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Unconscious Bias in Football

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Riou

In The Winchester, Waiting For This To Blow Over

Country: Northern Ireland

Player:Gabriel
My source told me it was the Lukaku chant that made these dons stop going to Old Trafford...

57e4edcefb77855b144d1184_733726239.jpg



...they thought it was completely out of order, United hasn't been the same without them.
 

Riou

In The Winchester, Waiting For This To Blow Over

Country: Northern Ireland

Player:Gabriel
It’s banter isn’t it. Weird though.

Where I come from those jokes are considered batty man stuff.

I don't think they mean anything by it either, but I genuinely have no idea why you want to chant that at a game.

Very weird, as you say.
 

Macho

In search of Pure Profit 💸
Dusted 🔻

Country: England
I don't think they mean anything by it either, but I genuinely have no idea why you want to chant that at a game.

Very weird, as you say.

Nah, it's supposed to be endearing and ridiculous that's just terrace humour. I admittedly see the funny side of it, the problem here is the respect issue. Plus there's kids at the game and these ideas are passed down onto them.
 

Macho

In search of Pure Profit 💸
Dusted 🔻

Country: England
In any case, these discussions are cool but we shouldn't forget unconscious bias is not just black people. Asians and American's face it too when they join an European team. Many assume it's for marketing purposes and not talent for example.

We could sign a Scot down the line who wears long sleeves and gloves all year round and we call him a p*ssy because Tierney didn't.
 

<<reed>>

Lidl Tir Na Nog
You guys wouldn't believe The Athletic article that just popped up in my inbox :lol::lol:



0117_PlayersPenisesChants-scaled.jpg


‘It’s not a compliment, it’s racist’ — football culture and black players’ penises​


Jay Harris
Jan 19, 2023

“Willy Gnonto, Willy Gnonto / He eats spaghetti / He drinks Moretti / His ****’s ****ing massive.”

When Wilfried Gnonto scored for Leeds United in their 1-1 draw against West Ham United at the beginning of this month, it should have been a moment for him to cherish. Leeds have struggled for consistency this season and the now-19-year-old Italian forward has been a rare spark of excitement for the fans.


Gnonto’s first goal for the club was supposed to strengthen his bond with those supporters. However, a section of the crowd at Elland Road felt it appropriate to celebrate by singing, to the tune of La Bamba, about the supposed size of his Willie.

Amad Diallo is excelling at Sunderland in the Championship, on loan from Manchester United. He has been subjected to the same treatment. Before the 3-0 victory over Millwall on December 3, the winger released a video on Sunderland’s social media channels asking for it to stop.

It didn’t.




Before the 2-1 defeat to Aston Villa last Friday, Leeds head coach Jesse Marsch put out a similar message regarding the Gnonto chant. It was however sung again after his two goals in the FA Cup replay win over Cardiff City, but not as loudly.

“I love how much the fans love him,” Marsch said. “Is there a way to modify it to be as passionate but more respectful? That’s what I would say.”

Don’t be surprised. This is far from the first time chants of this nature have been directed towards black players.

Shortly after Romelu Lukaku joined from Everton in the summer of 2017, Manchester United supporters started referring to him as their “Belgian scoring genius with a 24-inch Willie”. Lukaku released a statement through the club that said “fans have meant well with their songs, but let’s move on together”. After that was ignored, his agent at the time, Mino Raiola, reiterated to The Times “he (Lukaku) would like this song to stop”.

When Ivan Toney was playing for Peterborough United in 2019, the now-Brentford striker requested “a new family version” of a chant about him that had similar lyrics to the ones sung more recently regarding Gnonto and Amad.


Don’t forget the fan who saw no problem hanging up an offensive banner of Divock Origi at the 2019 Champions League final between Liverpool and Tottenham Hotspur.

The supporter escaped unpunished until the banner reappeared at Liverpool’s Champions League group game away to the Belgian club Genk a few months later. He was temporarily suspended from attending Liverpool matches, but the ban was lifted after he agreed to attend a session with the club’s community programme and undergo an education course with the anti-discrimination group Kick It Out.

Origi_Landscape-scaled.jpg


The Origi banner that was banned (Photo: Marc Atkins/Getty Images)

Black players are stepping forward to publicly voice their displeasure about these chants, so why are they being ignored?

There will be people who argue telling a black man he has a large Willie is a compliment, but they do not understand, or maybe just don’t care, these chants are deeply offensive and racist.


Obioma Ugoala is a stage actor and the author of a book titled The Problem With My Normal Willie.

Ugoala says people need to be educated about the historical context of “the myth of the black Willie”.

“This language dehumanises black players by saying that not only are they exceptional, but they are weird and animalistic,” he tells The Athletic. “That language was the very language that allowed the transatlantic slave trade to take place because of eugenics that said, ‘Actually, these people are less than the rest of us in America’ and, ‘You can’t have sex with a black man because they are beasts’.

“Once you’re made aware of it, you can no longer be ignorant. It shouldn’t be something that we’re having a continual conversation over. Are we going to say enough is enough?

“Why do we feel we need to keep using those chants? What is it satisfying in us to abuse a player in this way? Do you see them as a player who you support or do you see them as a tool or as a puppet that you use? Do you not see them as human?


“Unfortunately, it’s this inability to see the players as human that allows people to turn on our national team when we had that incident at Euro 2020 — because you have dehumanised them to a degree that they don’t deserve your compassion.”

Ugoala is referencing the most recent European Championship final between Italy and England. Three young black players, Marcus Rashford, Jadon Sancho and Bukayo Saka, missed penalties as England lost in a shootout and were racially abused on social media afterwards.

Some people might perceive chants about having a big Willie to be harmless by comparison, but they have the same negative impact.

During a League Two match between Barrow and Colchester United in November, the latter’s head coach Matt Bloomfield heard a “racially-motivated comment” from a home fan being directed towards one of his players. Bloomfield reported it to the fourth official and the police were notified.

Colchester forward Frank Nouble’s identity was not revealed at the time, but he now wants to publicly discuss the impact these comments have.

GettyImages-1231982490-scaled.jpg


Nouble celebrates scoring for Colchester (Photo: Ben Pooley/MI News/NurPhoto via Getty Images)
“The ball went out for a throw-in and a fan said, ‘Nouble — hopefully he can control it with his big black ****’,” the former West Ham United and Ipswich Town striker tells The Athletic.

“After the game, the police came to our coach and asked me to come inside to the office of the Barrow manager. I was told there had been a chant about my Willie and that they had found the individual on camera.”

The police arrested a 60-year-old man on suspicion of a racially aggravated public order offence. He was released on bail and the investigation found no reason to take further action.

“Those chants have lessened as the years have gone by, but five or six years ago they were constant about the size of your Willie or what he has got hiding in his sock,” Nouble says.


“It doesn’t hurt you straight away because you think, ‘OK, it’s a bit of a joke for them’. It’s not damning in their eyes — if anything, (to them) it’s uplifting you. At the same time, there are historical connotations about it. My family and friends were saying this is a song that we don’t want to be hearing about.

“Whatever is chanted at you, you try to make it push you to your limits and outperform anything that’s said. But when you sit back and analyse the situation, especially now that I have got kids, I understand that these things can be hurtful and hit people’s state of mind. You realise that maybe this is not the right way to be celebrated in the sport that you play or in any walk of life.”




Where to go next on The Athletic


Zavon Hines started his career at West Ham and went on to play for clubs including Coventry City, Burnley and Southend United. He was forced to retire at the age of 30 because of injury and was recently appointed as the lead under-15s coach at West Ham’s academy.

Hines recalls hearing such chants during matches too and feeling “confused” why “fans are being racist towards players from the teams they support”.

“We were in a period where it felt like you couldn’t really say much,” he tells The Athletic. “If we react in a certain way, we get classed as an angry black man. But certain things are not a joke when it comes to your background and your personal life.

“It’s nothing to do with them. It’s personal and private. They wouldn’t want anyone to be speaking about a family member like that, but then to us, they will say it is a compliment.”

Chants about the size of your Willie become even more difficult to deal with when they start to spread through a crowd, and beyond. How are you supposed to react when your colleagues, people who you thought were your friends, join in?


“It comes back into the changing rooms, so the boys (team-mates) are singing it in front of you, and some days you don’t want to hear it,” Nouble says.

“It was seen as a sense of endearment and again, that is down to education and everyone’s got different cultures. If anything, I could sense jealousy from the boys that, ‘Oh, Frank’s got a song he might think makes him a big character in the changing room’. I’m comfortable in my own skin, but the next person might not be. That’s where people could be more considerate.”

It is sad to hear Nouble admit his team-mates would sing such chants at him, but he feels like “we are living in two different generations in the space of five years”. The 31-year-old believes high-profile players being prepared to use their platforms to speak out about racism has helped to raise awareness and change attitudes. If a team-mate behaved in that way now, he says he would challenge them “without even thinking about it”.

Unfortunately, Nouble’s experiences are not a one-off.

“There was a young player who went out on loan and he was getting a few chants,” Nouble says. “He told me and he was kind of laughing, but I could see by his eyes he wasn’t really happy about it.

GettyImages-678607010-scaled.jpg


Hines says he heard such chants a lot in his playing days (Photo: Nigel French – PA Images via Getty Images)
“But when you’re in an environment with a group of lads, it’s hard for people to come out and express how they feel. You don’t want to go against what the majority think. I just told him, ‘Look, whatever you don’t feel comfortable about, you tell them straight away’.”

Hines can recall one of his team-mates being mocked.

“There was one particular player in the dressing room and every time he got in the shower they would go and look, or ask him to take his towel off,” he says. “When it’s every single day, you’re basically picking on this person.

“You could see on his face, (he was thinking) ‘It’s enough, just let me be’. But there was never a moment where they asked, ‘Do you feel uncomfortable?’.”

“There was always a passing comment. People might think a passing comment is nothing, but that’s what hits the most. That sticks in the player’s mind. He is thinking every time he walks past he’s going to get that same comment. I’m still close with that player now and I know for a fact he hated it.”


@Riou
 

Trilly

Hates A-M, Saka, Arteta and You
Trusted ⭐

Country: England
You guys wouldn't believe The Athletic article that just popped up in my inbox :lol::lol:



0117_PlayersPenisesChants-scaled.jpg


‘It’s not a compliment, it’s racist’ — football culture and black players’ penises​


Jay Harris
Jan 19, 2023

“Willy Gnonto, Willy Gnonto / He eats spaghetti / He drinks Moretti / His ****’s ****ing massive.”

When Wilfried Gnonto scored for Leeds United in their 1-1 draw against West Ham United at the beginning of this month, it should have been a moment for him to cherish. Leeds have struggled for consistency this season and the now-19-year-old Italian forward has been a rare spark of excitement for the fans.


Gnonto’s first goal for the club was supposed to strengthen his bond with those supporters. However, a section of the crowd at Elland Road felt it appropriate to celebrate by singing, to the tune of La Bamba, about the supposed size of his Willie.

Amad Diallo is excelling at Sunderland in the Championship, on loan from Manchester United. He has been subjected to the same treatment. Before the 3-0 victory over Millwall on December 3, the winger released a video on Sunderland’s social media channels asking for it to stop.

It didn’t.




Before the 2-1 defeat to Aston Villa last Friday, Leeds head coach Jesse Marsch put out a similar message regarding the Gnonto chant. It was however sung again after his two goals in the FA Cup replay win over Cardiff City, but not as loudly.

“I love how much the fans love him,” Marsch said. “Is there a way to modify it to be as passionate but more respectful? That’s what I would say.”

Don’t be surprised. This is far from the first time chants of this nature have been directed towards black players.

Shortly after Romelu Lukaku joined from Everton in the summer of 2017, Manchester United supporters started referring to him as their “Belgian scoring genius with a 24-inch Willie”. Lukaku released a statement through the club that said “fans have meant well with their songs, but let’s move on together”. After that was ignored, his agent at the time, Mino Raiola, reiterated to The Times “he (Lukaku) would like this song to stop”.

When Ivan Toney was playing for Peterborough United in 2019, the now-Brentford striker requested “a new family version” of a chant about him that had similar lyrics to the ones sung more recently regarding Gnonto and Amad.


Don’t forget the fan who saw no problem hanging up an offensive banner of Divock Origi at the 2019 Champions League final between Liverpool and Tottenham Hotspur.

The supporter escaped unpunished until the banner reappeared at Liverpool’s Champions League group game away to the Belgian club Genk a few months later. He was temporarily suspended from attending Liverpool matches, but the ban was lifted after he agreed to attend a session with the club’s community programme and undergo an education course with the anti-discrimination group Kick It Out.

Origi_Landscape-scaled.jpg


The Origi banner that was banned (Photo: Marc Atkins/Getty Images)

Black players are stepping forward to publicly voice their displeasure about these chants, so why are they being ignored?

There will be people who argue telling a black man he has a large Willie is a compliment, but they do not understand, or maybe just don’t care, these chants are deeply offensive and racist.


Obioma Ugoala is a stage actor and the author of a book titled The Problem With My Normal Willie.

Ugoala says people need to be educated about the historical context of “the myth of the black Willie”.

“This language dehumanises black players by saying that not only are they exceptional, but they are weird and animalistic,” he tells The Athletic. “That language was the very language that allowed the transatlantic slave trade to take place because of eugenics that said, ‘Actually, these people are less than the rest of us in America’ and, ‘You can’t have sex with a black man because they are beasts’.

“Once you’re made aware of it, you can no longer be ignorant. It shouldn’t be something that we’re having a continual conversation over. Are we going to say enough is enough?

“Why do we feel we need to keep using those chants? What is it satisfying in us to abuse a player in this way? Do you see them as a player who you support or do you see them as a tool or as a puppet that you use? Do you not see them as human?


“Unfortunately, it’s this inability to see the players as human that allows people to turn on our national team when we had that incident at Euro 2020 — because you have dehumanised them to a degree that they don’t deserve your compassion.”

Ugoala is referencing the most recent European Championship final between Italy and England. Three young black players, Marcus Rashford, Jadon Sancho and Bukayo Saka, missed penalties as England lost in a shootout and were racially abused on social media afterwards.

Some people might perceive chants about having a big Willie to be harmless by comparison, but they have the same negative impact.

During a League Two match between Barrow and Colchester United in November, the latter’s head coach Matt Bloomfield heard a “racially-motivated comment” from a home fan being directed towards one of his players. Bloomfield reported it to the fourth official and the police were notified.

Colchester forward Frank Nouble’s identity was not revealed at the time, but he now wants to publicly discuss the impact these comments have.

GettyImages-1231982490-scaled.jpg


Nouble celebrates scoring for Colchester (Photo: Ben Pooley/MI News/NurPhoto via Getty Images)
“The ball went out for a throw-in and a fan said, ‘Nouble — hopefully he can control it with his big black ****’,” the former West Ham United and Ipswich Town striker tells The Athletic.

“After the game, the police came to our coach and asked me to come inside to the office of the Barrow manager. I was told there had been a chant about my Willie and that they had found the individual on camera.”

The police arrested a 60-year-old man on suspicion of a racially aggravated public order offence. He was released on bail and the investigation found no reason to take further action.

“Those chants have lessened as the years have gone by, but five or six years ago they were constant about the size of your Willie or what he has got hiding in his sock,” Nouble says.


“It doesn’t hurt you straight away because you think, ‘OK, it’s a bit of a joke for them’. It’s not damning in their eyes — if anything, (to them) it’s uplifting you. At the same time, there are historical connotations about it. My family and friends were saying this is a song that we don’t want to be hearing about.

“Whatever is chanted at you, you try to make it push you to your limits and outperform anything that’s said. But when you sit back and analyse the situation, especially now that I have got kids, I understand that these things can be hurtful and hit people’s state of mind. You realise that maybe this is not the right way to be celebrated in the sport that you play or in any walk of life.”




Where to go next on The Athletic


Zavon Hines started his career at West Ham and went on to play for clubs including Coventry City, Burnley and Southend United. He was forced to retire at the age of 30 because of injury and was recently appointed as the lead under-15s coach at West Ham’s academy.

Hines recalls hearing such chants during matches too and feeling “confused” why “fans are being racist towards players from the teams they support”.

“We were in a period where it felt like you couldn’t really say much,” he tells The Athletic. “If we react in a certain way, we get classed as an angry black man. But certain things are not a joke when it comes to your background and your personal life.

“It’s nothing to do with them. It’s personal and private. They wouldn’t want anyone to be speaking about a family member like that, but then to us, they will say it is a compliment.”

Chants about the size of your Willie become even more difficult to deal with when they start to spread through a crowd, and beyond. How are you supposed to react when your colleagues, people who you thought were your friends, join in?


“It comes back into the changing rooms, so the boys (team-mates) are singing it in front of you, and some days you don’t want to hear it,” Nouble says.

“It was seen as a sense of endearment and again, that is down to education and everyone’s got different cultures. If anything, I could sense jealousy from the boys that, ‘Oh, Frank’s got a song he might think makes him a big character in the changing room’. I’m comfortable in my own skin, but the next person might not be. That’s where people could be more considerate.”

It is sad to hear Nouble admit his team-mates would sing such chants at him, but he feels like “we are living in two different generations in the space of five years”. The 31-year-old believes high-profile players being prepared to use their platforms to speak out about racism has helped to raise awareness and change attitudes. If a team-mate behaved in that way now, he says he would challenge them “without even thinking about it”.

Unfortunately, Nouble’s experiences are not a one-off.

“There was a young player who went out on loan and he was getting a few chants,” Nouble says. “He told me and he was kind of laughing, but I could see by his eyes he wasn’t really happy about it.

GettyImages-678607010-scaled.jpg


Hines says he heard such chants a lot in his playing days (Photo: Nigel French – PA Images via Getty Images)
“But when you’re in an environment with a group of lads, it’s hard for people to come out and express how they feel. You don’t want to go against what the majority think. I just told him, ‘Look, whatever you don’t feel comfortable about, you tell them straight away’.”

Hines can recall one of his team-mates being mocked.

“There was one particular player in the dressing room and every time he got in the shower they would go and look, or ask him to take his towel off,” he says. “When it’s every single day, you’re basically picking on this person.

“You could see on his face, (he was thinking) ‘It’s enough, just let me be’. But there was never a moment where they asked, ‘Do you feel uncomfortable?’.”

“There was always a passing comment. People might think a passing comment is nothing, but that’s what hits the most. That sticks in the player’s mind. He is thinking every time he walks past he’s going to get that same comment. I’m still close with that player now and I know for a fact he hated it.”


Somebody is gonna reply to you saying “but what if Saka does in fact have a massive d*ck? Does that make me racist by acknowledging it?”

Or some other nonsensical BS. :lol:
 

El Duderino

That's, like, your opinion, man.
Moderator
You guys wouldn't believe The Athletic article that just popped up in my inbox :lol::lol:



0117_PlayersPenisesChants-scaled.jpg


‘It’s not a compliment, it’s racist’ — football culture and black players’ penises​


Jay Harris
Jan 19, 2023

“Willy Gnonto, Willy Gnonto / He eats spaghetti / He drinks Moretti / His ****’s ****ing massive.”

When Wilfried Gnonto scored for Leeds United in their 1-1 draw against West Ham United at the beginning of this month, it should have been a moment for him to cherish. Leeds have struggled for consistency this season and the now-19-year-old Italian forward has been a rare spark of excitement for the fans.


Gnonto’s first goal for the club was supposed to strengthen his bond with those supporters. However, a section of the crowd at Elland Road felt it appropriate to celebrate by singing, to the tune of La Bamba, about the supposed size of his Willie.

Amad Diallo is excelling at Sunderland in the Championship, on loan from Manchester United. He has been subjected to the same treatment. Before the 3-0 victory over Millwall on December 3, the winger released a video on Sunderland’s social media channels asking for it to stop.

It didn’t.




Before the 2-1 defeat to Aston Villa last Friday, Leeds head coach Jesse Marsch put out a similar message regarding the Gnonto chant. It was however sung again after his two goals in the FA Cup replay win over Cardiff City, but not as loudly.

“I love how much the fans love him,” Marsch said. “Is there a way to modify it to be as passionate but more respectful? That’s what I would say.”

Don’t be surprised. This is far from the first time chants of this nature have been directed towards black players.

Shortly after Romelu Lukaku joined from Everton in the summer of 2017, Manchester United supporters started referring to him as their “Belgian scoring genius with a 24-inch Willie”. Lukaku released a statement through the club that said “fans have meant well with their songs, but let’s move on together”. After that was ignored, his agent at the time, Mino Raiola, reiterated to The Times “he (Lukaku) would like this song to stop”.

When Ivan Toney was playing for Peterborough United in 2019, the now-Brentford striker requested “a new family version” of a chant about him that had similar lyrics to the ones sung more recently regarding Gnonto and Amad.


Don’t forget the fan who saw no problem hanging up an offensive banner of Divock Origi at the 2019 Champions League final between Liverpool and Tottenham Hotspur.

The supporter escaped unpunished until the banner reappeared at Liverpool’s Champions League group game away to the Belgian club Genk a few months later. He was temporarily suspended from attending Liverpool matches, but the ban was lifted after he agreed to attend a session with the club’s community programme and undergo an education course with the anti-discrimination group Kick It Out.

Origi_Landscape-scaled.jpg


The Origi banner that was banned (Photo: Marc Atkins/Getty Images)

Black players are stepping forward to publicly voice their displeasure about these chants, so why are they being ignored?

There will be people who argue telling a black man he has a large Willie is a compliment, but they do not understand, or maybe just don’t care, these chants are deeply offensive and racist.


Obioma Ugoala is a stage actor and the author of a book titled The Problem With My Normal Willie.

Ugoala says people need to be educated about the historical context of “the myth of the black Willie”.

“This language dehumanises black players by saying that not only are they exceptional, but they are weird and animalistic,” he tells The Athletic. “That language was the very language that allowed the transatlantic slave trade to take place because of eugenics that said, ‘Actually, these people are less than the rest of us in America’ and, ‘You can’t have sex with a black man because they are beasts’.

“Once you’re made aware of it, you can no longer be ignorant. It shouldn’t be something that we’re having a continual conversation over. Are we going to say enough is enough?

“Why do we feel we need to keep using those chants? What is it satisfying in us to abuse a player in this way? Do you see them as a player who you support or do you see them as a tool or as a puppet that you use? Do you not see them as human?


“Unfortunately, it’s this inability to see the players as human that allows people to turn on our national team when we had that incident at Euro 2020 — because you have dehumanised them to a degree that they don’t deserve your compassion.”

Ugoala is referencing the most recent European Championship final between Italy and England. Three young black players, Marcus Rashford, Jadon Sancho and Bukayo Saka, missed penalties as England lost in a shootout and were racially abused on social media afterwards.

Some people might perceive chants about having a big Willie to be harmless by comparison, but they have the same negative impact.

During a League Two match between Barrow and Colchester United in November, the latter’s head coach Matt Bloomfield heard a “racially-motivated comment” from a home fan being directed towards one of his players. Bloomfield reported it to the fourth official and the police were notified.

Colchester forward Frank Nouble’s identity was not revealed at the time, but he now wants to publicly discuss the impact these comments have.

GettyImages-1231982490-scaled.jpg


Nouble celebrates scoring for Colchester (Photo: Ben Pooley/MI News/NurPhoto via Getty Images)
“The ball went out for a throw-in and a fan said, ‘Nouble — hopefully he can control it with his big black ****’,” the former West Ham United and Ipswich Town striker tells The Athletic.

“After the game, the police came to our coach and asked me to come inside to the office of the Barrow manager. I was told there had been a chant about my Willie and that they had found the individual on camera.”

The police arrested a 60-year-old man on suspicion of a racially aggravated public order offence. He was released on bail and the investigation found no reason to take further action.

“Those chants have lessened as the years have gone by, but five or six years ago they were constant about the size of your Willie or what he has got hiding in his sock,” Nouble says.


“It doesn’t hurt you straight away because you think, ‘OK, it’s a bit of a joke for them’. It’s not damning in their eyes — if anything, (to them) it’s uplifting you. At the same time, there are historical connotations about it. My family and friends were saying this is a song that we don’t want to be hearing about.

“Whatever is chanted at you, you try to make it push you to your limits and outperform anything that’s said. But when you sit back and analyse the situation, especially now that I have got kids, I understand that these things can be hurtful and hit people’s state of mind. You realise that maybe this is not the right way to be celebrated in the sport that you play or in any walk of life.”




Where to go next on The Athletic


Zavon Hines started his career at West Ham and went on to play for clubs including Coventry City, Burnley and Southend United. He was forced to retire at the age of 30 because of injury and was recently appointed as the lead under-15s coach at West Ham’s academy.

Hines recalls hearing such chants during matches too and feeling “confused” why “fans are being racist towards players from the teams they support”.

“We were in a period where it felt like you couldn’t really say much,” he tells The Athletic. “If we react in a certain way, we get classed as an angry black man. But certain things are not a joke when it comes to your background and your personal life.

“It’s nothing to do with them. It’s personal and private. They wouldn’t want anyone to be speaking about a family member like that, but then to us, they will say it is a compliment.”

Chants about the size of your Willie become even more difficult to deal with when they start to spread through a crowd, and beyond. How are you supposed to react when your colleagues, people who you thought were your friends, join in?


“It comes back into the changing rooms, so the boys (team-mates) are singing it in front of you, and some days you don’t want to hear it,” Nouble says.

“It was seen as a sense of endearment and again, that is down to education and everyone’s got different cultures. If anything, I could sense jealousy from the boys that, ‘Oh, Frank’s got a song he might think makes him a big character in the changing room’. I’m comfortable in my own skin, but the next person might not be. That’s where people could be more considerate.”

It is sad to hear Nouble admit his team-mates would sing such chants at him, but he feels like “we are living in two different generations in the space of five years”. The 31-year-old believes high-profile players being prepared to use their platforms to speak out about racism has helped to raise awareness and change attitudes. If a team-mate behaved in that way now, he says he would challenge them “without even thinking about it”.

Unfortunately, Nouble’s experiences are not a one-off.

“There was a young player who went out on loan and he was getting a few chants,” Nouble says. “He told me and he was kind of laughing, but I could see by his eyes he wasn’t really happy about it.

GettyImages-678607010-scaled.jpg


Hines says he heard such chants a lot in his playing days (Photo: Nigel French – PA Images via Getty Images)
“But when you’re in an environment with a group of lads, it’s hard for people to come out and express how they feel. You don’t want to go against what the majority think. I just told him, ‘Look, whatever you don’t feel comfortable about, you tell them straight away’.”

Hines can recall one of his team-mates being mocked.

“There was one particular player in the dressing room and every time he got in the shower they would go and look, or ask him to take his towel off,” he says. “When it’s every single day, you’re basically picking on this person.

“You could see on his face, (he was thinking) ‘It’s enough, just let me be’. But there was never a moment where they asked, ‘Do you feel uncomfortable?’.”

“There was always a passing comment. People might think a passing comment is nothing, but that’s what hits the most. That sticks in the player’s mind. He is thinking every time he walks past he’s going to get that same comment. I’m still close with that player now and I know for a fact he hated it.”



Had to check it was a Gunnerblog article...
 

Country: Iceland
If Koscielny was black everyone would be calling him stupid if we’re being honest. But people make excuses for his stupid decisions.

Tbh I used the zero football IQ on Mustafi. That guy couldn't spot an opposition run even if it was 25 cm **** slapping into his face for 10 minutes. I think I have used this about Pepe also.

I think @Trilly is onto something here and as a white privileged man who is not used to multi-culture societies I have to improve upon this thinking! There is definitely an unconscious bias not only in sports but I notice it also in my field as a scientist. It's good to talk about and be aware of it!
 

Farzad Stoned

Self-appointed Deprogrammer for the Cult of Mik 🟥

Country: USA

Player:Havertz
I am a person of color, so of course it has.

I don’t go around looking for it and feel the system is built against me though.
What country do you live in i feel like America targets me daily for discrimination and oppression. Daily. Would you like the many many examples. So you claim to be a person of color yet you don’t think system is against you and in favor of whites. So us other ungrateful victimhood junkies just made up structural white supremacism?


You are just so much better than those of us who won’t take this crap anymore. Malcolm X had a term for the plantation owner loving slave that i am too polite to repeat but i am thinking it
 

GoonerJeeves

Established Member
Trusted ⭐

Country: Norway
What country do you live in i feel like America targets me daily for discrimination and oppression. Daily. Would you like the many many examples. So you claim to be a person of color yet you don’t think system is against you and in favor of whites. So us other ungrateful victimhood junkies just made up structural white supremacism?


You are just so much better than those of us who won’t take this crap anymore. Malcolm X had a term for the plantation owner loving slave that i am too polite to repeat but i am thinking it
You're a Persian invoking Malcom X?
 

Farzad Stoned

Self-appointed Deprogrammer for the Cult of Mik 🟥

Country: USA

Player:Havertz
You're a Persian invoking Malcom X?

Not really. Not fan of Islam in particular but his autobiography is a must read tells you the honest truth about the twisted soul of the vast majority of Americans and how American social progress is a total con. America is legally more racist than it was in 1965 as minority voting rights are more under attack today in Republiklan states than at any point since 1964. America is more openly racist today than it was 10 and 20 years ago. Foxnazi news makes billions off targeting people like me 24-7 for hate crimes and greenlighting redneck terrorism against minorities and immigrants.
 

Lewdtenant

Giga Tilted
Not really. Not fan of Islam in particular but his autobiography is a must read tells you the honest truth about the twisted soul of the vast majority of Americans and how American social progress is a total con. America is legally more racist than it was in 1965 as minority voting rights are more under attack today in Republiklan states than at any point since 1964. America is more openly racist today than it was 10 and 20 years ago. Foxnazi news makes billions off targeting people like me 24-7 for hate crimes and greenlighting redneck terrorism against minorities and immigrants.

Yea so Malcolm X was assasinated in 1965.. But somehow his autobiography details how US social progress is "a total con" up until recently.. ? Ugh.. these are some tortured talking points..
 

db10_therza

🎵 Edu getting rickrolled 🎵
Trusted ⭐

Country: Bangladesh

Player:Martinelli
Yea so Malcolm X was assasinated in 1965.. But somehow his autobiography details how US social progress is "a total con" up until recently.. ? Ugh.. these are some tortured talking points..
How? How have your eyes read what he wrote and somehow your brain got that from it?
 
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