Mikel Arteta: Aston La Vista To The Title?

[MauveGunner]

Inb4butitsworldcupinthemiddleoftheseasonexcuses.

 

[Paperino]

Auba won the FA Cup took his 300k wage and retired never to be seen again. Auba was poor for a long time and it was like playing with 10 players when he played. It's not a coicidence we started playing better football when he was dropped.

Maybe Arteta does drain the life out of strikers, this is an unknown. I've heard the argument that Guardiola also doesn't get the best out of strikers. With his decision to use Aguero sparcely, not gelling with Ibrah, not getting the numbers with Lewa that other managers have. So yes both probably demand their strikers drop deep to help link up play alongside pressing relentlessly. It probably makes it harder to be the last man on the end of move.

As for the Luiz and Mustafi being offered extensions thing, on the face off sounds like poor decision making. But then you have to think they are both ball playing defenders and we had to splash £50m for White when Luiz left.

Auba contributed with 19 goals/assist the season after he won the FA cup for Arsenal. Definitely not great but he wasnt as bad as you and Teta want us to believe.

 

[Makingtrax]

The Nuno v Lampard v Arteta debate at the start of the season was interesting. Guess we lost that discussion, because we’re still losing.

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

Firstly style of play is irrelevant, we're talking about the quality of the squad and it doesn't matter how much of a mess the style of play was as that's the aspect that a manager should be able to come in and readily change.

But no this wasn't a mid-table squad even at the time Arteta took over. I think you're exaggerating how bad the squad was to try and make Arteta appear better.

I'll reduce the argument down because you've talked a lot in your post to say very little.

Even if the entire squad was mediocre (it wasn't but let's say it was). Arteta still inherited an attack which had a duo (Auba and Lacazette) that had 60+ goal contributions just the season before, infact just a few months before. And to me a Saka that was just coming in but was already tangibly producing (12 assists in all competitions in 19/20).

Conte has proven that you can do alot with a fairly average team but two lethal attackers. I think our offense of Auba, Laca and Saka at the time was greatly above average but wasn't utilised properly.

You're working on the false premise that a forward line of Auba and Lacazette could be lethal together 20/21 or there after. They never could have been because they never played well together, nevermind in 20/21 when they dropped off considerably. Auba in 20/21 isn't the Auba in 19/20 who was playing for his last big payday. Arteta got the best out of Auba in 19/20 and he tried to build an attack around his strengths in 20/21 through into this season

 

[Makingtrax]

As for the Luiz and Mustafi being offered extensions thing, on the face off sounds like poor decision making. But then you have to think they are both ball playing defenders and we had to splash £50m for White when Luiz left.

I guess you haven’t watched Marseille because they have a very good ball playing defender whose taller, excellent in the air and called up the French National side. And he would have cost nothing.

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

Auba contributed with 19 goals/assist the season after he won the FA cup for Arsenal. Definitely not great but he wasnt as bad as you and Teta want us to believe.

In the PL 8 no penalty goals and 3 assists in 20/21. While being passenger in build up play.

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

I guess you haven’t watched Marseille because they have a very good ball playing defender whose taller, excellent in the air and called up the French National side. And he would have cost nothing.

The thing is if Arteta did do that and we finished 8th this season because of Saliba's mistakes that led to goals (and he has a good few this season) you'd be the first baying for his blood

 

[Makingtrax]

You're working on the false premise that a forward line of Auba and Lacazette could be lethal together 20/21 or there after. They never could have been because they never played well together, nevermind in 20/21 when they dropped off considerably. Auba in 20/21 isn't the Auba in 19/20 who was playing for his last big payday. Arteta got the best out of Auba in 19/20 and he tried to build an attack around his strengths in 20/21 through into this season

What rubbish. Amazing these poster trashing our players because they couldn’t fit into a heavily micro managed system by a complete novice manager.

If Auba had only been interested in a pay day, he would have sat back and taken the money, instead of being desperate to leave in order to start playing in a well organised attacking system for a third of his wages.

 

[Paperino]

In the PL 8 no penalty goals and 3 assists in 20/21. While being passenger in build up play.

So 11 goals/assists in PL. Nothing to brag about but far from as bad as you want it to be. You have to remember that he had an incompetent and deranged manager that season.

 

[mpower2540]

Wenger helped, but all were super talented, something I don't really feel with the current group of youngsters we have.

I really agree with this, I think we all overrate our young talent a lot. Cesc, RVP, Adebayor, Rosicky, all premium level talents even Hleb you could see was a special dribbler with the ball. We also found these guys for peanuts too (bar Rosicky)

Ben White (who I like) stats were posted recently on here and it did strike me for how much we spent on him he’s actually just been OK but not really transformative.

Funnily the one possible generational talent has been our player for nearly 3 years and hasn’t even kicked a ball for us yet

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

Agree with some of what you say here but have a few issues. Xhaka/Elneny is basically still our midfield, and Arteta decided to spend approx 20m replacing Guendouzi (a French international now), with an inferior player in Lokonga, who now can't get a game when Partey is (inevitably) injured.

The reason we are also reliant on Saka/ESR/Martinelli is because Arteta decided to spend the vast majority of the 200m net he has spent on defensive players.

Yea I will conceede Lakonga is looking like a bust right now. It is his first season though so maybe a good pre-season could get him to speed.

I didn't agree with Guenduzzi set out on line but maybe it's for the best for the team overall. The manager needs players to buy into the training and standards set at the club. If one or two players don't get with the program no one will. You have to standards. Guardiola did the same with much much better players.

 

[Makingtrax]

The thing is if Arteta did do that and we finished 8th this season because of Saliba's mistakes that led to goals (and he has a good few this season) you'd be the first baying for his blood

I’m not baying for his blood, it’s not his fault that Arsenal appointed a novice who can’t man-manage and is struggling to coach either a defence or an attack. He’s doing his very best of that I’ve no doubt.

 

[ArsenesCoatMaker]

Lol. Arteta’s spent £220m, but give him 6 more quality additions and then we’ll see what his process is.

220m is not allot in modern football over 2 seasons when the wages are relatively low. Man City are spending about £250m on Halaand alone once you factor in agent fees and wages.

With 220m he's been able to re-build the back 4 and add a starting midfielder and a CAM. How would you rate Partey, White, Ramsdale, Gabriel, Tommi, Ødegaard as signings? I'd consider them 7-8 out of 10 signings. If he can do the same with the attack I'd consider us well set.

 

[Makingtrax]

So let’s compare the 2 seasons, alright there’s 1 game to go. Let’s look at facts for once.

2021 Loses 13, Draws 7, Wins 18
2022 Loses 13, Draws 3, Wins 21

2021 For 55, Against 39
2022 For 56, Against 47

Defence - Definitely no improvement, same losses, more goals against. Ramsdale, White, Tavares and Tomi have made no improvement at all. We’re bottom of the top 6 mini league this year, we weren’t last year.

Attack - We’ve scored more goals by a tiny percentage and won 3/4 games that last year were draws. Is this a measurable improvement or could this be luck. 1-0 instead of 1-1 etc

These seasons are sooooo similar. Attack slightly better, defence slightly worse.

 

[Oxeki]

As for the Luiz and Mustafi being offered extensions thing, on the face off sounds like poor decision making. But then you have to think they are both ball playing defenders and we had to splash £50m for White when Luiz left.

Jesus wept!

How many rubbish will you guys shamelessly spew just to justify Arteta's ineptitude?

 

[Makingtrax]

220m is not allot in modern football over 2 seasons when the wages are relatively low. Man City are spending about £250m on Halaand alone once you factor in agent fees and wages.

With 220m he's been able to re-build the back 4 and add a starting midfielder and a CAM. How would you rate Partey, White, Ramsdale, Gabriel, Tommi, Ødegaard as signings? I'd consider them 7-8 out of 10 signings. If he can do the same with the attack I'd consider us well set.

It’s a lot. The last two years we’ve out invested every major team in the top 5 European leagues. And the whole Brighton squad of 25 players cost only £126m and they beat us at home!

 

[grange]

It’s a lot. The last two years we’ve out invested every major team in the top 5 European leagues. And the whole Brighton squad of 25 players cost only £126m and they beat us at home!

Do you lot use coupons across the pond? Because going along with you to buy groceries must be excruciatingly painful.

 

[dka1]

You're working on the false premise that a forward line of Auba and Lacazette could be lethal together 20/21 or there after. They never could have been because they never played well together, nevermind in 20/21 when they dropped off considerably.

The false premise? But I just quoted you numbers showing how effective they were in 2018/19. Sure I'll concede that they are awkward to fit together, especially in a conventional front 3. But they still racked up impressive numbers.

I think they could've worked in a front 2 (so Laca playing SS and Auba the out and out ST) but Arteta never tried that.

Auba in 20/21 isn't the Auba in 19/20 who was playing for his last big payday. Arteta got the best out of Auba in 19/20 and he tried to build an attack around his strengths in 20/21 through into this season

Hmm so Arteta got the best out of Auba in 19/20 (which is just blatant lies, or do you suffer from SEVERE amnesia and not remember his scoring rate of 17/18 and 18/19 and even 21/22 Barcelona?) yet when Auba's form suffered in 20/21 it wasn't Arteta's fault in the slightest despite our whole attack being a problem area for Arteta?

That doesn't work out.

Like I said you have to make a lot of speculative rationalisations to claim that our squad was only mid table quality when Arteta took over, it's just not a statement I can ever agree with.

Let alone in 20/21 after Arteta spent quite a bit of money.

 

[Paperino]

A walk down memory lane:

From november last year:

Arteta about fans talking about getting a top 4 place:

'For me, this is positive. It means there is excitement and they want to push us,'

'This club is about being the best, not about being fourth.

'So that mentality and drive is because of our history. That history has to be present all the time, trying to achieve the biggest targets.

'If not, you don't have the mentality to play for this club. Whether we can achieve it or not, we will see. But the level of expectation has to be the highest.'

From may 15:

(A)sked if fifth would be something to celebrate, Arteta was unequivocal.

“No. We want to be playing in the Champions League, and that’s the end. We’ve come so far.

“It’s in our hands and we want to now capitalise on that and the excitement and the opportunity’s there, and we will really want to go for it.”

 

[Artisan]

The thing is if Arteta did do that and we finished 8th this season because of Saliba's mistakes that led to goals (and he has a good few this season) you'd be the first baying for his blood

If he invested the 50mil he wasted on Ben White and invested it in higher priority areas, Saliba's mistake wouldn't have mattered. You make it sound like Ben White is a rock, when in reality he's just an above average CB who ironically killed our CL chance with his mistake/bad luck.