Official Injury Thread - 2014/15

[Yousif Arsenal]

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Last team news from Wenger today:
Arteta out for 2-3 weeks.
Debuchy is tow weeks away from full training.
Walcott still out with Groin problem and will not play in Wednesday game also.
Welbeck will have late fitness test.

 

[Toast]

Injuries have cost us in a big way on the pitch for 7 years now. Certainly mitigating circumstances for Wenger.

Özil
Debuchy
Koscielny
Walcott
Arteta
Sanogo
Wilshere
Szczesny
Ospina
Welbeck (?)
Gnabry

It is SOOO ****** up.

Injuries would only be a mitigating factor if they were completely unavoidable. They weren't.

 

[Vinci]

Still, you have to wonder what they do differently at a team like Chelsea - who don’t have more than 2 or 3 injuries at once - yet they play the same team in all PL and CL games.

 

[redanddread]

Still, you have to wonder what they do differently at a team like Chelsea - who don’t have more than 2 or 3 injuries at once - yet they play the same team in all PL and CL games.

Wonder? I say send in a MI6 trained agent and find the feck out what they are doing because they never deal with the injury **** we do.

 

[SiMamu]

Still, you have to wonder what they do differently at a team like Chelsea - who don’t have more than 2 or 3 injuries at once - yet they play the same team in all PL and CL games.

Wonder? I say send in a MI6 trained agent and find the feck out what they are doing because they never deal with the injury **** we do.

Looking at the size of their U18s compared to ours, the answer to how they're able to avoid injuries or fast track injured players - Costa - is steroids and ****.

 

[Toast]

I can't say what Chelsea are doing differently, but I can say that we are definitely doing something wrong.

For example: this study titled 'Hamstring muscle injuries in professional football:
the correlation of MRI findings with return to play' notes:

Injury to the hamstring muscle group is reported to be the most common injury subtype representing 12% of all injuries. This means that a professional male football team with 25 players in the squad have about five hamstring injuries each season, equivalent to more than 80 lost football days.

Even though we're not even halfway into the season we have already suffered SEVEN hamstring injuries.

1. Yaya Sanogo Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 August 16th
2. Kieran Gibbs Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 August 16th
3. Yaya Sanogo Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 September 10th
4. Aaron Ramsey Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 September 27th
5. Danny Welbeck Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 November 18th
6. Mikel Arteta Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 November 4th
7. Yaya Sanogo Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 November 26th

Via Physioroom.

Bad luck perhaps? Let's take a look at last season.

1. Thomas Vermaelen Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 July 5th
2. Thomas Vermaelen Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 June 22nd
3. Olivier Giroud Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 June 10th
4. Thomas Vermaelen Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 April 18th
5. Ryo Miyaichi Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 March 15th
6. Mesut Özil Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 March 11th
7. Laurent Koscielny Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 March 4th
8. Jack Wilshere Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 February 22nd
9. Kieran Gibbs Injury Hamstring Injury 2014 February 19th
10. Bacary Sagna Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 November 30th
11. Ryo Miyaichi Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 November 19th
12. Aaron Ramsey Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 November 13th
13. Bacary Sagna Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 October 1st
14. Tomas Rosicky Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 September 10th
15. Lukas Podolski Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 August 27th
16. Yaya Sanogo Injury Hamstring Injury 2013 August 4th

Via Physioroom.

That's SIXTEEN hamstring injuries in a single season, well over three times the reported average.

I don't know what we're doing wrong but someone is screwing up very, very badly.

 

[onetowatch]

Injuries have cost us in a big way on the pitch for 7 years now. Certainly mitigating circumstances for Wenger.

Özil
Debuchy
Koscielny
Walcott
Arteta
Sanogo
Wilshere
Szczesny
Ospina
Welbeck (?)
Gnabry

It is SOOO ****** up.

Injuries would only be a mitigating factor if they were completely unavoidable. They weren't.

I know we are all disappointed and frustrated but, come on let's be fair. Theo has been out for basically a whole year, how was that Danny Rose challenge of avoidable? Debuchy getting injured was a turning point of our season IMO and that was a freak injury as was Giroud's (got injured kicking the ball). Wilshere was a victim of a bad challenge and now misses three months. Özil has been out a lot during 2014 and it's not like we have overplayed them.

The only ones we bought on ourselves is Ramsey last year when we played him into the ground and Koscielny. They were both avoidable and we could've been better prepared for Kos by buying a backup!

 

[onetowatch]

If we had Chelsea's injury record, we'd have won more trophies in the last few years there's no doubt. Especially during the 07/08, 09/10, 10/11 and 13/14 seasons we missed some of our best players for a chunk of the season. No manager can do well without his best players.

I think to the PLs and CLs that have been won in recent seasons, the best players have generally been for and firing throughout the campaign. Look at Judas, the bloke gave us 1 full season in the 8 years he was with us. And then proceeds to fire Utd to the title in his first season with them :roll:

It's definitely a mitigating point for Arsène.

 

[Toast]

Injuries have cost us in a big way on the pitch for 7 years now. Certainly mitigating circumstances for Wenger.

Özil
Debuchy
Koscielny
Walcott
Arteta
Sanogo
Wilshere
Szczesny
Ospina
Welbeck (?)
Gnabry

It is SOOO ****** up.

Injuries would only be a mitigating factor if they were completely unavoidable. They weren't.

I know we are all disappointed and frustrated but, come on let's be fair. Theo has been out for basically a whole year, how was that Danny Rose challenge of avoidable? Debuchy getting injured was a turning point of our season IMO and that was a freak injury as was Giroud's (got injured kicking the ball). Wilshere was a victim of a bad challenge and now misses three months. Özil has been out a lot during 2014 and it's not like we have overplayed them.

The only ones we bought on ourselves is Ramsey last year when we played him into the ground and Koscielny. They were both avoidable and we could've been better prepared for Kos by buying a backup!

See my other post. 16 hamstring injuries against an average of 5. 7 so far this season. That's not bad luck.
I'm not saying all injuries are avoidable, but many are.

 

[redanddread]

If we had Chelsea's injury record, we'd have won more trophies in the last few years there's no doubt. Especially during the 07/08, 09/10, 10/11 and 13/14 seasons we missed some of our best players for a chunk of the season. No manager can do well without his best players.

I think to the PLs and CLs that have been won in recent seasons, the best players have generally been for and firing throughout the campaign. Look at Judas, the bloke gave us 1 full season in the 8 years he was with us. And then proceeds to fire Utd to the title in his first season with them :roll:

It's definitely a mitigating point for Arsène.

Maybe, just maybe. However, our recent teams have seriously lacked any know how when it comes to the business end of the season. That we've been blighted by injuries for a LONG time now is fact. However, you have to wonder whether we've managed our squad as well as could be as our injury list every year for the last 7-8 years is ridiculous. Falter down the stretch, lose to the big boys and have a massive injury list have been the constants for a while now. It ain't just by chance these things happen.

 

[Toast]

I've looked into it some more.
Hamstring injuries at Arsenal since the stadium move:

2014/2015: 7 (so far).
2013/2014: 16
2012/2013: 4
2011/2012: 11
2010/2011: 12
2009/2010: 15
2008/2009: 9
2007/2008: 9
2006/2007: 15

Not counting this season that brings us to an average of 11.375 hamstring injuries per season. Whereas the average for a 25 man squad in football is 5 hamstring injuries per season.

 

[onetowatch]

See my other post. 16 hamstring injuries against an average of 5. 7 so far this season. That's not bad luck.
I'm not saying all injuries are avoidable, but many are.

You have a valid point but as annoying as these injuries are, they're short term and they aren't the ones that have cost us big over the seasons. It's the medium to long term injuries that keep ****ing our season up and most of those have been bad luck.

Walcott, Ramsey, Giroud, Debuchy, Wilshere, Koscielny, Gibbs, Özil have all missed significant chunks of 2014 and not because of a hamstring injury.

There were plenty of stats doing the rounds how we top the injury tables since 07, and Chelsea were towards the bottom of it. That's a massive handicap.

 

[onetowatch]

If we had Chelsea's injury record, we'd have won more trophies in the last few years there's no doubt. Especially during the 07/08, 09/10, 10/11 and 13/14 seasons we missed some of our best players for a chunk of the season. No manager can do well without his best players.

I think to the PLs and CLs that have been won in recent seasons, the best players have generally been for and firing throughout the campaign. Look at Judas, the bloke gave us 1 full season in the 8 years he was with us. And then proceeds to fire Utd to the title in his first season with them :roll:

It's definitely a mitigating point for Arsène.

Maybe, just maybe. However, our recent teams have seriously lacked any know how when it comes to the business end of the season. That we've been blighted by injuries for a LONG time now is fact. However, you have to wonder whether we've managed our squad as well as could be as our injury list every year for the last 7-8 years is ridiculous. Falter down the stretch, lose to the big boys and have a massive injury list have been the constants for a while now. It ain't just by chance these things happen.

Yeah there are other familiar failings. Tactical, squad rotation, mental frailties, big game mentalities. But missing your best players doesn't help.

 

[redanddread]

I've looked into it some more.
Hamstring injuries at Arsenal since the stadium move:

2014/2015: 7 (so far).
2013/2014: 16
2012/2013: 4
2011/2012: 11
2010/2011: 12
2009/2010: 15
2008/2009: 9
2007/2008: 9
2006/2007: 15

Not counting this season that brings us to an average of 11.375 hamstring injuries per season. Whereas the average for a 25 man squad in football is 5 hamstring injuries per season.

Could it be the Emirates pitch??

Anyway, it's obviously something worthy of serious investigation, which I assume has be ongoing recently. That list is truly worrying and indicates that we're either don't have a feckin' clue what's causing the injuries, not treating our players in the appropriate manner or have consistently had injury prone players in our squad. Any of them should be something that over the course of 8 years we should have been able to sort out imo. I'm not buying into us being just darn unlucky.

 

[Toast]

See my other post. 16 hamstring injuries against an average of 5. 7 so far this season. That's not bad luck.
I'm not saying all injuries are avoidable, but many are.

You have a valid point but as annoying as these injuries are, they're short term and they aren't the ones that have cost us big over the seasons. It's the medium to long term injuries that keep ******* our season up and most of those have been bad luck.

Walcott, Ramsey, Giroud, Debuchy, Wilshere, Koscielny, Gibbs, Özil have all missed significant chunks of 2014 and not because of a hamstring injury.

There were plenty of stats doing the rounds how we top the injury tables since 07, and Chelsea were towards the bottom of it. That's a massive handicap.

Hamstring injuries are just a case in point. They are indicative of the way we handle injuries and clearly we're not handling them well. Hamstring injuries can be prevented to a large extent. We're not doing well on that front. The same goes for many other injuries.

Last season Arsène ran Ramsey into the ground. We therefore missed our best player for several months. This season Özil was allowed to play on despite complaining of knee-pain at half time. Out for months. Some of our injuries are unlucky, but the majority we bring onto ourselves. The hamstring statistics show as much. Seasons aren't lost because of a few unlucky long term injuries. They are lost because of lack of quality depth coupled with an incredible number of injuries each and every season. Long term or short term, it all adds up.

We're doing something wrong. Maybe it's our training methods, maybe it's the lack of rotation, maybe it's rushing players back, maybe it's misdiagnosis. What it is most definitely not, however, is bad luck.

See also this breakdown of our injuries between 09/10 and 13/14.

In total over the past five seasons (09/10 to 13/14) Arsenal have suffered 194 different injuries.

That averages out at 38.8 injuries per season – or just over 1 injury for every Premier League game!

Over the past five seasons, Arsenal have lost a total of 362 months playing time due to injuries.

That adds up to just over 30 years!

194 different injuries in just five years with a resultant 362 months out in total. You can't chalk that up to bad luck.

 

[Toast]

Could it be the Emirates pitch??

Post-stadium move.
2014/2015: 7 (so far).
2013/2014: 16
2012/2013: 4
2011/2012: 11
2010/2011: 12
2009/2010: 15
2008/2009: 9
2007/2008: 9
2006/2007: 15
Pre-stadium move.
2005/2006: 6
2004/2005: 6
2003/2004: 4
2002/2003: 8

I can't conclude that it has something to do with the pitch, but the number of hamstring injuries does increase after the stadium move. The Physioroom data only goes back to 2002/2003, but it shows that between 02/03 and 05/06 we had 6 hamstring injuries on average per season. Still slightly above average but much, much better than the 11.375 from after the stadium move.

 

[Vinci]

Don’t think it has anything to do with the pitch, rather the fact that we have more injury-prone players these days. Still doesn’t account for the entire problem, but for a part, yes, it does I think.

 

[Toast]

^ But it's not the same players getting hamstring injuries over and over again. The entire squad has changed multiple times since the stadium move, but the injury problems remain. It's hard to believe we keep buying 'injury prone' players. More likely something is going wrong in the injury prevention department. I think there's a correlation with overplaying overtraining and rushing players back from injury.

Example: Özil missed 56 days - 17 games - through injury before he came here. At Arsenal he has already missed 164 days - 30 games through injury.

Podolski: 07/08 - 11/12: 142 days out. At Arsenal (12/13 - now): 120 days out.

Coincidence?

 

[blaze_of_glory]

Yeah Toast its pretty hard to think its not at least somewhat down to training, etc. But I wonder if, at least in the case of Özil, the increase in the intensity of the games and the schedule in England has played a part as well.

Hard to make that argument with Podolski though since he plays to rarely for us anyway. Though I suppose he was playing more before his big injury last season.

 

[CurryFlavoured]

Physically we have probably the smallest team in the league. Guys like Arteta, Theo, Rosicky, Gibbs and others are very lightweight in particular. If these guys have to work hard to maintain a very low BF % then that could have negative implications.

Something else isn't right either though, especially when you look at the amount of hamstring injuries there for example. People assuming it's all coincidental are wrong, one or two seasons maybe but this is a running theme. We should have a team of guys who assess the why's and how's of every injury, the money and technology is there. Maybe we have that in place but when you see for example Thomas Vermaelen getting 3 hamstring injuries in such a short period of time then you'd have to think that somebody is doing something wrong.