It doesn't:Why does a new contract have to include a pay increase?
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It doesn't:Why does a new contract have to include a pay increase?
It might do and maybe Jack won't accept a new deal if it doesn't, who knows?Why does a new contract have to include a pay increase?
Who is going to buy an injury prone player who is currently injured again?
Sorry, I thought I was clear. I would try and move him on in the summer along with a few others. If we have to accept there won't be a change at the top, you have to shift players that have become stale at this club for any chance of improving next year.The options are let him go on a free next year, give him a new contract, which will mean a pay increase or get rid of him in the summer. So you're for the third option?
Sorry, I thought I was clear. I would try and move him on in the summer along with a few others. If we have to accept there won't be a change at the top, you have to shift players that have become stale at this club for any chance of improving next year.
A promoted club, or someone looking to take a chance might go for some of our under-achievers. They may just need to move out of their comfort zones and it will do both sides some good.
Fair enough, I agree.Sorry, I thought I was clear. I would try and move him on in the summer along with a few others. If we have to accept there won't be a change at the top, you have to shift players that have become stale at this club for any chance of improving next year.
A promoted club, or someone looking to take a chance might go for some of our under-achievers. They may just need to move out of their comfort zones and it will do both sides some good.
Good to know, but I feel we will be disappointed if Arsène is in place.Fair enough, I agree.
We've definitely invested too much in him and vice-versa to be discarding him at 25 years old.
I think the law of diminishing returns is even more appropriateThat's the Concorde Fallacy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost
It is not Jack himself as an individual, but his situation is a primary illustration of why this club is not working. If he was the only injury prone player that is not showing great form I could deal with that.I feel people are too hung up on him considering all the other issues we have.
The Jack issue is pretty much down the list for me.
It is not Jack himself as an individual, but his situation is a primary illustration of why this club is not working. If he was the only injury prone player that is not showing great form I could deal with that.
The problem is that Arséne keeps many of this kind of player around. We need better value from all those salaries going out.
That's the Concorde Fallacy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost
Mertesacker was a regular contributor and played quite consistently until this season. Debuchy look promising when he joined, but has not had his contract renewed. Sanogo is a mystery in the Park mould.Yep, but for a club who has re-signed an aging Flamini on a free, kept Arteta and Mertesacker around, alongside Rosicky and hell even Sanogo still around, getting rid of Jack would be impossible if Wenger has kept those guys around.
I'd rather see Sanogo, Mertesacker, Jenkinson, Debuchy go before we even entertain the idea of Jack leaving.
Apart from the fact that he came through the academy and didn't cost a transfer fee. Let's say the academy would have still existed with or without Jack, and we've covered the cost of running the academy through success development/transfers from the academy:
I don't know the exact figures but let's say we've paid Jack 60,000 pounds a week since 2011, that would be roughly 18/19 million. Bearing in mind during this time, we've had successful contributions from Jack on the field despite injuries and probably worth around that figure in the recent market. If we sell Jack in the summer after he rehabs, let's say he goes for around the price, we've broke even on him.
He's 25. One or two good seasons and he's either a key contributor for our team in the next five-seven years, an Arsenal man and something that we truly lack, someone with some passion and fight. If he does well and we want him to leave for whatever reason in a couple of years at 27/28 he's be worth 30 million.
As a club, do we need to be trying to recoup wages given to Wilshere? No. Keep him around and see what happens. His upside is way too much and there is no way Wenger is even considering shipping him out. If anything, the choice is his and he is in a much weaker position going into the summer injured.
Mertesacker was a regular contributor and played quite consistently until this season. Debuchy look promising when he joined, but has not had his contract renewed. Sanogo is a mystery in the Park mould.
I don't think their circumstances compare to what I was talking about. It is players that have been here through several contracts and still we are waiting for consistency. Wilshere, Ramsey, Gibbs; you have to ask whether we will ever see something after so long.
You make some good points, but I still think we need more robust players and keeping fit is part of the consistency the club need from the playing staff. They have all earned a fortune, so I don't feel guilty about moving them on.I dont think Wilshere and Ramsey have been inconsistent in term of performance. Wilshere has always offered something positive, I don't think there has ever been a period where his actual performances have been questioned. Ramsey has, but he has suffered from injuries. Quite a difference in the sense but Wilshere's injuries have been mainly impact/tackles, whilst apart from Ramsey's leg break, most of his are hamstring/thigh/calf strains etc.
Same with Gibbs. I don't think it's consistency, it's more limitations i.e defensive ability or/and attacking contributions.
Mertesacker was a regular contributor and consistent but has caused us major issues with his lack of pace, same with Arteta for a while, consistent in what he did, but his lack of legs caused us issues.
I think the likes of Wilshere/Ramsey are vital to keep around. It was only a couple of months ago people were screaming for Ox to be sold. All it takes is 10 or so games of good performances and suddenly they are key players again.
I think the focus should be on getting them consistently on the pitch. And I also think part of the reason they may be perceived as having failed is part of a larger failure from the top of the club to the bottom, from the ownership, to Wenger overplaying Jack in 10/11 . 45 games?, to Wenger's man management/individual instructions i.e is Ramsey being asked to run into the box and try and get goals, if so, we can't attack him that he's going forward too much.