards had we had a better, more aggressive summer going into that season and had a more top level manager tactically (that is the first season, I, a up until then fervent Arsène defender, started to have to admit that there were genuine issues with his managerial ability wrt to his competitors)...Chelsea ran a rather weak league that season with the same Mourinho who was at the end of his viability as a modern technician (12-13 this became rather obvious with Madrid, though the step down in tactical level at that point from Spain to England did him well).

Anyways, your summary is, typically for you, accurate.

 

[farzad4daarse]

We shouldn't be losing heavily to this United team, tbh...a tight loss won't change much, but a heavy defeat will raise questions about what we can do this season (especially after how poor Arteta was last season)

Liverpool are a level above us...they are going for the title, we are going for Europe.

Yeah good point if we roll over like against city or LFC that would be very troubling. I think it is going to be close match one way or the other. So far against the biggest teams we have stank up the joint, it isn’t too surprising there is a gulf in class but more important there is a massive gulf in experience.

 

[ExtjExhtts]

No, this isnt a game we should lose.

 

[Riou]

Yeah good point if we roll over like against city or LFC that would be very troubling. I think it is going to be close match one way or the other. So far against the biggest teams we have stank up the joint, it isn’t too surprising there is a gulf in class but more important there is a massive gulf in experience.

So far, we have done well in the games that will play the biggest part for us getting Champions League.

We beat Sp**s and Leicester (who are going for the same target this season as us) and they are more important than any of the games against the "Big 3" for us, tbh...as they will be our 6 pointers this season.

United (and West Ham not long after that) will be our big tests.

 

[farzad4daarse]

Yep Sp**s is only 4 points off and has a match in hand, the big game for me in this run is the home match against West Ham that is a six pointer so to speak as well

 

[Rex Banter]

The way he works out and eats, he should have another decade in him.

You want to tell him that?

“Yes you’re almost 90 but no retirement for you Arsène. Your club needs you”

 

[Barry]

What’s rotten about a club in 5th stacked with young talent?

Get Arsène in as a mentor to everyone. He’s our Cruyff.

@Rex Banter nailing it here. Wenger's biggest strength has always been setting the culture of the club. His character is incredible. If the board benefits from that judgment and vision but takes him out of the day to day firing line then I don't see the problem with that. Obviously Wenger might not want anything to do with them which would be fair enough but I think it would be great for the club if he comes back on the board as an Non Executive Director or whatever they want to call it.

 

[Rex Banter]

@Rex Banter nailing it here. Wenger's biggest strength has always been setting the culture of the club. His character is incredible. If the board benefits from that judgment and vision but takes him out of the day to day firing line then I don't see the problem with that. Obviously Wenger might not want anything to do with them which would be fair enough but I think it would be great for the club if he comes back on the board as an Non Executive Director or whatever they want to call it.

I want him in there making football decisions tbh. Even if he’s not got final say.

Biggest example of what a don he is was in summer 2017. First time we failed to qualify for the CL in decades and we were at a low point:

He still got us further than the likes of Utd and City with MBappe. We were genuinely in the mix with PSG because Wenger had that clout to get a three hour chat with Kylian and try to win him
over.

Genuinely think if we had CL we’d have got him. Who else in world football is able to do that. The guy is one of the great football minds of all time. We’re missing out not having him around.

 

[Barry]

If Arsenal lose heavily against Man U, does it undermine the work done over the last 11 games or so?

A single result should not be used to judge an entire season. However we have already got a few pastings this season. Surely we ought to be doing something about it by now?

I think if we lose heavily it does undermine it to be honest. We need to be able to stand toe to toe with our rivals to compete ultimately.

 

[Blankety Blank]

I don’t have an agenda. Made my position clear a long time ago. When we‘re playing entertaining football and regularly in the top 4 like we were before it wasn’t good enough for our fans, I’ll be very supportive. The odds for winning the league spending 5th are long so it’s not exactly a self entitled position.

Ok I love to be entertained but would sooner win a trophy than play entertaining football.

Fountains of knowledge & older viewers will understand that George Graham played some of the dullest football imaginable.
It was many levels down from what you see today. However he won us cups & titles. '1-0 to the Arsenal'

He left the club with an organised & structured solid defence that was the absolute bedrock of Arsène's early success.

Im really not sure he gets enough credit for that?



I always try to look at the bigger picture & find some balance & context

It is hard to find on a football forum

I say the overall standard of the league is higher & so getting top 4 is a lot harder now as Arsène found out towards the end.

I also think coaching & tactics has evolved a lot in the last few years.
We have moved onto younger coaches & very few of the older guard are now left

Now i see top managers from Arsenes prime era like Carlo & Rafa struggling to keep Everton top 10.

Back in the day Everton used to challenge for top 4/6.

Everyone says Mourinho is now washed up, i cant stand him but there is no denying he was a top level coach back in the day.

Has the game just moved on & the older coaches have not or is the Prem league simply tougher?

Perhaps its a bit of both?

 

[farzad4daarse]

@Rex Banter nailing it here. Wenger's biggest strength has always been setting the culture of the club. His character is incredible. If the board benefits from that judgment and vision but takes him out of the day to day firing line then I don't see the problem with that. Obviously Wenger might not want anything to do with them which would be fair enough but I think it would be great for the club if he comes back on the board as an Non Executive Director or whatever they want to call it.

I said the same thing and got half a dozen Dohs from the Homer Simpson clones on here look out

 

[GDeep™]

Anyway, hope we beat Utd, must win these games to get top 4, like I have said a million times - I think we’ll finish 4 or 5th.

Would be disheartening to drop points here. Big test of the process you can say.