Mikel Arteta: Aston La Vista To The Title?

[Harz]

It is true that we're in a transitional period and expectations are lower than they usually are at Arsenal. It is also fair to point out the current squad is very hard to improve as there are a lot of bad players who are hard to push out and not much money to spend.

Still, what did Arteta accomplish that should grant him the benefit of the doubt? Why give Arteta any money to spend at all? He has no prior experience and his internship is over. Arsenal has to react or it risks losing its relevance for a while.

Transitions are only successful if done with right coaches -- like Liverpool did recently with Klopp or as we did in the 90s with Wenger. Arteta is criminally underachieving and terribly mismanaging the players who'll be involved in our future, and instead relies on players who won't be at this club by 2023. This is not how transition is done.

 

[Rasmi]

It is true that we're in a transitional period and expectations are lower than they usually are at Arsenal. It is also fair to point out the current squad is very hard to improve as there are a lot of bad players who are hard to push out and not much money to spend.

Still, what did Arteta accomplish that should grant him the benefit of the doubt? Why give Arteta any money to spend at all? He has no prior experience and his internship is over. Arsenal has to react or it risks losing its relevance for a while.

Transitions are only successful if done with right coaches -- like Liverpool did recently with Klopp or as we did in the 90s with Wenger. Arteta is criminally underachieving and terribly mismanaging the players who'll be involved in our future, and instead relies on players who won't be at this club by 2023. This is not how transition is done.

Exactly if transition is to bin nelson and martinelli and give willian minutes, then it really makes no sense. If the expectations is lower than ever, then young players like martinelli and saliba should have been given minutes to gain experience and play. But its willian and Mari he choose.

 

[scytheavatar]

I think managers need to get more time. I'm not really invested anymore in if the manager should be sacked or not or what manager should come in next. I let you drama queens fight about that. But until we are ready to give the manager 3-5 years with a lot of up and downs to shape the team and work it, nothing will change.

More time to do what? Wenger already made it clear:

"I don't believe in patience in football, you know, you have three months to have an impact when you arrive somewhere," Wenger says. "And if I look at my clubs everywhere I arrived, it didn't take me three years to have an influence.


"That's an idea that's floating around but it never works that way. You have an influence at the start, or you never have one.


"I think [he has had that influence]. But I am not at the club. After it's the way the team plays and the games you win or you lose, you know, it's simple.


"It's about results. It's as simple as that."

If we fire Arteta at the end of this season, no one can argue that he hasn't been given enough time. Arteta has been given enough time to show that he's a special manager who can get us punching above our weight, and he has so far failed to do that. No one can say Arteta needs more money and time to sign more players, you don't see Rodgers needing Mbappe to get Leicester to perform.

 

[albakos]

So it is you that I must thank? Not sure how @albakos will feel about me giving you his props.

Not good on @OnlyOne to brag about

 

[Macho]

I just think in the transitional state we are at hiring a manager like Arteta was a mistake we will pay for.

We needed a squad building manager who could get the maximum out of less. Someone that would allow the club to sign unpolished players and take them a step further either for profit or squad improvement (which I don’t think you can do with Mikel for reasons I’ve stated many times).

Instead we have a novice who openly states he doesn’t have the right players and we’ve never been a club that spends loads.

Instead of giving minutes to players with more upside we persist some that aren’t going anywhere (Xhaka, Willian even Luiz to an extent). Giving minutes to younger players would have been easy to do since this was a throw away season.

A lot more people than I thought are willing to sit through this as well. If it was a case of simply buying the best players possible then why Arteta? I just don’t get it.

 

[Makingtrax]

Remember when me @Tir Na Nog @Makingtrax @hydrofluoric acid etc wanted Arteta and you with @Jury got your knickers in a twist over it.

Nothing wrong with giving Arteta another season if fans and the board feel like he's not going to do a Lampard.

But for the love of Arsène lets stop pretending that this season has been anything but a bunch of mistakes and terrible football. We're not 10th because of VAR and definitely not because the squad is crap. We've never spent so much and it's pretty decent.

 

[Oxeki]

We're not 10th because of VAR and definitely not because the squad is crap. We've never spent so much and it's pretty decent.

The squad is not crap ffs

 

[hydrofluoric acid]

More time to do what? Wenger already made it clear:




If we fire Arteta at the end of this season, no one can argue that he hasn't been given enough time. Arteta has been given enough time to show that he's a special manager who can get us punching above our weight, and he has so far failed to do that. No one can say Arteta needs more money and time to sign more players, you don't see Rodgers needing Mbappe to get Leicester to perform.

Wenger last job was when he joined us 1996 or something when he only had to compete with Manchester United. It is a bit different right now. We have fallen behind, our owner doesn't seem to have the ambition other owners are showing.

We could sack Arteta after this season. Sure. If the owner had the ambition. Which he does not. I don't even care. But if the next manager doesn't get 3-5 seasons to put his mark on the team I fear we will keep repeating these circles.

The 1-2 season thingy only really works if a manager gets 150-200 M to spend every window.

 

[Macho]

I thought we wasn’t bringing Wenger into this?

Also you can’t talk about blindly giving a habitual loser who makes excuses (or gets excuses made for them) 3-5 years then talk about ambition in the same sentence. Not necessarily saying this is Mikel but still.

Arteta will get his 2-3 years regardless of results. He’s not expected to win matches and he’s being backed in the market, whether it comes to getting in players or cancelling contracts. He really couldn’t ask for more.

 

[Penn_]

Is Chelsea’s squad substantially better than ours? Because we were level with them until Tuchel came in and took them into the top four fight.

 

[Artisan]

His only saving grace for me is that he didn't have a pre-season to work with the team. Even though it was the same for everyone else, considering the drastic change in philosophy from Emery's 9-0-1 formation and him being a complete rookie with a new coaching staff maybe it was a lot more vital for him and his coaching team compared to others.

If they're making "club signings" like Gabriel and Thomas it should be alright. Hopefully he won't get any more specially requested Willians.

Good luck to this club making signings like Gabriel and Thomas when we finish bottom half of the table tbh. At least his people will be able to cry that we didn't back him when we don't bring anyone good in and he ineveitably continues squandering talents like Saliba and Martinelli.

 

[scytheavatar]

Wenger last job was when he joined us 1996 or something when he only had to compete with Manchester United. It is a bit different right now. We have fallen behind, our owner doesn't seem to have the ambition other owners are showing.

We could sack Arteta after this season. Sure. If the owner had the ambition. Which he does not. I don't even care. But if the next manager doesn't get 3-5 seasons to put his mark on the team I fear we will keep repeating these circles.

The 1-2 season thingy only really works if a manager gets 150-200 M to spend every window.

Leicester went through the 1-2 seasons thingy and they didn't need 150-200 M to spend every window............. what made you think it is possible for us to avoid "repeating these circles"? Look at the struggle Liverpool went through after falling out of the top 4 and how long it took for them to get back.

 

[Rasmi]

Is Chelsea’s squad substantially better than ours? Because we were level with them until Tuchel came in and took them into the top four fight.

It’s not. They have too many players who are similar. For example mount, ziech and Havertz want to occupy similar areas and cancel each other out. Their defence is same level as ours. But tuchel is on different level

 

[Macho]

If they're making "club signings" like Gabriel and Thomas it should be alright. Hopefully he won't get any more specially requested Willians.

Yeah but for every Gabriel and Thomas you’ll get some that crash and burn like Pepe. Or not be fancied at all like Saliba.

Club signings don’t really bang if there’s zero pressure to utilise them.

For Arteta to work you’ll have to give him his Willian’s as it’s better to spend money on players who will actually be utilised and be afforded persistence.

 

[say yes]

Remember when me @Tir Na Nog @Makingtrax @hydrofluoric acid etc wanted Arteta and you with @Jury got your knickers in a twist over it.

Goebbels Deep attempting his monthly re-write of the past again is it?

You didn't want Arteta; you were on your knees gagging for Mourinho.

Remember the last time we did this and you had to pretend your account had been hacked? Gabriel Magalhães: Not Our Only Signing

 

[hydrofluoric acid]

Leicester went through the 1-2 seasons thingy and they didn't need 150-200 M to spend every window............. what made you think it is possible for us to avoid "repeating these circles"? Look at the struggle Liverpool went through after falling out of the top 4 and how long it took for them to get back.

Yeah sure lets wait and see if we can repeat Leicester achievement any time soon.

Even with Klopp second season he fluked the top4 from us. Nothing special about his second season. I think 3-5 season on a decent finicial backing is the way to go for managers.

 

[Makingtrax]

Wenger last job was when he joined us 1996 or something when he only had to compete with Manchester United. It is a bit different right now. We have fallen behind, our owner doesn't seem to have the ambition other owners are showing.

We could sack Arteta after this season. Sure. If the owner had the ambition. Which he does not. I don't even care. But if the next manager doesn't get 3-5 seasons to put his mark on the team I fear we will keep repeating these circles.

The 1-2 season thingy only really works if a manager gets 150-200 M to spend every window.

That's a myth. The league was tough in those days too. Blackburn Rovers had been taken over by the Walker Bothers who paid a record signing fee for Alan Shearer winning the league in 1995, battling it out with Liverpool and United. Liverpool were still a big force and that year Middlesborough splashed out millions on foreign players like Emerson, Ravanelli, Branco and Festa. And Newcastle United with Kevin Keegan in charge had a superb team with David Ginola, Les Ferdinand and of course poaching Shearer from Blackburn for another record fee of £15m. Villa too were big in those days

It was a hard league and Wenger knew nothing about English football but he still got top 4 right from his first season, having been 12th the season before. He was no Arteta, and it was a sign of what was to come.

 

[say yes]

You going to respond to this @Macho ? Would love to see you substantiate your claim that Arteta has been calling the players crap at every opportunity.

Or was your whole "fair and reasonable" thing just an act?

Good to see you've finally resurfaced @Macho ! Was starting to worry about you.

You ever going to respond to this? It's ok to say you were wrong you know. We all post things in the heat of the moment now and again; I know you want to be "fair and reasonable" in this thread.

 

[say yes]

Is Chelsea’s squad substantially better than ours? Because we were level with them until Tuchel came in and took them into the top four fight.

It is tbf. They're absolutely stacked with talent. Just Lampard was a bum, and they (smartly) hired Tuchel right before their easy run of fixtures, so a run up the table was always inevitable.

 

[AberGooner]

That's a myth. The league was tough in those days too. Blackburn Rovers had been taken over by the Walker Bothers who paid a record signing fee for Alan Shearer winning the league in 1995, battling it out with Liverpool and United. Liverpool were still a big force and that year Middlesborough splashed out millions on foreign players like Emerson, Ravanelli, Branco and Festa. And Newcastle United with Kevin Keegan in charge had a superb team with David Ginola, Les Ferdinand and of course poaching Shearer from Blackburn for another record fee of £15m. Villa too were big in those days

It was a hard league and Wenger knew nothing about English football but he still got top 4 right from his first season, having been 12th the season before. He was no Arteta, and it was a sign of what was to come.

Also Chelsea had started heavily investing for the time in players from abroad with the likes of Zola, Di Matteo, Vialli and Leboeuf. It was nowhere near a 2 team league.