Premier League 2024/25: Hamstrung Race

[HattoriHanzo]

I watched a glimpse of Lukaku being pocketed by Indonesia's captain Jay Idzes (Venezia) and my first thought was... Arsenal could have used Lukaku this season

Lukaku was useless in that match, damn it...

Arsenal could have used Marco Asensio on loan (as Villa did) or Kolo Muani (as Juventus did).
Any decent striker (Chris Wood who is excellent this season) could have been useful to put some pressure on Liverpool.
But Arsenal board were above that, they handed title to Liverpool in January.
They thought that Arsenal defenders and midfielders would score enough.

 

[DJ_Markstar]

Reality is given what we’re up against it’s very hard to call 1st - it’s easier to give a pts target.

I mean just look at this team man…

View attachment 24705

Blame @albakos for me checking the first page again but how did I know the cat was Phil Foden immediately

That's gotta be some AI thing its far too accurate

 

[albakos]

Now just a 6 month Haaland injury and we're cooking

Poor kid.. Wish that were Halaand or Rodri

Nah, Rodri

 

[Sapient Hawk]

View attachment 33096
it’s still true??

It is. But they need a guiding hand. One that is more experienced & doesn't reek of moisturizer.

 

[UpTheGunnerz]

Slot still got it all to prove for me Clive

 

[EmeryCouldnt]

They been at the top for like 2/3 years which is a long time in this sport. Huge summer ahead.

 

[Gooner Zig]

So we have Fulham at the Emirates on Tues 1 April then we have to go to Goodison for early KO Sat April 5th. It'll be really interesting to see what Mikel will do for that one, with the PL gone I'm wondering if he'll rotate for the Everton game as we have a short break between going to Everton and then the first leg of the Madrid tie in the CL

 

[Macho]

Slot still got it all to prove for me Clive

I agree, need to see if he puts together a title challenge next season.

I don't think Arteta manages to do what he did over there though, I think Arteta prays for a rebuild instead of making use of all those 30+ codgers.

 

[Clrnc]

the bolded ones are the ones I think going to cost issues to both teams

let's just enjoy the ride

There's no ride mate haha

 

[Rex Stone]

I agree, need to see if he puts together a title challenge next season.

I don't think Arteta manages to do what he did over there though, I think Arteta prays for a rebuild instead of making use of all those 30+ codgers.

Wouldn’t you rather a flash in the pan of a one season wonder in terms of winning a league then nothing else? Give me Leicester Ranieri over the Arteta experience every time.

Hard job for Slot if he loses Trent, Salah and VVD for nothing and has to rebuild. That’s 3 out of their 5 World Class players gone.

The rest of that team outside of Alisson and Gravenberch is pretty mid ngl.

 

[Macho]

Wouldn’t you rather a flash in the pan of a one season wonder in terms of winning a league then nothing else? Give me Leicester Ranieri over the Arteta experience every time.

That’s really interesting.

I’ve said many times I would happily skipped these 5 years of Arteta. If he finishes his tenure with no major I genuinely wouldn’t know what to say.

 

[Rex Stone]

That’s really interesting.

I’ve said many times I would happily skipped these 5 years of Arteta. If he finishes his tenure with no major I genuinely wouldn’t know what to say.

Give me these guys like Heynckes in his later years or a Tuchel and Conte at Chelsea who turn up, win a major honour then bounce.

Five years of incremental painstaking improvements to contending is ultimately less fun.

 

[boonthegoon]

Give me these guys like Heynckes in his later years or a Tuchel and Conte at Chelsea who turn up, win a major honour then bounce.

Five years of incremental painstaking improvements to contending is ultimately less fun.

You believe Conte/Tuchel would have won a major trophy with 2019 arsenal and bounced in a couple of years like they did with Chelsea?

 

[db10_therza]

Give me these guys like Heynckes in his later years or a Tuchel and Conte at Chelsea who turn up, win a major honour then bounce.

Five years of incremental painstaking improvements to contending is ultimately less fun.

Arteta might well just be the bridge to managers / times like that.

We did need a bridge though…

I’ve said for a while taking a team to the deep end and actually coming top are two different skill sets. Arteta, for me anyway, has done a really good job with the first bit but the second seems like it might be beyond him. But where we are now, we’d be very attractive to one of the big guns to come in and win stuff.

 

[Rex Stone]

Arteta might well just be the bridge to managers / times like that.

We did need a bridge though…

I’ve said for a while taking a team to the deep end and actually coming top are two different skill sets. Arteta, for me anyway, has done a really good job with the first bit but the second seems like it might be beyond him. But where we are now, we’d be very attractive to one of the big guns to come in and win stuff.

I rate the job he did more than some but show me any other manager who needed or was allowed almost three years to turn it round.

Most managers have to cook with what they have. Chelsea when Tuchel came in were a pretty mediocre outfit on the whole.

That CL win was far greater than the sum of their parts. Kante, Thiago Silva and not a whole lot else on paper.

 

[db10_therza]

That CL win was far greater than the sum of their parts. Kante, Thiago Silva and not a whole lot else on paper.

Jorginho was amazing for them that season. Overall though yeah I hear what you’re saying but that Chelsea team cannot be compared to where we were when Arteta took over I’m sorry. They had won the league just 3/4 years prior to him and a lot of the players were still at the club.

By contrast we had been out of the champions league altogether for years at this point and would struggle to attract big name players. We tried getting around it by signing guys that were over the hill and then when that didn’t work we went young. When Tuchel came in Chelsea dropped a 100 big ones on Lukaku - yeah he didn’t work out but that’s a separate point, at the time he was one of the best strikers in Europe.

 

[Sapient Hawk]

That’s really interesting.

I’ve said many times I would happily skipped these 5 years of Arteta. If he finishes his tenure with no major I genuinely wouldn’t know what to say.

I would but those words are on ice until that day, inevitably, comes around

 

[Rex Stone]

Jorginho was amazing for them that season. Overall though yeah I hear what you’re saying but that Chelsea team cannot be compared to where we were when Arteta took over I’m sorry. They had won the league just 3/4 years prior to him and a lot of the players were still at the club.

By contrast we had been out of the champions league altogether for years at this point and would struggle to attract big name players. We tried getting around it by signing guys that were over the hill and then when that didn’t work we went young. When Tuchel came in Chelsea dropped a 100 big ones on Lukaku - yeah he didn’t work out but that’s a separate point, at the time he was one of the best strikers in Europe.

The Champions League issue with us was overblown.

Under Wenger and Emery we’d been on the verge of qualifying in successive seasons with a semi final and final appearance in the EL and Emery choking the league in 2018/19.

We had two top strikers, added Partey and then did nothing for two years.

Tuchel had a top relationship with Aubameyang, if he comes here he probably pushes for a couple of experienced hands in defence and maybe the project is sped up.

 

[HattoriHanzo]

I rate the job he did more than some but show me any other manager who needed or was allowed almost three years to turn it round.

Most managers have to cook with what they have. Chelsea when Tuchel came in were a pretty mediocre outfit on the whole.

That CL win was far greater than the sum of their parts. Kante, Thiago Silva and not a whole lot else on paper.

What did you expect from rookie who inherited that squad from Emery?
That he would immediately win Premier League or UCL?
He did better with that squad than Emery (who had 15 years of experience as coach/manager then), he has won FA cup.
Arteta needed 3 years as a rookie to build squad ready to challenge for the title and for me this is reasonable time frame.
We saw progress every season under Arteta, until this season.
He had half of season 2019/20, took over when Arsenal was 11th, finished 8th with 54 pts and won FA cup.
Season 2020/21 finished 8th, 61 pts.
Season 2021/22 finished 5th, 69 pts.
Season 2022/23 finished 2nd, 84 pts.
Season 2023/24 finished 2nd, 89 pts.

This season we regressed, due to red cards (we lost 7 pts in these 3 matches), injuries to important players (Ødegaard 2 and a half months, Saka more than 3 months so far, Havertz since February, White 4 months, many other players short term), poor recruitment in summer (partly Arteta's responsibility) and no recruitment at all in January.
I don't expect that any team with injury crisis like Arsenal this season can win the title in league as competitive as EPL.
Arteta also regressed this season, as a coach and as a manager.

You mentioned Tuchel.
What he did in Bundesliga last season with Bayern?
He finished not 2nd, but 3rd, behind Leverkusen and Stuttgart. With Bayern, Bundesliga juggernaut.
Look what is Kompany doing this season in Bundesliga with Bayern.

Let's be clear, Arteta is flawed as a coach, even more as a manager.
He definitely disappointed this season, he failed to adapt his tactics and he failed to rotate Saka and Havertz (therefore he lost them to long term injuries).
He is very bad in squad building, he completely neglected attack and he shouldn't have so much power in recruitment.
He can suggest which type of players club needs to buy, he can even suggest names, but that's it, nothing more than that.

There is a big question mark over Arteta, can he finally win the big trophy with this squad or he peaked last season?
I'm not optimistic and I wouldn't hesitate to replace him if some big manager name becomes available this summer.
But this will not happen, because Arsenal board obviously still rates him.

 

[Trilly]

The rest of that team outside of Alisson and Gravenberch is pretty mid ngl.

Hope you’re not classing Gravenberch as a world class player.

Lights have been way too bright for him in the CL and then the league cup final. Him Jota and Diaz have absolutely stunk in this recent run.