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Youth Policy - 'Yes' or 'No'

1macca1

Established Member
Trusted ⭐
From what I've read it seems like everybody is wanting change to happen to some degree at the moment and I want to see where the majority stands on Wenger's youth policy. (hopefully someone able can add a poll).

I'm guessing that most people see it as a failure due to the lack of trophies it has yielded, but what are the alternatives? Fans are aggrieved that we don't spend money on established stars and instead persist to play what they see as failures of Wenger's project. However, if we went the way of buying quality rather than nurturing it ourselves, would we do better, or even as good? Personally, I doubt it.

How could we compete with the likes of Man City, Chelsea and the other big spending European teams if we tried matching their fees in the transfer market? Quite simply, we couldn't, certainly not consistently over a number of years.

I don't think the youth project has been a failure, it just hasn't had enough time to reap the reward yet. I can imagine some of you shaking your head, internally screaming "It's been 6 years!" but this is a long term project with the aim of making us consistently successful for a long time and as such, I think deserves patience on our behalf to be given the proper opportunity to succeed.

When I say long term I mean many generations of squads and so far, we've barely gone through half of one (Cesc is still 23 and he was the start of this). People's problem seems to be the lack of leaders, experienced players, winners, all leading this set of young players but it's not hard to envisage the next generation of youth having this to learn from with our current set then being the experienced players. This is a cycle I would like to see continue many times, and once it is running properly, it would only be the very best youth players breaking into the first squad every couple of years. This would mean we wouldn't just be starting from scratch again when the current team retires but would consistently have players of all ages throughout the team (as we can see by the break through of Szczesny and Wilshere this year).

The youth policy doesn't mean we can't buy any stars, just not rely on it, and only do it when it is obviously needed so that we don't break the bank.

This thread is not to look back and point out failures of the project so far, it's a forward looking thread on how you would like Arsenal to be run regarding the squad/transfers and if you're not in favour of the youth policy, please explain your alternative and why you think it would be better.
 

Armor for Sleep

Established Member
Its pretty simple really, we should keep giving youth its chance but only to a level they are capable of playing at.

For example if Frimpong is at Wilshere's level - bring him in and play him regularly, let him fight for a first team spot. If he is just a minimal improvement on Denilson, don't just play him because he'll be a great player in a few years - put him on loan or give him a small role in the squad and spend our money on bringing in a top midfielder.
 

darthwenger

Well-Known Member
I don't see anything wrong with the youth policy as we have all enjoyed Wenger bringing through decent young talent and I'd rather see that than a team full of older mercenaries here for a final pay day. Though, I do agree that Wenger has the mix of young and inexperienced players to the quota of experienced players wrong.

I think Wenger dumped players like Gilberto way too quickly and should have stayed a little longer to pass that experience onto the younger players and give them a kick up the behind. Maybe getting some of the Invicibles back in training or coaching roles would make a big difference to our mentality and the defensive side.

Also Wenger quoted that the average age of the team is 23 but just because they are young doesn't mean they are any good. Just because Diaby or Denilson are young doesn't mean they are going to get any better - I think certain players he'll have to admit this summer just are not going to make the grade - move them on and buy a couple of quality players which may cost a little more and start bringing the next batch through such as Lansbury, Bartley and Jet.

I still say to stay with the youth project to an extent but mix that with a few possibly EPL experienced older players. Wenger should be looking for leader type characters - its not all about technical skill - there is also heart and desire which has carried less skillful players a long way. The mix of technical players is too high - according to Wenger every player in our team needs to be a technical skillful ball player but it doesn't have to be like that. A rough tough hardman in the centre of the park who can win the ball and lay it off to the more skillful players works - you can also apply that to the CB position.
 

mo50

Established Member
Youth policy is only effective when the talent coming in is better than what you have. For example getting rid of Gilberto, Flamini and Diarra within 6 months and "promoting" Denilson is the completely wrong way of going about things.

Only the best of talents shall come through and be given games. The rest can go and forge careers elsewhere. The likes of Wilshere and Szczesny have earned their spots by hitting the ground running, the same cannot be said for a fair few of the current first team members.

A youth policy is great to have, if utilized correctly. Seeing a product of your academy, in which you haven't spent a penny in transfer fees, is a great feeling and it'd be foolish to move away from that.
 

TheEconomist

Established Member
The youth policy is a good idea, and its definately been a success in my eyes. However I dont think we will see the real benefit of it for a good 5 years or so, its a long term thing, and the 6 years that have gone so far isnt really a big amount of time in the grand scale of things

There are some ways it could be impoved though -

We should be more willing to let them go out on loan instead of trying to "mother" them so much. I.E. treat them more like Wilshere rather than Walcott. Wilshere went out on loan to Bolton, and thats when his career really took off and he grew massively as a player. Walcott never went out on loan anywhere, and hes well behind where he should be in terms of development. As Arsène Wenger says "You pay for experience with points" So let another team pay that cost.

Second, We should keep some of our over 30 players, because the youngsters need world class players to learn from, and to bring some confidence and experience into the day, especially during hard games. The lack of this has been obvious

And, where the youth system fails to bring through a player for a position, we shouldnt be as averse to just going out and buying a player rather than waiting for the next generation of players from the youth system to come through I.E. the goalkeeper position
 

outlaw_member

Established Member
Youthful players are inexperienced. Inexperience causes mistakes. Wilshere and Sczcesny for all their talent have cost us this season. The first team is not a nursery to develop players in. I don't care how talented Coquelin or Frimpong or any other upcoming starlet may be. They shouldn't be introduced into our first team squad until they're at least 21.
 

Yousif Arsenal

On Vinai's payroll & misses 4th place trophy 🏆
Trusted ⭐
there are no problem with youth policy (we made the stars not buy them) i know they made some mistakes but they will learn and they will be better next season wilshere sczcesny ramsey lansbury and ryo all they will shine next season so there are no problem but we must have old players in our squad not all the players are between 20-25 age they are all young we want old players they have Experience they can make some lessons to our young players teach them i love our squad like experiences and youngs but the problem is Arsène policy he dont keep player his age above 30 cuz wenger think the players above 30 they cant play more but this is wrong they can play they can do more
 

Kroket

Trusty and Sensible
outlaw_member said:
Youthful players are inexperienced. Inexperience causes mistakes. Wilshere and Sczcesny for all their talent have cost us this season. The first team is not a nursery to develop players in. I don't care how talented Coquelin or Frimpong or any other upcoming starlet may be. They shouldn't be introduced into our first team squad until they're at least 21.

Them costing us wouldn't have mattered if there were experienced players around to help them prevent said mistakes and when they do inevitably make them, how to move on. Szczesny might have cost us the CC final but an experienced, commanding CB would have hoofed the ball away regardless of what the Pole was doing. Just like Wilshere's ocassionaly ill-timed forward runs could have been corrected by the same player, or someone like Flamini or Gilberto either telling Jack to keep it simple for a while or by covering him themselves. Nothing wrong with having a few extremely talented kids in the first team, as for all their flaws the likes of Szczesny, Wilshere and Fabregas have done plenty of good things as well, usually even more so than their senior counterparts.

The balance needs fixing, our so called experienced players aren't good enough at what they're supposed to be doing plus we don't have enough of those players.
 

CandysRoom

Established Member
Armor for Sleep said:
Its pretty simple really, we should keep giving youth its chance but only to a level they are capable of playing at.

For example if Frimpong is at Wilshere's level - bring him in and play him regularly, let him fight for a first team spot. If he is just a minimal improvement on Denilson, don't just play him because he'll be a great player in a few years - put him on loan or give him a small role in the squad and spend our money on bringing in a top midfielder.
Hit the nail on the head with this!
 

qs

Established Member
outlaw_member said:
Youthful players are inexperienced. Inexperience causes mistakes. Wilshere and Sczcesny for all their talent have cost us this season. The first team is not a nursery to develop players in. I don't care how talented Coquelin or Frimpong or any other upcoming starlet may be. They shouldn't be introduced into our first team squad until they're at least 21.

All players make mistakes. Cesc has made his fair share this season should we stop playing him until he "matures"? The reality is that Wilshere is already one of the best midfielders in the world, he had to start, he took that spot on merit and thats exactly how the youth system should work. Bring in young talents but don't gift them years in the first team like Denilson and Bendtner have had. They should have to oust someone else.
 

dyeruz

Established Member
Nothing wrong with the youth policy but not if its being used as an excuse for not investing in players because "you're blocking someones progress"
We needed experience, we need steel and that has been denied on the basis that it stunts the development of some young urchin. That is not the case. There should be a happy medium between experience and youth, with the young guns learning from their elders.
There is also too investment in "potential". Diaby great potential, injured and not consistent. Denilson world beater at 16, still hasn't progressed. Even unknowns like Amauri Bischoff or Nordveit are hailed as potential world beaters on the strength that we have bought them after being assessed by our world famous scouting system...only to bomb out due to various circumstance.
I love the fact we bring through kids who play with touch and skill.
Look at Afobe playing for Huddersfield, Lansbury for Norwich or even Emmanuel Thomas in what limited time he gets for Cardiff, you see kids playing the Arsenal way, kids taught to believe in their skill, kids patient on the ball.
That talent must be tempered and brought along besides more experienced heads.
It would be nice to have a whole team brought through the arsenal academy, but its unrealistic. If a player isn't good enough then you let them go, not persist with them to the detriment of the team ala Senderos or Denilson.
 

Galahad

Well-Known Member
The youth policy is not the problem. The real problem is that we keep playing former youth players (who are now absolutley old enough) when they havent improved at all. See Diaby and Denilson as best examples.

They were young and promising once, now we keep hearing how young they still are when in reality they are closing in on their prime years while showing 0 improvement and playing very inconsistent. THATS the problem.
 

ebouenolike

Established Member
Armor for Sleep said:
Its pretty simple really, we should keep giving youth its chance but only to a level they are capable of playing at.

For example if Frimpong is at Wilshere's level - bring him in and play him regularly, let him fight for a first team spot. If he is just a minimal improvement on Denilson, don't just play him because he'll be a great player in a few years - put him on loan or give him a small role in the squad and spend our money on bringing in a top midfielder.

Yep this. Youth can come through, but only if it's a genuine improvement.
 

outlaw_member

Established Member
Like Kroket said, young players need to be introduced amongst experienced players so that their mistakes can be papered over. Sadly, nearly every mistake Wilshere and Sczcesny have made has hurt the team. Adding another couple of young players will only increase the number we make.
 

sammy89

Well-Known Member
A great man once said, "you pay for experience with points." Time to end this youth policy once and for all.
 

USArsenal

H.Y.I.C.
experience

but we dont have to end the youth policy, we just have to blend it with more experience and bring the youth into the fold more slowly
 

1macca1

Established Member
Trusted ⭐
I agree that is what we should do currently, but it shouldn't be needed to go out and buy experienced players in a few years time onwards as we'll have a continual stream of players at all different ages.
 

truth_hurts

but Holding’s hair transplant was painless
Our youth policy is great but we have become too reliant upon it. For every Szcezney and Wilshere have been too many Denilson, Bendtners, Senderos' and Gibbs and in that I mean good youngsters who have had to much responsibility thrust upon them too soon. Very good youngsters i.e. your Cescs, Wilsheres and Szcezneys fine involve them regularly in the first team.

Bar the Carling cup Wenger seems to be using the young players much better these days but the summer will show whether he has changed his transfer policy towards favoring letting young players ahead of buying ready made, experienced players until the youngsters prove good enough. Will we buy the CB, CM and attacker we need? or will Wenger be afraid to 'kill' Frimpong, Bartley and Miyachi???
 

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