They are called Referees

[MartiSaka]

PGMOL did well to release the audio. Everyone knew it was going to be a total mess, which it was, so they had nothing to lose. One interesting thing, was the level of stress and nerves present in the VAR, even prior to them knowing it was wrong.

It stops the tin foil hat brigade in their tracks, like I have seen in here unfortunately, who believe its all a PL conspiracy and corruption. Maybe its fake audio, in the real audio, they were all sitting back laughing as they drank whiskey and smoked cigars at screwing pool over.

 

[MartiSaka]

Yeah that is the case, but challenge it.

Ok a rule is in place but you just dropped a humongous **** up, have something about you to realise in the moment that yes, there is a rule, but today, in this moment, it needs challenging.

They could have stopped that game if they told the ref too, nothing happened in the game from the time they realised, just do it and then explain your reasons why after, hindsight is a wonde..blah blah, but I bet the PGMOL would have been thanking them if they did stop it and corrected this at the time instead of being ridiculed again.

Someone tried to, not sure who was saying stop the game. Then someone over-ruled him and said there is nothing we can do, the game has restarted.

 

[MartiSaka]

This is why the PGMOL need to be open. I imagine everyone who listens to that will agree that the communication between them all is shockingly bad, but from that they will receive input on how to improve.

To be honest, as bad as the mistake was I feel somewhat sorry for them, they are clearly working in a high pressure environment where everything needs to be quick quick quick.

They also know that every **** up is under the microscope and then open to ridicule/scrutiny.

That 90mins must be so stressful. I wouldn't want that job.

There has been so much pressure for them to get to decisions made quicker. This is what has cause this, Webb would be pushing hard for improvements in the speed at which they make decisions. It was their communication that failed here - they were trying to make decisions so quickly that the communication was rushed i.e. short and vague. Pretty sure they will introduce new communication protocols. To me, its not about the individuals, but the people who manage the system who are more responsible. Obviously, there needs to the option to stop the game if a mistake has been made also.

 

[CaseUteinberger]

In Rugby the video ref confirms with the ref before he looks at it what the original decision was. As you say, that just sounds like a complete mess.

I don't follow rugby, but that rule / process makes sense. VAR referee confirms ruling on the field first to make sure he has that right.

Not sure why the PGMOL hasn't taken that process from rugby. Have they not checked with other sport who have similar systems and that work well? And what also jumped out was how stressed everything sounded. Like they were really stressed and rushed.

On ESPN they also noted that the VAR officials must not have been watching the game before they made the check. If they had been watching the game they would know the goal was not given.

Just an unbelievable mess. Only good thing is that the PGMOL let the pants down and allowed us to see the pure incompetence both of their officials and of the processes they have put in place.

 

[MartiSaka]

I don't follow rugby, but that rule / process makes sense. VAR referee confirms ruling on the field first to make sure he has that right.

Not sure why the PGMOL hasn't taken that process from rugby. Have they not checked with other sport who have similar systems and that work well? And what also jumped out was how stressed everything sounded. Like they were really stressed and rushed.

On ESPN they also noted that the VAR officials must not have been watching the game before they made the check. If they had been watching the game they would know the goal was not given.

Just an unbelievable mess. Only good thing is that the PGMOL let the pants down and allowed us to see the pure incompetence both of their officials and of the processes they have put in place.

When you hear the VAR conversation in rugby - you hear all decision processes in full - they sound confident and in control. The language is clear and fairly uniform. Complete opposite of VAR in PL. To me this shows the protocols are not correct.

 

[Melquiades]

I've said this before:

I'm amazed the PL is happy with the product that the PGMOL is providing. It's hurting the reputation and entertainment factor of a multi-billion pound sports business

I’m in Canada and used to NA pro sports and I’ve said a few times here that I’m fairly routinely gobsmacked by how small-time and backward the PL is for the amount of money involved. It’s like it has one foot in 2023 and the other in 1974 and is endlessly dealing with issues that were sorted out decades ago over here.

It’s absolutely insane for a league this size that virtually every referee is from within 100 miles of Manchester and Manchester United games regularly have both a ref and a VAR official from Manchester.

The NHL realized there were too many referees from Ontario back in the 1980s and has been working for decades to fix it, and you would never see an entire reffing crew from one of the cities that are playing because it’s understood that the optics are horrific if a mistake is made. It’s just simple stuff … but here we are.

And the standards and professionalism of how VAR is handled is just shocking. If it feels like something from an amateur league in NW England, it’s because that’s what it actually is.

 

[DJ_Markstar]

Sky are trying to get PGMOL involved in their broadcast somehow, so they are kinda pulling their punches with the criticism. Or using kid gloves as @Riou says I love to say.

Their coverage of it and how they glossed over the Liverpool error was quite obvious.

Team Machiou

 

[blaze_of_glory]

Someone tried to, not sure who was saying stop the game. Then someone over-ruled him and said there is nothing we can do, the game has restarted.

Yeah that's where the problem really was. Because they could surely get the ref's attention if they really wanted to. Whoever said there's nothing they can do was prioritising procedure over the actual aim of the entire process.

 

[HattoriHanzo]

This reminded me of Monty Python

 

[2Smokeyy]

Just saw the audio, I think the VAR official who suggested to delay the game was right. There wasn’t anything meaningful that happened between the offside decision to Sp**s taking the throw in.

You’ve got to have balls to do that and I think it’s something they all lack. It seems to me they were scared about how the fans would react but **** them.

 

[Jasard]

Just saw the audio, I think the VAR official who suggested to delay the game was right. There wasn’t anything meaningful that happened between the offside decision to Sp**s taking the throw in.

You’ve got to have balls to do that and I think it’s something they all lack. It seems to me they were scared about how the fans would react but **** them.

Imagine if that audio was actually played live during the game Twitter would crash

 

[2Smokeyy]

Imagine if that audio was actually played live during the game Twitter would crash

The match officials even got a bit lucky that this game wasn’t at Anfield. Not sure how they’d leave the ground with all the scousers outside after that decision.

 

[Penn_]

I do have some sympathy as we often see fans and pundits alike *****ing about how long the process takes.

And in their defence it’s hard to take criticism seriously when everything is deemed worthy of controversy.

Perfect example here would be Utd fans jumping on this to cry about the correct Garnacho offside.

 

[dashsnow17]

What that audio shows is how rushed they are. If the clock was stopped everyone would know no time is being wasted and they wouldn’t be so rushed.

 

[1macca1]

I also think there’s a big “us vs them” mentality among referees. They’re very insulated, don’t really engage.

Maybe the top players being paid 100x more than them despite that they can get just as much spotlight.
You could say “that it takes zero talent to be a ref, anybody could do it.” But clearly not! There’s already tens of thousands of ref shortages across Europe, it’s no wonder they don’t sack for incompetence.

 

[1macca1]

What that audio shows is how rushed they are. If the clock was stopped everyone would know no time is being wasted and they wouldn’t be so rushed.

I think the thought of it becoming more like nfl is what’s putting fans off.

 

[dashsnow17]

I’m probably just rugby-pilled from the WC but it really is crazy the contrast in the organisation of the refereeing between the two sports

 

[dashsnow17]

I think the thought of it becoming more like nfl is what’s putting fans off.

How many offside goals are there a game, or red card decisions? Not many, it wouldn’t slow the game down that much.

 

[dashsnow17]

Just in general it makes sense to stop the clock, like goal celebrations, why are we adding on random time for that. Just stop the clock when the goal’s allowed and start when the game kicks off again.

 

[Macho]

I think the thought of it becoming more like nfl is what’s putting fans off.

If it kills these discussions though stop start is the lesser evil. I lose my mind everytime there is a big match and the bulk of the chatter and analysis is about referee decisions. The game belongs to the players and it's actually mad boring.

The prem product and coverage is actually quite bad because of this.