Gabriel Jesus: Will He Score Again?

[Trilly]

Think the wide player with more of an eye for a goal, but that can still play Artetaball is key for a title push.

Having said that, yellow box is still the hardest cog in the team to replace without having to rethink a few things tactically.

Also not sure you can get the first paragraph in Jan without paying crazy money. Could sign a nice rotation option though. As for Partey backup we may have to settle for someone who can at least do what he does defensively, I’d maybe gamble on Elneny’s fitness tbh.

Both the ‘title push’ signings we need are going to be very difficult to do in Jan, I think people expecting that should lesson expectations. Depth signings should be easier though.

 

[Trilly]

I'll add that I think City also have more realible "second string" goal scorers, so to speak.

Think I posted that somewhere earlier in the thread as to why it’s such a lazy comparison.

Last season City had KDB on 15 and about 5/6 players on around 8 goals and upwards. That’s like us expecting all of our attack + midfield to have a career high in goals in the same season. Possible of course but a fool’s gambit if the club actually do want the title.

 

[Deleted member 102404]

This is maybe the 10th time I’ve seen this mentioned as a kind of roundabout defence of Jesus and explanation as to why we don’t need a striker.

First of all, it’s way too early in the season to judge. Secondly if Pep and Klopp both decide that their very successful teams still need a striker…I’m going to assume they know what they doing.

It's not really a defence of Jesus, just an observation of what has happened.
Fair enough assuming Pep and Klopp know what they are doing - even if it's not working out yet. But then, let's also assume Arteta knows what he is doing. Nketiah has been given a new contract and is our back up striker. The club believe in him. I do too actually. We're too quick to write off players and look for the next player every time a transfer window comes round.

 

[El Duderino]

Also not sure you can get the first paragraph in Jan without paying crazy money. Could sign a nice rotation option though. As for Partey backup we may have to settle for someone who can at least do what he does defensively, I’d maybe gamble on Elneny’s fitness tbh.

Both the ‘title push’ signings we need are going to be very difficult to do in Jan, I think people expecting that should lesson expectations. Depth signings should be easier though.

Oh, I know it's hard to pull off those kind of signings now. But all I'm saying is that we have to try.

This really is a golden oportunity. You can point to "what do you do with Martinelli?" and sure, it's a valid question, but if somehow we win the league, I don't think either us or Martinelli will care much about it.

Even if we "only" end up pushing for second (given it's city we're up against), that's such a welcome change and a signal of intent from the club, manager and players that we have to give it a go.

 

[2Smokeyy]

The Sp**s example from last season is not common. It's way over used. How often do January signings change a season? Not often.

How often do January signings change a season?

Kulusevski is the prime example but I’ll give you some examples:

- We signed Aubameyang in January - Jan to May he scored 10 goals and 4 assists in 14 games.
- Andrei Arshavin another January came in and hit the ground running immediately.
- Bruno Fernandes 15 goals and nine assists in 22 games after joining in January.
- Coutinho 3 goals and 5 assists in 13 games.
- Van Dijk shored up that Liverpool defence as soon as he came in.
- A-M told me Luis Díaz would do nothing but he was an instant impact when he came to the PL in January.
- Louis Saha another January signing, came in and scored 12 PL goals between then and the end of the season.
- Daniel Sturridge 12 in 18 games in the second half of the season when Brendan Rodgers brought him in.

So many examples there and I can give you more but it’s wild to just narrow it to Kulusevski and Bentacur as being anomalies. This sort of thinking that the January window wouldn’t help us is one of the reasons why we never progress unfortunately.

We don't actually need to change our season either. We need to continue as we are, so the only argument really is that we might get injuries. So might every other club. City get injuries to Haaland and DeBryne and their title challenge is over. Should they go and splash on a DeBryne back up and a better player than Alvarez as a back up to Haaland, because they'll be heavily weakened if they are out?

As for last year, it actually wasn't Sp**s signings that stopped us getting top 4 anyway. We just screwed up at the end - because our players were just too inexperienced. You could say we should have brought in more experience, but then I think it is necessary for young players to go through what we did last year and get the experience of situations they will face ongoing.

I do get the fear of injuries, of course, but I am not convinced that trying to mitigate all eventualities wrt to injuries is either possible or appropriate. I don't think squads are built that way.

Still doesn't make sense to me that there are so many calls for new signings in January to the extent it's 'unacceptable' if we don't. We're top, we have just had Elneny come back for depth and ESR is coming back also. I wouldn't mind a Lakonga replacement, but I just don't see where else we are short.

Look, I am not adverse to new signings in January - if the club think it's the right thing to do, I will be happy anyway. I am just not in the camp that thinks there is some imperative or we're screwed if we don't bring in new players. Thought the same last year too, even when we missed out on top 4.

You realise City squad depth is so clear of ours, right? They have Mahrez and Grealish just sitting on the bench whilst we have Nketiah and Smith-Rowe (if he’s even fit) to step in if there are any injuries. I really thought those Europa League and Carabao Cup games would open eyes that the depth behind our first eleven is not good enough to compete for the title but I guess I was mistaken.

 

[db10_therza]

let's also assume Arteta knows what he is doing

Are you new around here?

 

[El Duderino]

I agree on the premise but not the timing. Just feel like messing with the system in January isn’t the right call and one better left for the summer. In January I want “like for like” depth

Again, you don't have to mess with the system so much. Another way of looking at this is, if an injury happens, would you rather have that goal scoring winger or plan-b striker on board already?

This team has much less of a problem being as goldilocks as it was last season, but it can still struggle at times when plan A is not working out.

An injury to Partey or Saka or Jesus and there isn't that much depth to speak of and the team would have to adapt and change the way we play, even if only slightly.

Look at it from the perspective of really pushing City for this and I rather we try and go all out, despite how hard the jan window is.

 

[El Duderino]

How often do January signings change a season?

Kulusevski is the prime example but I’ll give you some examples:

- We signed Aubameyang in January - Jan to May he scored 10 goals and 4 assists in 14 games.
- Andrei Arshavin another January came in and hit the ground running immediately.
- Bruno Fernandes 15 goals and nine assists in 22 games after joining in January.
- Coutinho 3 goals and 5 assists in 13 games.
- Van Dijk shored up that Liverpool defence as soon as he came in.
- A-M told me Luis Díaz would do nothing but he was an instant impact when he came to the PL in January.
- Louis Saha another January signing, came in and scored 12 PL goals between then and the end of the season.
- Daniel Sturridge 12 in 18 games in the second half of the season when Brendan Rodgers brought him in.

So many examples there and I can give you more but it’s wild to just narrow it to Kulusevski and Bentacur as being anomalies. This sort of thinking that the January window wouldn’t help us is one of the reasons why we never progress unfortunately.



You realise City squad depth is so clear of ours, right? They have Mahrez and Grealish just sitting on the bench whilst we have Nketiah and Smith-Rowe (if he’s even fit) to step in if there are any injuries. I really thought those Europa League and Carabao Cup games would open eyes that the depth behind our first eleven is not good enough to compete for the title but I guess I was mistaken.

Monreal was signed in the Jan window. Can't forget about La Cabra.

 

[Gooner416]

I would hate to be your girlfriend for SO MANY REASONS. But one of the biggest would have to be your incessant pining over your exes and equally consistently moaning “why can’t you just finish!” every night.

Dunno how @Lady_Gooner puts up with you tbh.

Where tf does this come from

 

[El Duderino]

Are you new around here?

I know we're all happy the team is doing great and we're all excited about being top, but last year we decided to sit tight and lost top 4 partly because of that.

 

[2Smokeyy]

Monreal was signed in the Jan window. Can't forget about La Cabra.

how did I miss him out?

The streets will never forget @Nacho Monreal. Wonderful signing.

 

[Dokaka]

Wow you really went out of your way to bring him down just to say he’s playing better anyway?

…why? I think I know why tbh.

How did I bring him down?

Some of you see agendas everywhere, it gets so ****ing tiring. I just saw someone compare his numbers to two of the best players in the world and wanted to add context. If I somehow "brought him down" by saying Lacazette is playing to the level he has through the majority of his career and better than last season.. I really don't know what to tell you. The only thing I really spoke negatively about was Ligue 1.

I guess this is somehow about Arteta? I don't even know anymore, some of you people can't write 5 words without seeing connections like ****ing conspiracy madmen.

 

[db10_therza]

I know we're all happy the team is doing great and we're all excited about being top, but last year we decided to sit tight and lost top 4 partly because of that.

Ngl sometimes I struggle to work out if we’re more like spoilt kids fighting over who gets the window seat in business class, or if we’re war vets suffering from PTSD.

 

[El Duderino]

Ngl sometimes I struggle to work out if we’re more like spoilt kids fighting over who gets the window seat in business class, or if we’re war vets suffering from PTSD.

Yes.

 

[db10_therza]

Where tf does this come from

I like picking on easy targets. Makes me feel like a bigger person. Bangladeshis don’t tend to be blessed with height…

 

[Deleted member 102404]

How often do January signings change a season?

Kulusevski is the prime example but I’ll give you some examples:

- We signed Aubameyang in January - Jan to May he scored 10 goals and 4 assists in 14 games.
- Andrei Arshavin another January came in and hit the ground running immediately.
- Bruno Fernandes 15 goals and nine assists in 22 games after joining in January.
- Coutinho 3 goals and 5 assists in 13 games.
- Van Dijk shored up that Liverpool defence as soon as he came in.
- A-M told me Luis Díaz would do nothing but he was an instant impact when he came to the PL in January.
- Louis Saha another January signing, came in and scored 12 PL goals between then and the end of the season.
- Daniel Sturridge 12 in 18 games in the second half of the season when Brendan Rodgers brought him in.

So many examples there and I can give you more but it’s wild to just narrow it to Kulusevski and Bentacur as being anomalies. This sort of thinking that the January window wouldn’t help us is one of the reasons why we never progress unfortunately.



You realise City squad depth is so clear of ours, right? They have Mahrez and Grealish just sitting on the bench whilst we have Nketiah and Smith-Rowe (if he’s even fit) to step in if there are any injuries. I really thought those Europa League and Carabao Cup games would open eyes that the depth behind our first eleven is not good enough to compete for the title but I guess I was mistaken.

Auba was a replacement - we lost Sanchez and we actually scored LESS goals with Auba and Laca than we did with Sanchez and Laca. We missed top 4.
Arshavin - quite a small impact - we finished 4th and won nothing after he came.
Fernandez did make a big difference
Countinho - do you mean Villa? He was hardly a massive influence on their outcome
Van Dijk - yeah
Saha and Sturridge you are going back a bit.

How many January signings have there been vs how many have actually made a tangible impact? It's rare. Even if we think we're getting a good player, it's a gamble. High fees at that point in the season and limited availability even before the uncertainty it will make any difference at all.

I am not writing off our back up players after a few EL games. I have seen good things from many of them and am more confident many of them are actually good enough as back up players (and maybe more in the future)

January signings can have an impact, no doubt, but more likely to make no impact at all.
Let's take Toney as an example. So he comes in, Nketiah is then finished and has either gone (i.e replacement, not addition) or is totally unmotivated and looking for a way out in the summer. Toney, sits on the bench waiting for a chance to come on in a game where we 'need another dimension'. Has to score and turn the game around from the bench and if he doesn't is quickly written off and we're looking for a new back up striker in the summer. That's all assuming he would ever want to join as a back up for times when we needed to lump the ball up in a game! Doesn't make any sense.

 

[AbouCuéllar]

Hmmm which one do you think is more necessary for us to sign in January? A wide player or a 15-20+ goal striker with Jesus being an option out wide?

I’m starting to lean towards the latter tbh since those goals could be crucial in us winning the title.

Jesus wide

Players like GJ with incredibly good close control in short spaces, great first touch, fantastic decision making in leading a press, fantastic agility and ability to hold up the ball under pressure from a defender and/or with defenders at their back, and overall very good decision making on and off the ball, are far, far more suited, and see their virtues best capitalised on, in a central role.

I don’t watch City on a week to week basis with detail so to comment, but I do wonder if Pep regrets a bit his usage of him or what his thoughts on the matter would be in retrospect.

If the time comes that we see we need more goals in our game it will be adding them via the addition of another high scoring wide forward. For now there is well enough scope for projection and improvement between GJ himself and Martinelli and Saka, and we are 1st with a very good scoring record without a particularly high scoring central attacking midfield contribution as it is.

He's at a fantastic level through the middle, and clearly better through the middle than he was wide for City, and his qualities are much more exploited and valuable through the middle. Moving Jesus wide is an absolute non-starter, for me.

To me it’s still a wide player. The way we play is so reliant on having pace and 1v1 threat out wide, the whole makeup of the team is geared to getting Saka and Martinelli on the ball high up the pitch, if one of those goes down we are not the same team.

Agreed, and one of them will go down at some point, for sure. Mudryk in January makes so much sense. A player we can bed into the team but who has big talent and potential and can ease the drop-off from Gabigod or Saka when an injury happens. Pino too would work nicely. Right age profile and talent level both.

Niether - I think if we are going to sign someone it should be in midfield.
Lakonga looks a goner.

ESR is coming back in Jan
He's very effective wide left of an attacking 3...and actually will be like a new signing

I think ESR, given the evolution of the team and the two CAM system with the 3-2 (Thomas and Zinny)-4-1 in possession, will be developed through the middle (also that shot of the squad planning board where ESR was in the middle in that LCM position).

We should sign an attacker and a Thomas back-up. Given the latter is harder to find I actually think it's more acceptable if we don't sign the latter than a back-up to Martinelli and Saka, should we have doubts about Danilo (always better to not buy than buy in these cases if there are any doubts). We can get away with a Zinchenko-Elneny pivot, I think, though of course there's still a drop-off, and it would be preferable to sign someone we're convinced with and can upgrade Elneny. Finding that in a back-up is difficult, though (for example Enzo surely would be an upgrade on Elneny, but he's not coming here to be Thomas' back-up, that only can happen in video games).

We also should be in the market for inside left back or RB / pivot, but those players are few and far between, of course, especially to take a back-up role in the squad.

 

[KrissKringle]

Ngl sometimes I struggle to work out if we’re more like spoilt kids fighting over who gets the window seat in business class, or if we’re war vets suffering from PTSD.

I think it's definitely the latter. I've been an Arsenal fan for the past 17 years and it's been hard as hell, man.

Definitely took a toll on me and I had to drop my favorite team from my country because I couldn't resist supporting two teams that weren't winning anything.

 

[Dokaka]

I'm not sure shifting Jesus out wide is even on the table for Arteta given a big part of him joining was the promise of finally playing his favoured position. Might upset Jesus by shifting him out wide.

Don't think it'd be a good idea at all from a footballing perspective anyway given your front 3 is great and will only get better with time and games.

 

[db10_therza]

I'm not sure shifting Jesus out wide is even on the table for Arteta given a big part of him joining was the promise of finally playing his favoured position. Might upset Jesus by shifting him out wide.

Don't think it'd be a good idea at all from a footballing perspective anyway given your front 3 is great and will only get better with time and games.

Tbf, I don’t think anyone is suggesting shunting Jesus out wide as our first choice preferred line up. It’s more a question of what to do if we buy a striker as opposed to a wide player and then get an injury to an existing wide player. Eg we bring in Toney and then Saka gets injured - you’d have to say the best option for us in that scenario would be to play Toney through the middle and Jesus on the right.

My preference though as stated is to get a wide player (assuming it’s an either/or)