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Mikel Starteta Wars - Phase IV: A Newaneri Hope

Should Arteta’s position as manager be under threat if we don’t win the PL or CL?


  • Total voters
    146

Dokaka

Gunner come out of the closet any day now…
That you need to outspend your rivals to win titles unless it's an outlier. You were too desperate instead of actually thinking about what you're posting. Klopp was never on a meager budget at Liverpool anyway, it's just City proving my point.

So him winning league titles 3 times managing teams with a far smaller budgets than his main competition just.. doesn't matter? Didn't happen? What?
 

BigPoppaPump

Reeling from Laca & Kos nightmares
So him winning league titles 3 times managing teams with a far smaller budgets than his main competition just.. doesn't matter? Didn't happen? What?
Liverpool winning was an outlier if you look at the last 7 years, you tend to have to outspend your competitors to win. Liverpool spent a lot on their players as well not like they did it on a tiny budget lol.
 

jaystewart

Active Member

Country: England

Player:Saka
I think you and @Dokaka are both right but it depends on “the phase of the process”.

Generally you’re better off going for the lower cost gambles esp when building out a squad. But when you’re in a position where almost all the work is done but you’re just one rose short of a bouquet- just go and get the job done. Pay up, do whatever you need to, don’t jeapordise the years of work it took you to get where you are because of some sunken cost fallacy bullshit.

Edit: actually you’re not right about a bunch of stuff. It’s not “hard” to upgrade our LW and CF. I don’t know what you’re on about. Like yeah Gordon at £60m would absolutely make us a better team??

It’s a matter of opinion at the end of the day. Saka and Saliba won’t be around much longer if we look at the contract situation. I’m not gonna blow the 80m big money signing on Anthony Gordon for a marginal upgrade on Martinelli and Trossard. Gordon doesn’t move the needle in the league or champions league. I’m not gonna blow 70m on that the Swedish bloke in Portugal either.
 

Dokaka

Gunner come out of the closet any day now…
Liverpool winning was an outlier if you look at the last 7 years, you tend to have to outspend your competitors to win. Liverpool spent a lot on their players as well not like they did it on a tiny budget lol.

It was a tiny budget relative to their main competition. I mean ffs this isn't even up for debate, their wage budget was nothing compared to City.

Of course you have to spend to win, the point is it is possible to perform above your spending if you're good enough, and Klopp was good enough.
 

outlawz

Southgate's waistcoat knitter
That you need to outspend your rivals to win titles unless it's an outlier. You were too desperate instead of actually thinking about what you're posting. Klopp was never on a meager budget at Liverpool anyway, it's just City proving my point.
Wenger, Klopp and Leicester are the only examples I can think of that won Premier League titles without outspending their rivals. Leeds may have as well, but I haven't checked.

Blackburn outspent everyone to win it, Ferguson outspent everyone to win it, Chelsea outspent everyone to win it, Man Utd outspent everyone again to reclaim it, Man City outspent everyone to win it.

Arteta isn't outspending his rivals, and he hasn't proven to be an outlier like three managers over 30 years. He's been close to being an outlier, so for me he's got credit in the bank.
 

Rasmi

Prophet of Doom

Country: England
klopp had the humility to work under a DoF. When you have an egomaniac like Arteta and weak owner who gives him as much power as the DoF. You are gonna create a mess

Arteta is gonna play huge role in who comes in as DoF. The whole setup is not serious. The luck of last season is gone and now the flaws of our whole setup is showing
Nobody with sane mind wouldn't put Arteta at same level with Klopp.
He is at least one level below.
On the other hand, Klopp had excellent DOF at Liverpool, Michael Edwards.
 

Trilly

All views posted are NOT my own

Country: England
Genuinely what the hell is your point? :lol: Klopp won everything on a meager budget compared to the big spenders, it's not up for debate. He did it, and he also pushed them to the limit several times.
He’s just being BPP, don’t get sucked in.
 

BigPoppaPump

Reeling from Laca & Kos nightmares
Wenger, Klopp and Leicester are the only examples I can think of that won Premier League titles without outspending their rivals. Leeds may have as well, but I haven't checked.

Blackburn outspent everyone to win it, Ferguson outspent everyone to win it, Chelsea outspent everyone to win it, Man Utd outspent everyone again to reclaim it, Man City outspent everyone to win it.

Arteta isn't outspending his rivals, and he hasn't proven to be an outlier like three managers over 30 years. He's been close to being an outlier, so he's got credit in the bank.
Yeah it's obvious but @Dokaka is a bit slow so you have to explain it to him numerous times and in the most simple terms.
 

Dokaka

Gunner come out of the closet any day now…
Arteta isn't outspending his rivals, and he hasn't proven to be an outlier like three managers over 30 years. He's been close to being an outlier, so he's got credit in the bank.

Arteta is performing to expectation given the amount of money spent. That's why I'm not calling him a bad manager, he's at the very least decent. As you said, he's not properly outspending the competition, but he's spending enough to at least require you to be competitive, which you are.

He’s just being BPP, don’t get sucked in.

Yeah my bad.
 

DJ_Markstar

Based and Artetapilled

Player:Martinelli
When were on the cusp of winning in 2001 we signed Sol Campbell for free. Don't always need to spend big money if you scout sensibly.

Sol Campbell doesn't make that move to a team coming 8th, you need to spend to get to a place where you can even make those deals, and even then they're still rare.

Wenger had spent plenty on guys like Henry, Pires etc. before that deal as well so its actually the other way around to how you've presented it, your scouting becomes easier when everyone wants to join you.
 

Trilly

All views posted are NOT my own

Country: England
Liverpool winning was an outlier if you look at the last 7 years, you tend to have to outspend your competitors to win. Liverpool spent a lot on their players as well not like they did it on a tiny budget lol.
You’re ignoring that Pep is also one of the GOAT managers and probably the go to guy if you want to turn spend into success.

You don’t have to outspend to win titles but you do have to spend to a certain level.

If Pep wasn’t in the PL then Liverpool would have won a lot more titles despite not being the biggest spenders and your entire point would be invalidated. Even now with City having a down year the team most likely to win the league aren’t the biggest spenders. They’ve just spent enough.
 

MikelHadADream

...and then He woke up sweating !!!
The thing is he’s actually not very good at the chequebook part of the game :lol:

He’s an elite coach and below average at transfers. I think if you gave him an elite DoF with say 70% of the budget he’s had we’d have won the league already.

So yeah I’d say he’s not a chequebook manager.

His defensive signings have been on the whole a big success though. I think he has an eye for a top “modern” defender.

White, Gabriel, Timber are all top. Zinchenko served a purpose. Tomiyasu is a good player for the fee, just a crock.

Look at the money the other teams have spent on defenders, I think pound for pound Arteta comes out on top.
 

Sammy1887

New Year, Same Hate For Reed
His defensive signings have been on the whole a big success though. I think he has an eye for a top “modern” defender.

White, Gabriel, Timber are all top. Zinchenko served a purpose. Tomiyasu is a good player for the fee, just a crock.

Look at the money the other teams have spent on defenders, I think pound for pound Arteta comes out on top.

True now compare the spending on GKs, Midfielders and Attackers.
 

MikelHadADream

...and then He woke up sweating !!!
True now compare the spending on GKs, Midfielders and Attackers.

He evertually got to Raya who’s a very good keeper, apparently wanted him before Ramsdale.

Ødegaard was a top signing, and whilst #5 and Rice were well known, they are very good players (albeit expensive).

The forwards have been a disaster though.
 

BigPoppaPump

Reeling from Laca & Kos nightmares
You’re ignoring that Pep is also one of the GOAT managers and probably the go to guy if you want to turn spend into success.

You don’t have to outspend to win titles but you do have to spend to a certain level.

If Pep wasn’t in the PL then Liverpool would have won a lot more titles despite not being the biggest spenders and your entire point would be invalidated. Even now with City having a down year the team most likely to win the league aren’t the biggest spenders. They’ve just spent enough.
The richest team usually wins the league, Pep spent a lot of money at City his style only works if you have the best players.

Your last paragraph literally proves my point, Liverpool would've won more if a team that was spending a lot more wasn't in the league. Why do you think City and Chelsea are so successful? Why do you think Ferguson dominated for all those years? Because they had the most money to buy the best players.

My entire point would be invalidated if this was your hypothetical and not the real world, but in football the richest teams get the best players and usually win the most trophies.
 

DJ_Markstar

Based and Artetapilled

Player:Martinelli
Liverpool winning was an outlier if you look at the last 7 years, you tend to have to outspend your competitors to win. Liverpool spent a lot on their players as well not like they did it on a tiny budget lol.

If you ignore Man City/Arsenal for a bit and just focus on Liverpool vs the rest of the league, they've outspent most of them and finished above most of them. Not always the case but its a pretty good indicator.
 

Sammy1887

New Year, Same Hate For Reed
He evertually got to Raya who’s a very good keeper, apparently wanted him before Ramsdale.

Ødegaard was a top signing, and whilst #5 and Rice were well known, they are very good players (albeit expensive).

The forwards have been a disaster though.

Midfield signings have been a mixed bag. Merino, Vieira, Havertz are certified flops.
 

db10_therza

Senior Spreadsheet Squad Secretary
Moderator

Country: Bangladesh

Player:White
It’s a matter of opinion at the end of the day. Saka and Saliba won’t be around much longer if we look at the contract situation. I’m not gonna blow the 80m big money signing on Anthony Gordon for a marginal upgrade on Martinelli and Trossard. Gordon doesn’t move the needle in the league or champions league. I’m not gonna blow 70m on that the Swedish bloke in Portugal either.

You’re entitled to your opinion. I’m just saying following your opinion would see us struggle to make top4 next season.
 

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