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Wengers biggest mistake not signing a right player..

Discussion in 'Arsenal Talk' started by Anonymous, Sep 1, 2004.

  1. slapz

    slapz New Member Trusted

    We've got so many players who can play right midfield so that's covered. As for right back, with the 2 players we have fighting for it now plus the option of playing one of our three centre backs there, it looks like we'll cope... maybe even Senderos or Clichy can fill in as right back for a few games

    Reyesoflight, Toure isnt someone who was converted to centre back by Wenger... he's always been a centre back for the Ivory Coast so its more like he got his main position when we had probs with Keown's injuries last season and has excelled playing alongside two world class defenders in Sol and Ash
     
  2. kel varnsen

    kel varnsen New Member Trusted

    Wenger knows, but he has tried to sign a new right back. he has admitted that arsenal tried to sign trabelsi; so that pretty much proves that rb is a problem. arsenal tried to sign a new right back and failed. it's as simple as that; and now we might have a problem. i just don't rate hoyte; escpecially as a right back. let say we go up against valencia in the cl. imagine hoyte vs. vicente?!?
    :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
     
  3. lee1001

    lee1001 New Member Trusted

    People are forgetting Flamini. By January he would have had the customary 6 months settling in time and he is a right-sided defensive midfielder.

    I know he isn't a RB but with him on the right hand side of midfield it will provide better cover for who ever is playing RB.
    Hoyte likes to get forward and and im sure he and Flamini could be a good partnership on the right.

    About Hoyte...
    England Under-21 and has been on the bench for the first 3 games, started the last. Wenger rates him highly and im sure he will do what Clichy did last year and break through to the first team.
     
  4. Canuck

    Canuck New Member Elite

    Hmmm, Hoyte and Flamini is an interesting thought for years to come but they are both pretty young right now. Especially Flamini! So I doubt they'd get thrown in together unless it's a cup match.
     
  5. chris66

    chris66 New Member

    All these people on here who don't rate Hoyte - how do you know? He played one game in which he made a couple of mistakes - thats what young players do for christ sake. Anyone who saw the early days of Tony Adams will bare testament to that.
    He is widely regarded as one of the best young full backs in the country - having played for England u21s. Would you all feel better if Chelsea had paid 7 million quid for him -would that "prove" him to you?
    Lauren is our first choice right back, has been for quite a while now and rarely gets skinned by anyone - Champions League or not. Just because Arsène tried to sign a new player does not mean he sees it as an area for improvement - there is a big difference. Arsenes skill is to be constantly improving the team, never settling. Every position is constantly under review, every player expected to improve.
    Saying that we will be out of the CL by the next transfer window because we don't have more cover at the back just ignores the fact that we are one of the top teams in Europe and should come through our group stage with my fat ass at full back if need be, such is the quality of the squad.
    Hoyte and even perhaps Senderos has an opportunity to stake their claim ahead of the next window - let's get behind them and see how they do. If they don't cut it a whole host of good players will be not cup tied in January.
    Some of th epeople on this forum really need to get on some anti-depressants! Guys, these are the good times, enjoy.
     
  6. Canuck

    Canuck New Member Elite


    I love it... ;D Succinctly put Chris. Thanks for putting things into perspective for people around here.
     
  7. AFCG7

    AFCG7 New Member Elite

    These are great times and i am definitely enjoying it to the fullest!
    While i understand the optimism surrounding Hoyte we must understand it is still a gamble. The CL is no stage to be making a gamble like that (Hope i am proved worng but there's a 50-50 chance Hoyte wont cope either)
    Our right midfield is not a problem at all... its the defending back 4 that concerns me .. we have at the moment and i mean match fit players :

    Lauren Toure Cygan/Hoyte Cole


    Cole is well covered by Clichy , but we have no proven cover in CB and RB.. that is where the problem lies. Campbell will return but any time 2 of our back four miss games ( apart from our LB) the ****s gonna hit the fan.
     
  8. RocktheCasbah

    RocktheCasbah New Member Elite

    Bravo!

    Well said that man.

    Kel, it doesn't matter whether you rate Hoyte or not. Arsène clearly does, lay off him.
     
  9. _scorpion_

    _scorpion_ New Member

    I have no problem with Hoyte or our right mid feild...

    I think Lauren is totally underestimated..I still havent seen a better RB playing anywhere else....maybe Carles Pyrol....but we can keep dreaming about him


    I still hold very high hopes Sendros.

    I just think Cygan is the biggest liability in the squad and the sooner he's out of North London the better....heck I'll drive him to the airport myself.

    The guy is poor....very poor with no class about his play....but thats a whole can of worms there I'm sure your all bored about reading again...
     
  10. visitor99

    visitor99 New Member

    Chelsea certainly don't have a genuine right winger. Geremi can do a job there (as can Kezman apparently) but if everyone is fit Geremi is probably the player in the squad least likely to get a game. I doubt that the thought of trying to stop Geremi or Kezman as a winger would exactly terrify too many left backs in the EPL.

    I think that has more to do with how Mourinho intends to play than any deficiency in the squad. They had an okay right winger in Gronkjaer and sold him, and with all the money available have never shown any interest at all in any right winger.

    In this respect Mourinho appears similar to Ranieri. Last season Ranieri had two genuine wingers available in the squad (Duff and Gronkjaer). But from memory they were only actually on the field together at the same time on two occasions all season - when Lazio were reduced to ten men, and against Arsenal in the second half of the second leg of the CL, when they had to score or be eliminated. Otherwise Gronkjaer only played when Duff was unavailable.

    So I think it looks like a tactical preference of Mourinho (and also many others). One genuine winger on the left, and the width on the right coming from an overlapping right back. That allows an additional central midfielder to try to dominate the middle. For a right winger role in Chelsea's squad at the moment I think you would probably do better looking at Ferriera and Johnson than Geremi or Kezman.
     
  11. namliam

    namliam New Member

    That is a ridiculous argument, do you not realize that the worst case scenario for any team would be equally disastrous? look at man u without wes brown and ferdinand, their defence looks like **** and please dont give me some useless argument about how man u sux...imagine real madrid without walter samuel and helguerra..whoever the hell happened to play would be demolished by henry reyes pires and bergkamp..to even insinuate that Arsenal have lost the chance to win the CL because we do not have adequate cover or RB is ridiculous...serious injuries to any deffence would destroy the team..even AC milan..

    as regards hoyte, im sure every team has a position where the only cover available is an untried rookie...i real madrid lose zidane and figo they dont exactly have quality replacements in midfield, with man u the midfiled is looking so bad perhaps eagles or richardson may have to step up this season...fact is...its unrealistic to expect quality experienced cover in every position because that would alwayts stifle upcoming talent...Hoyte having to cover RB should be seen as a mixed blessing - yet another Wenger signing getting a chance to prove himself...

    Have some more confidence in the team and lets stop these melodramatic threads...(if we feel like this about the CL imagine wat MAn u fans must be thinking now)
     
  12. quattro

    quattro Active Member

    Wenger's biggest mistake?

    where in this issue has wenger been mistaken? he wanted to get a right back, but if it comes down to terms with trabelsi that has broken down, we will not be held hostage.

    on that cover for the rm we were looking at angulo. the deal didn't work out because angulo can't live in england. tough.

    so where did wenger make a mistake? he was trying to strenghten us in those position that most of you know-it-all pundits are pointing out. it didn't work out as planned, but where did wenger go wrong when most of the issues were with the players being associated with us?
     
  13. AFCG7

    AFCG7 New Member Elite

    I still think he's made one mistake : not signing a quality defender.
     
  14. burnsjed

    burnsjed Well-Known Member

    To be honest I hear a lot of the concerns here, though some do border on madness.
    I am not that concerned with Hoyte as cover, and I think we have plenty of cover in RM, especially as we can always move someone there in case of emergency, Pires, Reyes, RVP, Bergie and any of the CM's, and that doesn't include Pennant.
    I would have been happy if we had bough a RB but only as a direct replacement for Lauren and not as back up.
    I have said this for a while, (and am not just saying this now after he was almost sent-off on Saturday, he wasn't) I believe he is the weakest link in the first eleven, and that doesn't mean he is bad, but I am sure we could do better.
    He does an admirable job considering he was a RM, but who here wouldn't rather Cole or Clichy were actually a RB and not a LB.
    I just feel it is a position we could improve on, and I am very happy with having Hoyte as back-up, sure if our RB broke his leg it would leave us short of experience, but we can't have 22 World class players in the squad.
     
  15. jeromelee

    jeromelee New Member

    Whoahhh strong words. Wenger has seriously screwed up??? I think that's going a bit far. The same time last season we didn't even have any cover in CB except for cygan. Now we even have cover in RB. True Senderos, Hoyte, and clichy may not be the most experienced rotational players, but they definitely have the skills to perform and improve. I think judging Wenger for not buying a defender and saying he has screwed up is a little narrow minded. Who is to say that he did not try acquired those players? As you know, Angulo only changed his mind at the last minute. And Trabelsi's deal just fell through due to some issues between club and player. Those are not reason's to blame Wenger. After all that he has contribute you think he does not want to win the CL? I think Wenger wants it much more than you mate. I think he wants it so badly that he's trying to get the best players he possibly can with the kind of money he's been allocated. I think he wants the CL's as much as any of us or even more than any of us. I think you don't have any idea whatsoever about football if you're saying Wenger has screwed up.

    And frankly, Figo destroying Hoyte? He may get the better of Hoyte once in a while but there's no way in hell he's gonna destroy hoyte. I just watched Figo in action against Mallorca and he's really losing his pace. I mean really losing his pace. And with it, he's losing his penetration abilities as well. But we're not here to discuss Figo. We're here to discuss Hoyte. I think you're crazy to think that Hoyte has no pace. He's extremely fast. His positioning may not be the best at the moment but he's still really fast. I believe that the reason he didn't really excel in that game against the canaries was probably because (1) It was last minute. He wasn't prepared to come in yet but Cygan got injured during warm-ups. (2) Sol wasn't there. Yah Kolo's good but like I've mentioned before, Kolo's only as good as he is now because he was trained by Sol. Sol taught him how to play in Arsenal. Sol game him all the guidance he needed to improve in that department. Sol supported Kolo when he first started his matches in CB. Training is one thing, but the real match is different. If Kolo was injured instead of Sol and we had to play Sol and Hoyte in CB I think Hoyte would've performed better because sol would've given him instructions of what to do. I think in the case of Kolo and Hoyte, they're just both not really experienced in that department and communication between them may be a little bit broken down. Anyway, to say that Hoyte's crap is really going too far.
     
  16. A.Hussain

    A.Hussain New Member

    many of u r underestimating both lauren and hoyte. arsenal **** when they see madrid? give me a break. if los galacticos would even manage a smile in the tunnel, i would be surprised. they would prolly be even more frightened seeing hoyte in the tunnel as they know that the arsenal youngsters are capable of tearing them limb from limb. figo eat hoyte? i know figo is good, but eat hoyte, i dont think so. if u go and ask any member of the team at any random moment as to which team they would rather face the next day, and i guarantee u, the answer is real madrid. the players are more hungry to eat those stupid players alive. give both hoyte and cygan thier chances. wenger is giving, so we know that 'Arsène knows'
     
  17. quattro

    quattro Active Member

    pffffffft...

    i think manure signing rooney suddenly triggered some kind of inferiority complex in a few gooners that now we are f*cked because we missed out on angulo and trabelsi.

    :roll:

    we're fine in cl and we can win the group stage with relative confidence up until the transfer window opens again. as for the league... i dont know. you tell me from what you're seeing now .
     
  18. gunnertilldeath

    gunnertilldeath New Member Elite

    look. worst case scenarios suck for all teams!!! they ****in do!! you cant expect us to have cafu on the field with sagnol and trabelsi waiting for his tablescraps!!! when one part of the team is temporarily weak, the strong components rise up to neutralize that weakness by stepping up their game. that said, this lack of faith in ralph is really beginning to piss me the **** off!! some people here are disgusting me. i just ranted about this in a post 2 seconds ago and i come here and am seeing the same crap. ralph would easily make it into my top 10 RBs in the world. quality player but sadly unappreciated by those he has served best. trabelsi might be better than he is but do not for a second downplay his quality and value to our team. leave ralphy alone!! jeez, this man was the best RB in the country last season and still the people who should be spilling their blood in his defence are not showing faith in his abilities. if Arsène wants trabs, fine. if ajax were asking for 6 million, Arsène would ask them to **** themselves cos lauren is very able. my point is that the trabelsi interest exists because he is available on the cheap. if nesta were available for 5 mill, we would show interest, i am sure but now that that price is closer to 15 mill, we dont give a crap about him cos kolo is great. its the same situation with ralph. Arsène doesnt think he is bad or incapable. there just happens to be a slightly better option at a very low price.
     
  19. gooner4eva

    gooner4eva New Member

    Is this guy mad or what ? He is really stretching the limits of pessimism. Le boss is doing the best he can with the available funds and the players available in the market. What guarantee do we have that any new signing for RB would have been brilliant ? I am sure this guy would have been the first to start moaning if the new guy played one bad game and again complained about Wenger. We have a decent squad right now, with enough depth. This will be a good season for youngsters to come to the fore and shine. If they dont, too bad, but they definitely deserve their chance. I am sure there is no position so vulnerable that it cant be patched for a few matches, till the regular player returns. Arsène Wenger has shown prudence and not bought some **** all player in a hurry. He only invests in quality and we are likely to see a good signing in Jan. Till then enjoy watching the team that is murdering its opponents on the pitch and QUIT MOANING :x
     
  20. Canuck

    Canuck New Member Elite

    need we remember last season after the battle of O.T. and all of the suspension worries that there were. All of the press and pundits were going on about "how was Wenger going to cope with all of the players suspended , and his selection headaches."

    And guess what!!! We went the season undefeated!
     

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