A very poor Premier League.

[serbiangunner]

Hear hear Ash...

 

[serbiangunner]

If we had the mafia and the money Juve has,then we would have been the force.

 

[Alexone234]

The reason that Brit teams never progress far in the CL is because we don't keep the ball for long periods. Every successful team in the CL can retain the ball to relieve or apply pressure. Our game in Europe involves trying to be intricate with the ball, giving it away and being caught on the break.

 

[Anonymous]

Oh, and as for the teams in Europe being better tactically - I think you will find that despite Arsenal's poor approach to tactics, Italian teams have a poor record against us at Highbury.

Maybe their tactica aren't good enough ...

Oh, and we also have an excellent record against German teams.

I don't know, could just be that our objective is to score more goals than the opposition!

Just a wild guess.

So? We can beat them in one off games.

Just remind me of our overall record. Just a wild guess, but i think it is crap.

Um, I think I was talking about Italian teams in the post you replied to.

And if you want our record against German teams (again I meantioned this in the post you replied to) ...

v Borussia Dortmund
P W D L F A
2 1 0 1 3 2

v Bayer Leverkusen
P W D L F A
2 1 1 0 5 2

v Bayern Munich
P W D L F A
2 0 1 1 2 3

Again, hardly crap. I think the only think that's crap and "overall" here is that your "overall argument has been proven to be crap."

And if you want to take into account the conditions and situations - those records are for both Home and Away.

Against Juventus, when we won 3-1, we had an 18-yr old Stuart Taylor in goal.

Against Bayern Munich at Highbury we were leading 2-0 before the Germans equalised from set pieces.

Against Borussia Dortmund / Leverkusen, we only drew away because of a late dive by Basturk and the free kick resulting free kick resulted in their equaliser.

Being an Arsenal fan, I thought you would have known all this already.

You, sir, are posting a load of tosh.

What are you talking about?
Why are you giving me German results now, i never mentioned that!?
Youre still struggling to understand the word overall arent you....

Our 'overall' recored involves getting the the QF ONCE in our last six/seven attempts. I would say that is crap.

Now for you to give me the overall record, which seems beyond your understanding you need to give me our records against Italian, Spanish, German, Dutch, Russian etc combined, which will give you our OVERALL record - is that clearer or are you still struggling?

My argument, being that the PL is far inferior to Spain and Italy has far from proved to be crap, especially by you.

I will leave you now to try and get your head around the word overall.

 

[Anonymous]

Now for you to give me the overall record, which seems beyond your understanding you need to give me our records against Italian, Spanish, German, Dutch, Russian etc combined, which will give you our OVERALL record - is that clearer or are you still struggling?

Yadda, yadd, yadda.

Do the Maths. I've already provided you with the statistics.

Against the top leagues on the continent, we've got a good record against Italian and German teams and not so good ones against Spanish opposition.

And to highlight your ever growing ignorance and hypocrisy, you posted: "So? We can beat them in one off games. "

Exactly Sol, what is your point? We don't play in their leagues, so we're playing them in one-off games. You're comparing Arsenal in those one-off games. Now when I provide you with a statistic that prove you that we're not "crap" in those one off games, you say "So what?"

SO WHAT if THEY can beat us in one-off games?

Oh, and here is your overall statistic against the top leagues in the world (according to you) -

P W D L
27 9 9 9

We're not "crap".

Ho la.

 

[Anonymous]

Now for you to give me the overall record, which seems beyond your understanding you need to give me our records against Italian, Spanish, German, Dutch, Russian etc combined, which will give you our OVERALL record - is that clearer or are you still struggling?

P W D L
27 9 9 9

HEY HEY!! We get there eventually!
Now that record is down to opinion, but its not exactly something to be proud of is it.

Now let me give you some facts about English, Spanish and Italian clubs in Europe, and ill throw some German teams in there for the heck of it:

97/98 QF contained 2 Spanish/Italian clubs, 3 German clubs and 1 English club.

98/99 QF contained 2 Spanish/Italina clubs, 2 German clubs and 1 english clun.

99/00 QF contained 4 Spanish/Italian clubs, 1 German club and 2 English clubs

00/01 contained 3 Spanish/italian clubs, 1 German club and 3 English clubs.

01/02 contained 3 Spanish/Italian clubs, 2 German clubs and 2 English clubs.

02/03 contained 6 Spanish/italian clubs, 0 German clubs and 1 English club.

That is Overall (I think you know what that means now)
Spanish/Italian - 21
German - 15
English - 10

Not great that is it? And of those ten half have been Man U, so where would English clubs be with out them?

Another interesting fact is that of the last 11 finals since 1993, have contained 14 Spanish/Italian clubs, compared to one English.

Of those eleven finals every one has contained either a Spanish or Italian club, except one, which was the only time a English club reached a final in that time.


Now what do these facts say about English football compared to spain and Italy?
Why is there record so much better? I would think it is fair and a rational thing to say that it is because they play to a higher standard.

Where have clubs like ourselves, Liverpool, Chelsea and Newcastle, the top English clubs been, whilst the top teams form S/I have dominated? Without the mancs our record is embarrassing. Why? The quality of the league?


Anyway this post is going nowhere fast.
It all comes down to opinion really, yours is different form mine, fair enough.
Lets just agree to disagree.

 

[Anonymous]

Sol, to paraphrase you: So what if they can beat us in one-off games?

Nothing. That does not mean that they're league is better, or ours is worse.

How many Champions League spots do the Italian and Spanish leagues have, compared to us?

UEFA allocate those spots on the basis of the performances of those nations' clubs in Europe. We have the same as the Spanish, 4. That again, does not prove that our league is better than theirs.

Before last season, the Italian clubs were not performing in Europe for two to three years.

No Sol, it doesn't prove that they play to a higher standard. It just proves that they're better in one-off games, but certainly not as good as you describe them.

Crap is not something you associate with P27, W9, D9 and L9. Crap is something you associate with P27, W0 D0 L27.

That's crap.

 

[Anonymous]

Sol, to paraphrase you: So what if they can beat us in one-off games?

Nothing. That does not mean that they're league is better, or ours is worse.

How many Champions League spots do the Italian and Spanish leagues have, compared to us?

UEFA allocate those spots on the basis of the performances of those nations' clubs in Europe. We have the same as the Spanish, 4. That again, does not prove that our league is better than theirs.

Before last season, the Italian clubs were not performing in Europe for two to three years.

No Sol, it doesn't prove that they play to a higher standard. It just proves that they're better in one-off games, but certainly not as good as you describe them.

Crap is not something you associate with P27, W9, D9 and L9. Crap is something you associate with P27, W0 D0 L27.

That's crap.

Your argument is going nowhere, i thought you were clever than this.

Those facts prove that Spanish and Italian clubs are vastly superior to English clubs in Europe. And they dont prove they are better in one off games. They prove they know how to get results in difficult games, proves they know how to get through the group stages, proves they know when to attack and to defend, proves they can play for draws when they need them. They prove a lot of things, things English clubs have been unable to achieve. The facts speak for themselves.

The Champions League argument is a non starter. The English League is the third best, so gets 4 places. It would be silly giving Spain and Italy 5 places, and likewise silly giving the dutch league 4 places. It is the way it works, and is fair, The top 3 leagues get the most places. end of.


And our Champions League record. Is the glass half full or half empty? To you it is half full, to me it must be half empty.
Ok, it may not be 'crap' but it is average, ordinary, mediocre.
Are you happy to settle for that?
And as for one qualification in how ever many years it is now, well that is 'crap' with the players we have.

 

[Anonymous]

Ok, it may not be 'crap' but it is average, ordinary, mediocre. Are you happy to settle for that?

And that is the end of today's English lesson.

See you tomorrow.

And they dont prove they are better in one off games. They prove they know how to get results in difficult games, proves they know how to get through the group stages, proves they know when to attack and to defend, proves they can play for draws when they need them.

Er ... yes. That indeed proves they're better in one-off games. What else do you need in a one-off game?

Jeeeeeeezus.

Right, you're just recycling your words over and over again and changing your meanings. I am not going to waste any more time repeating myself, and then see you rehash a post.

 

[Anonymous]

Ok, it may not be 'crap' but it is average, ordinary, mediocre. Are you happy to settle for that?

And that is the end of today's English lesson.

See you tomorrow.

And they dont prove they are better in one off games. They prove they know how to get results in difficult games, proves they know how to get through the group stages, proves they know when to attack and to defend, proves they can play for draws when they need them.

Er ... yes. That indeed proves they're better in one-off games. What else do you need in a one-off game?

Jeeeeeeezus.

Right, you're just recycling your words over and over again and changing your meanings. I am not going to waste any more time repeating myself, and then see you rehash a post.

In fact you arent very clever are you?
The fact remains that we are and have been crap in the CL for far too long. But that was not way point to start with anyway.

Cant you see Arsenal have failed to get out of the group stages of the Champions league? To do this you have to gain a certain number of points over SIX games (after five and before seven) to go through. NOT ONE OFF GAMES. As i said you have to know how to gain these points over a periiod, but you obviously cant see this.

Jeeeeeeezus.

You seem to have to answer to the facts a posted before, althoguh i cant blame you because they totally prove me right i suppose.

Btw, try to stop sounding so patronising all the time. It would be ok if you were right, but seen as you are failing to prove me wrong you just sound like a total prat.

 

[Anonymous]

Zzzzz.

 

[serbiangunner]

Sol,can you please define me what are the one off games and what are not the one off games? :?: