Mikel Arteta: Aston La Vista To The Title?

[Legend14]

I loved Arsène for all those years of top 4, and exciting football. I supported Unai when he came 5th, I'm critical of Arteta for being mid table.

Can you see the pattern?

Can’t fault the logic. But at the end, with Wenger we had the philosophy that” better was the enemy of good enough. “ I think the change was necessary at the time.

 

[say yes]

We could start with:

1. has managed a team before.

And then go from there. Unless we think that's too limiting.

@albakos I'm not sure the new report system works, I reported this post and got the following notification but the original post is still there?

 

[A_G]

Eh? City’s squad cost has more than doubled in the last 5 years from £400m+ to £1000m+. Bournemouth aren’t in the Premier League, take West Brom. 5 years ago their squad cost was £60m, it’s just over £100m now. So City’s have spent £600m extra and West Brom £40m+ extra. How exactly are the lower clubs benefitting more than City? The gap is ever widening bro and players are much more expensive, so it’s irrelevant if a lower team blows money on a £20m player.

When did the mid-table and bottom clubs ever spend this kind of money? West Ham spent £45m on Haller, that's the biggest transfer outside of the "big six" clubs. In fact, they've made 8 signings of £20m + since the summer of 2017, before this their most expensive signing was £15m.

The big clubs will always spend but teams lower down the league have multiple relatively big signings in their squads.

 

[say yes]

When did the mid-table and bottom clubs ever spend this kind of money? West Ham spent £45m on Haller, that's the biggest transfer outside of the "big six" clubs. In fact, they've made 8 signings of £20m + since the summer of 2017, before this their most expensive signing was £15m.

The big clubs will always spend but teams lower down the league have multiple relatively big signings in their squads.

Yes, but have you looked at that five-year comparison of Man City vs. a championship team that was promoted last year?

You're clearly not getting it so here's a helpful summary:
- The league got gradually stronger year on year until about 1998, when it peaked in difficulty
- That peak difficulty lasted about 20 years until 2018
- Since 2018 the league has been in rapid and total decline

 

[A_G]

It amazes me how many fans can't see that Arteta was appointed under different circumstances to most other managers. If the club wanted a quick fix manager they wouldn't have appointed Arteta.

You can scream about us being 10th till you're blue in face. You appoint a rookie manager based on where you think he'll have you in 3-4 years. It's also pretty obvious that Arteta was brought in to sort the dressing room out and wind a few necks in.

The people behind the scenes obviously still have faith in Arteta to get the club to where they want to be longish term, time will tell if their faith is misplaced or not. This season he's going to get a pass from the higher ups, that's just the way it is. If we're in a similar position next season, then yeah, Arteta's most likely gone.

Yeah, the simple fact is that Arteta's remit is different to his predecessors. Wenger in his later years and Emery at one point had a core featuring the likes Özil, Alexis, Cazorla, Ramsey, Koscielny, Monreal and Cech. The recruitment from Raul/Sven to supplement these guys wasn't good enough, all of them aged and/or moved on and the window of opportunity to do something with that group closed so there's an acceptance now that it's time to rebuild. It's not about accepting mediocrity, it's just being realistic about the state of this squad in 2021.

Granted, I don't think there's a massive rebuild job on here. With Leno/Saliba/Gabriel/Tierney/Partey/Saka/ESR/Aubameyang potentially as starters, and Cedric/Mari/Holding/Xhaka/Willock/Nelson/Pepe/Martinelli/Willian in reserve you only need 4 quality signings before the squad stops being an excuse. At that point Mikel has to deliver.

 

[Riou]

We could start with:

1. has managed a team before.

And then go from there. Unless we think that's too limiting.

Nah, we appointed an experienced coach in Emery, he turned out to be a terrible fit in the end.

Think we got lucky with Arsène having managed somehwere else before and also being good, don't normally get both of those in one person really...best from now to just appoint rookies imo.

 

[Blood on the Tracks]

The table position this season is not irrelevant btw, it is used to gauge how good he is with extracting the most from what he has at his disposal at any time. He has underachieved and the only hope is he is learning as he goes along, but when he picks Willian ahead of Pepe against Burnley I am not so sure on that still. This thread has become a dead end somewhat though in that comparisons with Wenger instead of Emery look agenda-driven in the way they ignore Emery and the actual starting point when Arteta came in. I’m not talking about Makingtrax here, his fixation on Wenger is just his thing about protecting Wenger’s legacy.

Our position in the table this season isn't irrelevant to us as fans, for sure.

Put yourself in Josh, Vinai or Edu's shoes though.

You've appointed a manager with no previous experience to guide the club back, long term to the higher echelons of the PL. You believe he has something special about him, otherwise you wouldn't have given him the job.

His first season he has the club on Top 4 pace and unexpectedly wins the FA Cup. Second season is likely going to be a dud ( barring a winning streak in the PL till the end of the season or lifting the Europa League)

If I'm either of those 3 guys I'm not sacking Arteta until the start of 2022 at the earliest. I'm going to give the inexperienced manager every chance to turn it around and make me look good for appointing him.

 

[blaze_of_glory]

Nah, we appointed an experienced coach in Emery, he turned out to be a terrible fit in the end.

Think we got lucky with Arsène having managed somehwere else before, best from now to just appoint rookies imo!

True, don't want someone whose thinking may be constrained by prior knowledge. Maybe go around asking people if they know what football is, and then interview those who say no.

 

[mirrorstare]

Henry has minor experience and he offered to cut the grass too

I would give him at least 10 years

 

[Macho]

I have a hunch we will still be sh*t even after the club gives Arteta 200 mil over the next couple seasons. I could be wrong, but whatever - that's what the club and fans want to do so be it.

I just want some accountability for the manager.

Not everyday blame Xhaka/Willian/Bellerin. Especially when there have been alternatives all season - a season where there was no pressure to win anything and Arteta could have easily developed players for the seasons after or at least generated players sales to aid us in the transfer market.

That is all.

 

[andeoch1]

Just look at what a real manager has done with Chelsea!!!!!

 

[say yes]

I have a hunch we will still be sh*t even after the club gives Arteta 200 mil over the next couple seasons. I could be wrong, but whatever - that's what the club and fans want to do so be it.

I just want some accountability for the manager.

Not everyday blame Xhaka/Willian/Bellerin. Especially when there have been alternatives all season - a season where there was no pressure to win anything and Arteta could have easily developed players for the seasons after or at least generated players sales to aid us in the transfer market.

That is all.

Nobody wants us to be ****. Chill out man

Swear you used to be rational about all this. Arteta will be gone if results haven't significantly improved next season. In fact, he'll probably be gone if we have any more appalling form this season. Just some peeps giving him more leeway than you is all.

 

[Iceman10]

Our position in the table this season isn't irrelevant to us as fans, for sure.

Put yourself in Josh, Vinai or Edu's shoes though.

You've appointed a manager with no previous experience to guide the club back, long term to the higher echelons of the PL. You believe he has something special about him, otherwise you wouldn't have given him the job.

His first season he has the club on Top 4 pace and unexpectedly wins the FA Cup. Second season is likely going to be a dud ( barring a winning streak in the PL till the end of the season or lifting the Europa League)

If I'm either of those 3 guys I'm not sacking Arteta until the start of 2022 at the earliest. I'm going to give the inexperienced manager every chance to turn it around and make me look good for appointing him.

Step back a bit and realise this is just part of a reaction to some Arteta-Out [Mod Edit: any need for that word?] here who just want to stop conversation and observations of Arteta outside their narratives. It is very obvious who these people are, including some who overtly keep protesting that they don’t have an agenda when they so clearly do.

Whatever the “inevitability” of Josh et al. decisions are does not stop my observations, good and bad, of Arteta, as we go along.

Edit: ok mods, “keyboard warriors” would have sufficed.

 

[Lidl_Reed]

If I speak....

 

[Riou]

View attachment 2151



If I speak....

Ffs, Mikel

 

[say yes]

View attachment 2151



If I speak....

Imagine not getting a James Benge joke.

 

[Makingtrax]

When did the mid-table and bottom clubs ever spend this kind of money? West Ham spent £45m on Haller, that's the biggest transfer outside of the "big six" clubs. In fact, they've made 8 signings of £20m + since the summer of 2017, before this their most expensive signing was £15m.

The big clubs will always spend but teams lower down the league have multiple relatively big signings in their squads.

Surely you'd expect that, player prices have rocketed in the last few years.

If virtually every teams squad investment has more than doubled in the last 5 years. You'll have to explain to me how that gives the lower teams an advantage over 5 years ago.

 

[Preacher]

That grim reminder of our finances explains how he survived 2020 tbh. Hiring and sacking our managers cost 10m alone and our income streams have decreased across the board.

If Arteta wasn't completely untouchable like some said, for me he would be easier to deal with. I don't rate him at all but doesn't mean I hate him.

Leaving aside the hiring of novice, who will learn on the job, the biggest mistake this club did, was upgrading Arteta's status from head coach to manager.

 

[GDeep™]

Premier League and European football was much better 5-10 years ago. The standard is rock bottom now, this is the worst season in PL history.

We would have finished too 4 had we spent the money better over the last 3 years, it was record breaking money.

Chelsea, Man Utd etc have been in their worst forms for over a decade too, with poor managers. Even Liverpool were only top quality for two years. Where are all these top teams? West Ham are top 4 now when we thought Moyes would just about keep them up maybe.

Stop making excuses. League isn’t stronger, even the CL is poor. We’re just a badly run club.

 

[GDeep™]

@say yes and his criminal bootcut brigade blaming everything but the club and it’s hiring of criminals like Raul - who the bootcut brigade were begging to suck off on here non stop.