Theo Walcott: Sold to Everton

[Balance is key]

LOL I like how people twists stats like this...

Walcott has very little playing time, during the last 4 years of course his output is going to be higher.

Do you want to see how majestic Kelechi Inaecho stats? 1 goal in every 86 minutes while Aguero is 1 goal in 101 minutes
Using your stick I can prove that Aguero is a lower quality player than Kelechi

Dont be stupid - SO many things wrong with that statement.

I am not using cup games where one can play bumfuck fc - only PL games - Iheanacho got 2 PL goals and 322 minutes to his name. so even if you wanted to you couldnt.
(you could say he is better than Giroud - but aguero would still beat him, as would pretty much any other striker in he league, except Giroud and Benteke : O)

I started out with 9200 of minutes for Walcott - UsGooner wanted less - so I just took the last 4 years and 4700 minutes of play - seeing that walcott still crushed Giroud for output Usgooner asked me to remove the best season walcott had and called it a fluke season - so I did and went down to 2400 minutes of play the last 3 seasons - still the equivalent of one full season. Usgooner was still unhappy seing that Walcotts output was still better than Girouds - so he asked me to only use this season.

Dont hate the fact that I was asked to lower the amount of minutes played by Giroud fanboys - I even said it was useless when he asked me to go lower and lower
The last 4 years is a significant sample - they played in the same team - same league and had more than enough gametime to be a solid indicator.

You should notice that the numbers are consistent - both for 9300-4700 or 2400 minutes of play for Walcott - all of them better than what Giroud has shown.

Notice also that the list of PL strikers who are outscoring Giroud pr minute is massive - most of them with a significant sample - the trend is VERY clear

 

[TheSage]

I'm usually with you and agree with most of ehat you post, but this is utter rubbish!

Wenger likes playmakers and he plays Giroud as he contributes as a playmaker, involving in the midfield and increasing the number of bodies.

Theo is not his ideal CF and hence does not play there.

About his early career affecting his stats, he was played as a suber sub winger for about 5-6 years, injured for about 2 years and first teamer for a bit.

He makes our midfielders look more threeatening and our game more attacking.

Giroud is the french Andy Caroll, who acts as a lump for 9/10 games as he isn't motivated and hungry enough.

When he goes into lamp post mode, I'd rather we just play with 10.

Couple of games with Theo as CF this season,
Leicester, Stoke, United

Sanchez scored 5 goals in those 3 games

With Giroud and Sanchez becomes our worst player.

With Theo at CF for those games, he scored just 2 goals but we as a team looked better.

With Giroud at CF, how many games have we been convincing?

This is not having a dig at Theo nor saying what a "worldy" Giroud is ... in the end you can only measure a player by what he contributes ... there will always be a team factor, a fitness factor, a management factor ... but in the end a player and a team are measured on results, we all are ... Theo's 10 year results are what they are, you can make excuses but you can't change the facts ...

 

[infinium]

I don't see the point of arguing about the issue? Walcott is having a mare atm -- it happens. Unfortunately, it's the business end of the season so there is no time/opportunity for him to be played back into form. It's subs appearances for him until the end of the season barring injuries. He will just have to reset over the summer and start over. Until then Giroud is all we have.

 

[TheSage]

Dont be stupid - SO many things wrong with that statement.

I am not using cup games where one can play bumfuck fc - only PL games - Iheanacho got 2 PL goals and 322 minutes to his name. so even if you wanted to you couldnt.

I started out with 9300 of minutes for Walcott - UsGooner wanted less - so I just took the last 4 years and 4700 minutes of play during the last 4 years - seeing that walcott still crushed Giroud for output Usgooner asked me to remove the best season walcott had and called it a fluke season - so I did and went down to 2400 minutes of play the last 3 seasons - still the equivalent of one full season. Usgooner was still unhappy seing that Walcotts output was still better than Girouds - so he asked me to only use this season.

Dont hate the fact that I was asked to lower the amount of minutes played by Giroud fanboys - I even said it was useless when he asked me to only pick this season.

The last 4 years is a significant sample - they played in the same team - same league and had more than enough gametime to be a solid indicator.

You should notice that the numbers are consistent - both for 9300-4700 or 2400 minutes of play for Walcott - all of them better than waht Giroud has shown.

Said it before and I'll say it again ... you don't win anything on minutes played ... an EPL season is the same length (give or take a bit of injury time) for every player ... at the end of the day what you contribute to your team over the season is what get's measured ... if you miss half the season then you're not contributing ... Theo has never contributed more in a season that Giroud ... not even close ....

How can you claim that Theo with 5 goals has contributed more than Giroud with 18 goals this season .. that's just laughable ...

When is the award for most goals in minutes played given out?

Not knocking Theo or claiming Giroud is great just stating the facts ...

Making it less personal ... for the Dippers who is the best striker Suarez? Torres? Owen? .... well on your criteria none of them ... in fact the best goals per minutes played is Sturridge ... problem is he never fekin' plays either ... what's the betting we sign him next season !!!!!

 

[Balance is key]

Said it before and I'll say it again ... you don't win anything on minutes played ... an EPL season is the same length (give or take a bit of injury time) for every player ... at the end of the day what you contribute to your team over the season is what get's measured ... if you miss half the season then you're not contributing ... Theo has never contributed more in a season that Giroud ... not even close ....

How can you claim that Theo with 5 goals has contributed more than Giroud with 18 goals this season .. that's just laughable ...

When is the award for most goals in minutes played given out?

Not knocking Theo or claiming Giroud is great just stating the facts ...

Making it less personal ... for the Dippers who is the best striker Suarez? Torres? Owen? .... well on your criteria none of them ... in fact the best goals per minutes played is Sturridge ... problem is he never fekin' plays either .....

I am not - Dude My posts actually takes some effort and you arent reading them.

I said the most fair way to compare Theo and Giroud is the last 4 seasons here Walcott isnt a youngster and they played in the same team.

The stats for them playing the same seasons and in the same team in the same league - it just dosnt get anymore fair than that

That would be 4766 minutes of play for walcott with 27 goals and 21 assist - mostly as a winger = a goal and an assist pr 99,23 minutes of play (this is including this years **** run of form being played as LW)

Giroud is at 8974 minutes of PL play got 53 goals and 20 assist = a goal or assist for every 122.93 minutes of PL play

you can also do it for the same amount of time with 9200 minutes of play for walcott, from the time he was 20 - the result is pretty much the same.

>I also compared 13 other current PL strikers to the Giroud numbers - Only Benteke had as little output as Giroud.

You think my actual stats are an opinion - where as your beliefs are facts - its just hard to find a common ground when thats the case

 

[Gael Clea-show]

This is not having a dig at Theo nor saying what a "worldy" Giroud is ... in the end you can only measure a player by what he contributes ... there will always be a team factor, a fitness factor, a management factor ... but in the end a player and a team are measured on results, we all are ... Theo's 10 year results are what they are, you can make excuses but you can't change the facts ...

That's like saying Jack is worse than Campbell as he's got less goals and assists than him (figurative)

For when they DO play, the impact they have must be judged

 

[TheSage]

That's like saying Jack is worse than Campbell as he's got less goals and assists than him (figurative)

For when they DO play, the impact they have must be judged

Why? what impact has Jack had this season?

 

[TheSage]

I am not - Dude My posts actually takes some effort and you arent reading them.

I said the most fair way to compare Theo and Giroud is the last 4 seasons here Walcott isnt a youngster and they played in the same team.

The stats for them playing the same seasons and in the same team in the same league - it just dosnt get anymore fair than that

That would be 4766 minutes of play for walcott with 27 goals and 21 assist - mostly as a winger = a goal and an assist pr 99,23 minutes of play (this is including this years **** run of form being played as LW)

Giroud is at 8974 minutes of PL play got 53 goals and 20 assist = a goal or assist for every 122.93 minutes of PL play

you can also do it for the same amount of time with 9200 minutes of play for walcott, from the time he was 20 - the result is pretty much the same.

>I also compared 13 other current PL strikers to the Giroud numbers - Only Benteke had as little output as Giroud.

You think my actual stats are an opinion - where as your beliefs are facts - its just hard to find a common ground when thats the case

Bottom line this season Giroud 18 goals ... Theo 5 goals ... which player has contributed more?

 

[Balance is key]

Bottom line this season Giroud 18 goals ... Theo 5 goals ... which player has contributed more?

This year alone - based on Theo being played out of position and Giroud in his favorite position its obviously Giroud -

Compared to their time as CF this season, Walcott has done better - Their goals and assist pr minute played are about the same, but our point tally with Theo upfront in the tougher games is a hell of a lot better than what Giroud has done.

The best result was when Theo played the first 60 minutes and Giroud the last 30

Ospina has let in fewer goals than Cech - maybe he is the better keeper ? pretty much what you are arguing with Giroud vs Theo

 

[Rain Dance]

Dont be stupid - SO many things wrong with that statement.

I am not using cup games where one can play bumfuck fc - only PL games - Iheanacho got 2 PL goals and 322 minutes to his name. so even if you wanted to you couldnt.
(you could say he is better than Giroud - but aguero would still beat him, as would pretty much any other striker in he league, except Giroud and Benteke : O)

there's nothing wrong with my stats, why do I have to limit Kelechi's contribution to only PL goals when I am trying to prove how great he is.
Perfect example on how stats are misleading and anyone can twist it to fit whatever arguments.

I started out with 9200 of minutes for Walcott - UsGooner wanted less - so I just took the last 4 years and 4700 minutes of play - seeing that walcott still crushed Giroud for output Usgooner asked me to remove the best season walcott had and called it a fluke season - so I did and went down to 2400 minutes of play the last 3 seasons - still the equivalent of one full season. Usgooner was still unhappy seing that Walcotts output was still better than Girouds - so he asked me to only use this season.

Dont hate the fact that I was asked to lower the amount of minutes played by Giroud fanboys - I even said it was useless when he asked me to go lower and lower
The last 4 years is a significant sample - they played in the same team - same league and had more than enough gametime to be a solid indicator.

You should notice that the numbers are consistent - both for 9300-4700 or 2400 minutes of play for Walcott - all of them better than what Giroud has shown.

Notice also that the list of PL strikers who are outscoring Giroud pr minute is massive - most of them with a significant sample - the trend is VERY clear

Not even trying to discuss Giroud here, I have no issue with Giroud going to the bench. He has done more than fair share of work to his credit no matter how you guys spin his stats. Like how you didn't mention we climbed to 1st place with Giroud....

What I am against is playing anyone off form but he is keep given a chance because his form will improve with significant time. We don't have time for that kind of treatment now, it's February and Sp**s are ahead of us

 

[krackpot]

Bottom line this season Giroud 18 goals ... Theo 5 goals ... which player has contributed more?

lets say we check the games in which Girouds goal statistically made a difference, like his goal or performance/assists was the probable difference between win/loss:

Giroud Big Games: 5 out of 25 starts (Bayern, Everton, Liverpool, Olympiacos, $$ity)
Walcott Big Games: 2 out of 18 starts (United, City..Also against Zagreb and Olympiacos which we both lost)

Giroud has been better than Walcott this season, but there is almost no difference between their output.

 

[Balance is key]

there's nothing wrong with my stats, why do I have to limit Kelechi's contribution to only PL goals when I am trying to prove how great he is.
Perfect example on how stats are misleading and anyone can twist it to fit whatever arguments.

The thing is - you are trying to mislead - I show X vs Y in the same league for a significant amount of time - I do it for different players in the same position- all having the exact same criteria. Prettu much all of them got more than two full seasons under their belt.

You go and find one player for a very limited amount of time in a cup game.

Austin,Remy and Ighalo dosnt have enough gametime to really compare - Sturridge has been too injured to be a fair comparison (mostly for him)

Also Mahrez and Firmino isnt in the list even though they would crush him - but not enough gamtime as CF

Seeing that pretty much any striker got a higher output than Giroud when playing in the same competition sure as hell should raise some concerns

If you cant see the difference in having 4000 minutes of play vs a cup game - its a pointless discussion.

For me the stats are interesting and I would actually have thought Giroud had a higher output compared to the other strikers in the league.

Also the stats pretty much fall in line with who people rates the most - at least for the ones who have enough of a sample-size.

If giroud could match the output from Costa, even with his poor current season, we wouldnt be behind spuds in goal difference - also we would be ahead of them regarding points.

But dont act like I am putting up stats that arent correct or fair - it is what it is, and only shows how the PL strikerw stack up against each other for a significant amount of time.

it obviously still isnt 100% fair since some are playing for lesser teams who create fewer chances - some takes penalties, others dont - still plenty of room for error, but all in all - its the fairest way to judge PL strikers.

Harry kane is at 135 minutes pr goal in the PL while being 20-22
Lukaku is at 165 minutes of play for every PL goal while being 18-22
Diego costa is at 133 minutes pr PL goal
Aguero is at 108 minutes pr goal in the PL
Sturridge is at 135 minutes pr goal in the PL
Remy is at 152 minutes pr goal in the PL
Bony is at 144 minutes pr goal in the PL
Benteke is at the same as Giroud
Vardy is at 140 minutes of play as CF pr PL goal
Rooney is way better - dont want to add up all his seasons as CF
Austin is at 163 minutes pr PL goal
Ighalo is at 142 minutes pr PL goal

 

[Gael Clea-show]

Bottom line this season Giroud 18 goals ... Theo 5 goals ... which player has contributed more?

Giroud 18 goals
Coquelin 0 goals

Giroud more important to the team = your logic!

 

[Gael Clea-show]

Why? what impact has Jack had this season?

Your logic is players who contribute more over their career span at Arsenal make them more valuable and deserve their place.

So the argument to such a rubbish statement is that Jack has had less goals than say Campbell or even Theo.

But we know Jack is better and makes us a better team.

So when fit and available, Jack should start over whoever in his position provided the person being replaced isn't helping the team as much

 

[Rain Dance]

I was trying to stay out of Giroud debate here actually....

the thing is, goal/minutes is affected by minutes played. And it's completely misleading.

The thing is - you are trying to mislead - I show X vs Y in the same league for a significant amount of time - I do it for different players in the same position- all having the exact same criteria. Prettu much all of them got more than two full seasons under their belt.

You go and find one player for a very limited amount of time in a cup game.

Okay I'll bite

For me the stats are interesting and I would actually have thought Giroud had a higher output compared to the other strikers in the league.

Also the stats pretty much fall in line with who people rates the most - at least for the ones who have enough of a sample-size.

If giroud could match the output from Costa, even with his poor current season, we wouldnt be behind spuds in goal difference - also we would be ahead of them regarding points.

But dont act like I am putting up stats that arent correct or fair - it is what it is, and only shows how the PL strikerw stack up against each other for a significant amount of time.

it obviously still isnt 100% fair since some are playing for lesser teams who create fewer chances - some takes penalties, others dont - still plenty of room for error, but all in all - its the fairest way to judge PL strikers.

Harry kane is at 135 minutes pr goal in the PL while being 20-22
Lukaku is at 165 minutes of play for every PL goal while being 18-22
Diego costa is at 133 minutes pr PL goal
Aguero is at 108 minutes pr goal in the PL
Sturridge is at 135 minutes pr goal in the PL
Remy is at 152 minutes pr goal in the PL
Bony is at 144 minutes pr goal in the PL
Benteke is at the same as Giroud
Vardy is at 140 minutes of play as CF pr PL goal
Rooney is way better - dont want to add up all his seasons as CF
Austin is at 163 minutes pr PL goal
Ighalo is at 142 minutes pr PL goal

Giroud is 1 goal/170 minutes ?
Okay this is from transfermarkt this season Giroud is 1 goal per 132 minutes overall, 1 goal in 142 minutes in EPL.

While :Kane is 147 minutes / EPL goal, 152 minutes/goal overall
"Rooney is way better" overall 14 goals = 1 goal/192 minutes, 7 EPL goals = 1 goal/259 minutes.
Vardy is 140 minutes per PL goal... amazing stats transfermarkt shows he is 194 minutes per PL goals tho...163 minutes per goal overall. this season he is 1 in 121 minutes per goal tho

I see you cut out every other competition than the EPL out and put overall on the stats because that's how you got Giroud to that low percentage.
Put this season only stats, you'll see a new and improve Giroud at 132/goals minutes.

 

[Rain Dance]

Your logic is players who contribute more over their career span at Arsenal make them more valuable and deserve their place.

So the argument to such a rubbish statement is that Jack has had less goals than say Campbell or even Theo.

But we know Jack is better and makes us a better team.

So when fit and available, Jack should start over whoever in his position provided the person being replaced isn't helping the team as much

technically... this season Campbell contributes more since Jack is injured most of the time

 

[Gael Clea-show]

technically... this season Campbell contributes more since Jack is injured most of the time

But he isn't referring to this season is he?
He's rating Giroud higher as Theo's contribution over 10 years is average.

Also, it's like comparing Giroud and Sanchez. Different positions

Let's compare our teams' goals per game average with Theo at CF and Giroud at CF this season

 

[Lilwizzle]

You should have just resisted @Rain Dance, not worth your time.

 

[Balance is key]

I was trying to stay out of Giroud debate here actually....

the thing is, goal/minutes is affected by minutes played. And it's completely misleading.



Okay I'll bite



Giroud is 1 goal/170 minutes ?
Okay this is from transfermarkt this season Giroud is 1 goal per 132 minutes overall, 1 goal in 142 minutes in EPL.

While :Kane is 147 minutes / EPL goal, 152 minutes/goal overall
"Rooney is way better" overall 14 goals = 1 goal/192 minutes, 7 EPL goals = 1 goal/259 minutes.
Vardy is 140 minutes per PL goal... amazing stats transfermarkt shows he is 194 minutes per PL goals tho...163 minutes per goal overall. this season he is 1 in 121 minutes per goal tho

I see you cut out every other competition than the EPL out and put overall on the stats because that's how you got Giroud to that low percentage.
Put this season only stats, you'll see a new and improve Giroud at 132/goals minutes.

Holy ****ing crap - you cant be serious - there really isnt any reason to correct you - you will refuse to read it anyway.

Some players you take two seasons - like vardy ignoring that he played most games as a winger - ffs come on, others you take one season -like Kane ignoring his last season

And yes I am obviusly not including anything else but EPL games since thats the only fair way to do it - they play against the same teams.

You are picking and choosing the stats you want to show, ignoring some seasons - I show every single game n the EPL they have played as CF omitting nothing - you ignore good seasons for those who had one last year - those who had a poor season you include, even when they didnt play CF

I show 100% how they have done as CF in all their games in the EPL - you pick and chose seasons depending on what suits your argument - you might as well just make up your numbers, mine are correct.

 

[Batman]

Can we all agree that it's criminal that a club that has in the last 2 decades had the likes of Wright, Bergkamp, Anelka, Henry and Van Persie leading the line has now reduced its supporters to debating whether Olivier Giroud or Theo Walcott should be our number 1 striker?I mean just wrap your minds around that for a second. That's f*cking depressing.