Rumour Youri Tielemans

razörist

Soft With The Ladies, Hard With The Mes
Not really, you are literally saying the same about a lot of modern teams. GK playing with feet is tendency, one FB attacking and the other defending is the oldest thing in football. We got Tierney doing that since he arrived. Even Emery with Kola did it.

Midfield is soooooo different, Peps prefer to use mid to build the plays... Arteta prefers to use FBs and wingers. Peps barely goes long balls, Arteta ask a lot for that.

Ødegaard is recently not going to wings exclusively and more free to move, like a classic 10, that's against 433 positional football.

So is not, you are only looking for what you want to see because Arteta was his assistant. And since we stopped using the rigidity of positional football we are playing better.
You gotta give me Ödegaard man. How many times does he receive the ball in the space between Tomi and Saka. Seriously. Thats not usually where CAM’s are.
 

RunTheTrap

Nobody laughs on my "jokes" 😫
Forget the midfielder. Let's go 4 3 3 and buy Gnabry.

Martinelli------Vlahovic-----Gnabry

------------Ødegaard/ESR----Saka
-------------------------Partey
Why drop Saka back when he is finally adding goals and assists to his game? I'm with you on buying Gnabry but I would have him on the left to bench Martinelli.
 

The_Playmaker

Established Member
Trusted ⭐
Why drop Saka back when he is finally adding goals and assists to his game? I'm with you on buying Gnabry but I would have him on the left to bench Martinelli.

It's just me wanting to play everyone at the same time.

What I would say is that Saka would end up on the wing often when playing as the right 8, especially as Gnabry moves infield and Tomi rarely overlaps.
 

TornadoTed

Well-Known Member
He can be like Bernardo Silva
I've been a big supporter of Saka being an 8 for a long time and Bernardo Silva is exactly the sort of player I picture him becoming in that role. I felt that he just didn't have enough end product and didn't look like a natural enough finisher to play as one of the 3 forwards, however he is proving me wrong this season.
 

Batman

Bruce Wayne
Uhhhh we don’t play as good as City, I’ll give you that. But clearly there are a lot of similarities. The gk that is good on the ball that can play ball under pressure (Ederson barely gets pressed anymore but Rammers does). The stay at home righback to protect for counters. The attacking midfielder that receives the ball on the sideline (Ödegaard for us, Bernardo and KDB for them), the false 9 striker who moves out of the box into midfield (Laca for us, Foden/Jesus for them. The left back that pushes up beyond the winger. Idk man City is basically a blueprint for what I’m seeing at Arsenal. Next up is a Xhaka replacement for a mobile hybrid midfielder like Gundogan (=tielemans).
If Mikel Arteta had worked under anyone but Pep nobody would be trying to force this comparison. People want it to be the case rather than to accept the truth. He's Moyes with less courage. All of what you've said above is a reach. Every team in the world is looking for a gk who is good with the ball at his feet these days. Tomi does not stay at home and he also doesn't invert the way Walker does. Özil used to receive the ball on the sideline under Wenger and Mourinho. Laca's positioning is more to do with his lack of fitness than anything else. There are dozens of teams around the world where the left back pushes beyond the winger. You're trying to cobble all of these things into some homage to what Pep does when none of them are exclusive to Pep and all of them have existed in some form at this club and many others prior to Arteta being here. It's a reach because there was an expectation and a narrative that was never reigned in that Arteta is this great disciple of Pep who was going to bring amazing attacking football to Arsenal. He has not. Pretending otherwise does us no good.
 

Batman

Bruce Wayne
There are obviously some overlap with how we set up and City’s. Similar to them we have an inverted right back who doesn’t push ahead. Tomiyasu/Walker. The left back is the more adventurous one. Cancelo/Tierney/Mendy. The right winger is often isolated with the other team’s fullback and tasked to beat them 1v1. Saka/Mahrez. The left sided winger is more of a forward. Auba/Sterling now it’s more Martinelli/Jesus. Obviously City have more technical players so they can hold the ball much longer than we could hope for and Pep “strangles” teams better but to say we play nothing alike is not true. Pep is the single biggest influence on Arteta.

And when I talk about b2b midfielders, I am referring to the stereotypical all action midfielder who covers every blade of grass. Ala Ramsey. I’m not sure Arteta would allow such freedom for a midfielder demands his midfielders to be more selective with their movement. That’s my interpretation but I could be wrong. I think he prefers the sitting midfielders more with a wide range of passing.
Here's where all of this falls apart. If what you were saying were actually true, you wouldn't have seen Arteta persisting with the likes of Willian as long as he did. Virtually every positive development at this club in terms of personnel has happened as a result of Arteta being reactive(and often not by his own choice but when forced by circumstance) rather than proactive. If Martinelli's inclusion was by design because in your opinion, that's the archetype of player he wants there, he wouldn't have been frozen out as long as he was. The same is true of Lacazette who was also frozen out for most of the beginning of the season. You're trying to reverse engineer a proactive philosophy from a reactive response to Auba going AWOL and young players elevating their games. None of what goes on at this club is exclusive to Pep and you can keep banging on about Pep being Arteta's influence as much as you like, it means nothing when the on pitch evidence is entirely to the contrary. Saying something doesn't make it true. There's nothing that looks intentional about our play. As a matter of fact, the best display this club has put in this season was the robbery against City where Arteta was absent and they were free from the constraints of his constant yelling. Pep does very little comparatively.
 

yorch44

Established Member
You gotta give me Ödegaard man. How many times does he receive the ball in the space between Tomi and Saka. Seriously. Thats not usually where CAM’s are.
In that case is strange ... Butnwe are not a copy of city... And that's good, but we need to play more centrally imo
 

grange

Losing my brain cells 🥸
Saka can play wherever he wants to. He once had a top game in the midfield I think under Arteta.

I like him on the right-wing though so far!
He played at a clip close to the best LBs in the league when he was deployed there. Took a turn at RB as well although maybe not as good in the couple of times he played there but he can play anywhere and influence a game. Dude's a baller.
 

hydrofluoric acid

Many Men Wish Death Upon Me
He played at a clip close to the best LBs in the league when he was deployed there. Took a turn at RB as well although maybe not as good in the couple of times he played there but he can play anywhere and influence a game. Dude's a baller.

Saka is one of the youngsters I was once alone defending. The sausage gang really tried to rip into him!
 

Yousif Arsenal

On Vinai's payroll
Moderator
Either Neves or Tielemans at this price will be upgrade on xhaka I'd prefer Tielemans giving us something different.

We should sign both we need 2 midfielders in summer anyway or even 3 if xhaka leave 😅.
 

Dutch D

Well-Known Member & FPL Champion 19/20
I don't see how you compare Neves and Tielemans, though. One is a creative box-to-box midfielder (Tielemans), the other is a deep-lying playmaker (Neves) with defensive steel.

I think we should either go for 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 depending on the player we bring in.

A Neves type player would suggest 4-2-3-1, with Partey and Neves at the base and Ødegaard/Smith-Rowe in front.
Tielemans would, imo of course, dictate a 4-3-3, with Partey as an anchor and Ødegaard and Tielemans in front of him.

Something along these lines (before other additions to the squad):

Smith-Rowe - Martinelli - Saka
Tielemans - Ødegaard
Partey
In either case I would like us to get Caqueret (or Kamara on a free) alongside any other midfielder we bring in to provide depth. He could cover for Partey in both setups.
 

Yousif Arsenal

On Vinai's payroll
Moderator
I don't see how you compare Neves and Tielemans, though. One is a creative box-to-box midfielder (Tielemans), the other is a deep-lying playmaker (Neves) with defensive steel.

I think we should either go for 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1 depending on the player we bring in.

A Neves type player would suggest 4-2-3-1, with Partey and Neves at the base and Ødegaard/Smith-Rowe in front.
Tielemans would, imo of course, dictate a 4-3-3, with Partey as an anchor and Ødegaard and Tielemans in front of him.

Something along these lines (before other additions to the squad):

Smith-Rowe - Martinelli - Saka
Tielemans - Ødegaard
Partey
In either case I would like us to get Caqueret (or Kamara on a free) alongside any other midfielder we bring in to provide depth. He could cover for Partey in both setups.
They different players Tielemans is more poor defensively than Neves but better offensively that's why I'd prefer him more than Neves because we lack midfielder who get some goals or good long distance goals.
 

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