Mikel Arteta: Aston La Vista To The Title?

[Finesse]

Arteta is a very promising young manager and we all have to accept this is his first rodeo. He has and will make mistakes. At this level for a club this size he will always be under the eye of a microscope. Those are the demands of this club. What we can accommodate as progress , maybe is what sends a manager packing down at the Bridge. This is football.

I think he has a very good squad many clubs apart from City , Liverpool and arguably United will be happy with. Rogers and Ancelotti would be squeezing honey out of this bunch. Rogers especially. We are not as bad as he made us look during the rot. It was just bad team management and poor man management that led to a total dysfunction. The team was beating all the worst records in the club’s history until we got a CAM playing. ESR via necessity due to injuries. Then we go 6 games in the PL with 14 for and 2 against ( goals ) . The most in form team behind City. That’s hardly bad players who decided to look good because of ESR.

It was simply relying on players and a system that did not bring the best out of the entire team. Simple. A simple tweak with those players out and the right players played in the right positions and boom the team creeped into form. Now the team picks itself.

I hope he learned from this. The mistake started in the summer when we failed to address the CAM situation in the market , put faith in Willian for that role , froze out our best option for the role and went into the season trying all kinds of formations to negate the need of a CAM or trying Willian to no avail.

Apart from this and some rookie man management issues , you cannot fault the defensive structure and the record defensive stability. Winning games away now has become a smooth issue and we had issues there right back to Arsène’s final years. I have heard he has till the end of the season to keep this afloat to earn the kind of incomings he wants. Hence the decision to tie the purse string this window. Edu will have to work out a very efficient management player structure with Arteta to get the kind of uncontested backing they desire. Simple issues like Laca running down his deal and value again , Eddie same shoes , Chambers , Elneny , etc. When will this club start selling players at the right time , keeping value and generating funds from its assets ? Arsène and DD at one staged earned it and we got behind them at every inch. Arteta and Edu have my backing and I remain very constructive in my analysis despite this. It’s no black and white issue.

 

[Moah]

But surely your eyes can see even if the story is BS the sentiment is correct?

Everyone keeps on taking the "eye test" road when they can't defend their points with facts.

 

[HairSprayGooners]

Everyone keeps on taking the "eye test" road when they can't defend their points with facts.

What do you have to defend exactly? The facts are he's incredibly inconsistent, and everyone can see that from his performances.

 

[Moah]

What do you have to defend exactly? The facts are he's incredibly inconsistent, and everyone can see that from his performances.

Inconsistent run of games = inconsistent performances. You couldn't prove that he needs time and space to make a difference so you went with the eye test.

 

[HairSprayGooners]

Inconsistent run of games = inconsistent performances. You couldn't prove that he needs time and space to make a difference so you went with the eye test.

The proof is in the pudding, look at Salah. Strong foot is his left and he mainly cuts in from the right, makes split second decisions and has fantastic tight close control, hes direct and always beats his man with ease.

Now compare to Pepe, who needs way more time to do anything, often tries to beat his man again and again and again before getting anything off. Tight ball control isnt amazing but its good enough he just never seems to have the drive to go past people.

And the main problem is he doesnt have a right foot so teams show him onto his left and if they close him down he does nothing.

The difference in France is he had more space and more time. In the premier league he has way less space and time due to the pressure and high intensity.

Its not rocket science.

 

[Baguette]

@Finesse We didn’t all of a sudden change system in the Chelsea game and stick with it, we’ve played the same system since the international break after the Villa loss. The only difference was that ESR, who’s been injured for most of the season, became fit for first team selection. A variety of different players were tried in the number 10 role such as Willian, Lacazette and Willock but they didn’t seem to work too well. To add to our woes, our best players such as Auba who we have to rely on had been massively out of form.
Another point of note is that we weren’t as bad as the results suggested. In many of them we played decent but couldn’t pick up wins and in others we went down to 10 men. You may say we failed to create enough chances but our rivals in Utd, Sp**s, Liverpool and Leicester were all picking up wins when playing even worse.

 

[DavidHillier]

Out of interest, who is available now (tried and tested) that could do better than Arteta?

(This isn't a pro-Arteta post either )

 

[Moah]

The proof is in the pudding, look at Salah. Strong foot is his left and he mainly cuts in from the right, makes split second decisions and has fantastic tight close control, hes direct and always beats his man with ease.

Now compare to Pepe, who needs way more time to do anything, often tries to beat his man again and again and again before getting anything off. Tight ball control isnt amazing but its good enough he just never seems to have the drive to go past people.

And the main problem is he doesnt have a right foot so teams show him onto his left and if they close him down he does nothing.

The difference in France is he had more space and more time. In the premier league he has way less space and time due to the pressure and high intensity.

Its not rocket science.

The points you raised in the first two paragraphs is more about how our team plays than his personal shortcomings. He plays way further back than Salah does and therefore needs to beat multiple players to get to goal. It clear to see he is much more effective when playing close to goal. But even this is not related to the point as it has got nothing to do with time and space.

The right foot point is valid as its clear he must improve on that but that too is not related with his use of time and space.

You raised points that have absolutely nothing to do with the what is being discussed and came to a conclusion out of nowhere.

 

[akhil]

The proof is in the pudding, look at Salah. Strong foot is his left and he mainly cuts in from the right, makes split second decisions and has fantastic tight close control, hes direct and always beats his man with ease.

Now compare to Pepe, who needs way more time to do anything, often tries to beat his man again and again and again before getting anything off. Tight ball control isnt amazing but its good enough he just never seems to have the drive to go past people.

And the main problem is he doesnt have a right foot so teams show him onto his left and if they close him down he does nothing.

The difference in France is he had more space and more time. In the premier league he has way less space and time due to the pressure and high intensity.

Its not rocket science.

By your own logic, Salah's numbers pre Liverpool should've been astronomical since he came from Serie A, not those of showing good player. Those attackers have a ton of space and time. The speed of Liverpool transition is why Salah is so effective and he has pretty good poachers instincts as well, he gets a fair amount of scrappy goals too.
That's the benefits of the system.

The Bayern thing is weird argument, most scouting reports are subjective, it's super convenient they come out after player made their move. It's not like Bayern have never recruited flops. They keep siging Douglas Costa. They spent 80 million on Lucas Hernandez in the same window we bought Pepe, a left back and he's been a colossal dud.

It's hard to get a good read on Pepe since we've been **** show for most of his time here. The past month or so has been the most settled we've looked as a team and he's not really played much part in that. Until he gets some consistent game time with this group, I'm not going to write him off just yet.

But I don't know who he could possibly replace in the starting lineup when everyones fit. Personally, I want him given a shot up front when Laca needs a rest. His hold up play and aerial ability is pretty good actually. Neither N'ketiah nor Auba can do any of that.

 

[HairSprayGooners]

By your own logic, Salah's numbers pre Liverpool should've been astronomical since he came from Serie A, not those of showing good player. Those attackers have a ton of space and time. The speed of Liverpool transition is why Salah is so effective and he has pretty good poachers instincts as well, he gets a fair amount of scrappy goals too.
That's the benefits of the system.

The Bayern thing is weird argument, most scouting reports are subjective, it's super convenient they come out after player made their move. It's not like Bayern have never recruited flops. They keep siging Douglas Costa. They spent 80 million on Lucas Hernandez in the same window we bought Pepe, a left back and he's been a colossal dud.

It's hard to get a good read on Pepe since we've been **** show for most of his time here. The past month or so has been the most settled we've looked as a team and he's not really played much part in that. Until he gets some consistent game time with this group, I'm not going to write him off just yet.

But I don't know who he could possibly replace in the starting lineup when everyones fit. Personally, I want him given a shot up front when Laca needs a rest. His hold up play and aerial ability is pretty good actually. Neither N'ketiah nor Auba can do any of that.

The question is would you play Pepe ahead of Saka or Auba? The answer is no. Which says a lot in itself. Nobody would trust Pepe over Saka.

I do want to see him on the left again as I feel he could offer more there.

 

[Iceman10]

The question is would you play Pepe ahead of Saka or Auba? The answer is no. Which says a lot in itself. Nobody would trust Pepe over Saka.

I do want to see him on the left again as I feel he could offer more there.

I like the idea of playing him more on the left and also exploring if he can be turned into a CF. We can’t exactly afford to cast him totally aside.

I didn’t really watch EL group matches closely, but hear Pepe was played on the left for some of those? Is that right? The question perhaps would be why only just now have we looked at moving him from RW for PL matches, because there obviously was a problem with him being so left footed, unlike Saka who we see can use his less dominant foot well (crosses, etc.). This goes to the question you originally raised, i.e. would any other PL manager get more out of Pepe. I think quite possibly other managers would have shifted his position earlier, but at the same time I know Mikel is a manager with potential who is learning.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

Pepe's going to get the short end of the stick in terms of game time in his favoured position.

He's not as good as Saka on the right and you're not leaving out a 20-25 goal a season Auba to accommodate him on the left or take away minutes from Martinelli either.

That's just the reality of the situation.

This striker stuff is pipe dream too. We've already tried that years ago with shoehorning Gervinho up front. I'd bet money you'll never see Pepe play up top for Arsenal as a conventional striker, or a false 9.

 

[tap-in]

Interesting piece from Sky on our improved form.

Arsenal turn their season around as young stars raise intensity and Thomas Partey brings composure | Football News | Sky Sports

 

[hydrofluoric acid]

Interesting piece from Sky on our improved form.

Arsenal turn their season around as young stars raise intensity and Thomas Partey brings composure | Football News | Sky Sports

No mention of Lacazette carrying the teams on the back of his shoulder like AM like you to believe. Yikes. The conspiracy continues!

Carragher spot on about ESR. "Those little lay-offs and movements sometimes don't look like the most spectacular things but I tell you what, the players playing with him will appreciate them."

Even when someone wants to make it appears that ESR is playing badly he is still doing things that teams need, all the time! So glad we moved from 3-4-3 and then away from lazy Willian out of the team.

 

[Camron]

Interesting piece from Sky on our improved form.

Arsenal turn their season around as young stars raise intensity and Thomas Partey brings composure | Football News | Sky Sports

Thomas is key to being more dominant and progressive in midfield. Exactly why I wanted him over Aouar.

 

[akhil]

Pepe's going to get the short end of the stick in terms of game time in his favoured position.

He's not as good as Saka on the right and you're not leaving out a 20-25 goal a season Auba to accommodate him on the left or take away minutes from Martinelli either.

That's just the reality of the situation.

This striker stuff is pipe dream too. We've already tried that years ago with shoehorning Gervinho up front. I'd bet money you'll never see Pepe play up top for Arsenal as a conventional striker, or a false 9.

Gervinho can't strike the ball on move at all well. Basic flaw in his game that Pepe strikes it really cleanly on the move.

It's not though. We've tried Alexis and Walcott up top. Alexis took a few games to get comfortable but he was very good up there after that. Think that was his best season in terms of numbers. Walcott was hit and miss there though his hold up play was always a problemm even out wide his game back to goal was awful.

 

[Makavelii]

Made this point in another thread but seems relevant to the discussion here:

If you take out Arteta’s winless period of 7 games where we were in a rut, and then average out his points per game from the remaining games - then we’re left in first place with 42 points.

If you optimistically think of that as a rookie learning period for Arteta that won’t happen again..... then he’s looking dam good again.

 

[SingmeasongSong]

By your own logic, Salah's numbers pre Liverpool should've been astronomical since he came from Serie A, not those of showing good player. Those attackers have a ton of space and time. The speed of Liverpool transition is why Salah is so effective and he has pretty good poachers instincts as well, he gets a fair amount of scrappy goals too.
That's the benefits of the system.

The Bayern thing is weird argument, most scouting reports are subjective, it's super convenient they come out after player made their move. It's not like Bayern have never recruited flops. They keep siging Douglas Costa. They spent 80 million on Lucas Hernandez in the same window we bought Pepe, a left back and he's been a colossal dud.

It's hard to get a good read on Pepe since we've been **** show for most of his time here. The past month or so has been the most settled we've looked as a team and he's not really played much part in that. Until he gets some consistent game time with this group, I'm not going to write him off just yet.

But I don't know who he could possibly replace in the starting lineup when everyones fit. Personally, I want him given a shot up front when Laca needs a rest. His hold up play and aerial ability is pretty good actually. Neither N'ketiah nor Auba can do any of that.

Pepe close to goal and central is exactly what I wanted to see for just like 3 games in a row once.

The guy is still the best player we have to go past players and has a pretty good shot.
Just seems like he cannot do 4-5 players and slow it down in between, as he did in france and with full confidence

 

[EmeryCouldnt]

The proof is in the pudding, look at Salah. Strong foot is his left and he mainly cuts in from the right, makes split second decisions and has fantastic tight close control, hes direct and always beats his man with ease.

Now compare to Pepe, who needs way more time to do anything, often tries to beat his man again and again and again before getting anything off. Tight ball control isnt amazing but its good enough he just never seems to have the drive to go past people.

And the main problem is he doesnt have a right foot so teams show him onto his left and if they close him down he does nothing.

The difference in France is he had more space and more time. In the premier league he has way less space and time due to the pressure and high intensity.

Its not rocket science.

Pepe looked better recently than he has ever (besides place kicks), I'm interested to see what the next few games hold for him.

 

[boonthegoon]

Would be amazing if he can get us into cl. Would love it after backing him till now. Europa is more realistic expectation though.

Huge bad luck to him that he didn't have his marquee signing for half the season.