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Granit Xhaka: Managers Love Him!

Discussion in 'Arsenal Talk' started by Marjorie, Aug 18, 2020.

  1. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    Stats comparing the league’s best in his position in that season (and Rodri for Atletico):

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Which part is a lie?

    #GetXhakaBackInTheMiddle
     
  2. RunTheTrap

    RunTheTrap Well-Known Member

    You don’t. Well, at least you shouldn't have to. When it comes to great players, no one argues about their greatness. No Arsenal fan questions Henry's status, even Sp**s fans will tell you he's great. There's over 90 pages worth of back and forth between 34 fanboys and haters. Chances are, if there's that much discrepancies between two camps, the answers normally lies somewhere in the middle.
    I think @blaze_of_glory said it best. I'm paraphrasing but he said along the lines that Xhaka is like Giroud and so many fans unfairly criticise him but I'll go on to add that some fans will immediately come to a player's rescue because they're seen as treated unfairly, to the point that initial conversation gets lost. Xhaka isn't world class, you wouldn't be arguing with us and deep down you know it.
     
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  3. RunTheTrap

    RunTheTrap Well-Known Member

    34 has always looked good statistically. That's why StatDna recommended him but there isn't many statistical findings for some intangibles that Xhaka struggles with. For example, tracking a run. How do you statistically show a player that is good or bad at tracking runs?
     
  4. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    The eye test. But it needs the right eye not the eye of an agenda merchant.
     
  5. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    I have to disagree with your first point. There are many instances of great players who did the tiny details but never got the appreciation they deserve. Gilberto is one example. Fans (espescially in the premier league) only judge based on goals, assists and strong tackles. There is so much more to football than that.

    Xhaka is such a player. He resorts to tackles less and less but instead relies on smart positioning, closing down and staying on the feet. It’s even more effective but it gets glanced over by fans.
     
  6. RunTheTrap

    RunTheTrap Well-Known Member

    Not every single fan who dislikes 34 has an agenda. That's a silly assumption to make.
     
  7. RacingPhoton

    RacingPhoton Well-Known Member

    Some good finger picking there.
    https://www.premierleague.com/players/12136/Granit-Xhaka/stats
    https://www.premierleague.com/players/5682/Jorginho/stats

    We already know that chances created, passing accuracy are very misleading stats.
    If you move from chances created to big chances created, Xhaka has 12 from 136 matches while Jorginho has 12 from just 76 matches.
    Even a pass back to the GK adds up to passing accuracy. Jorginho has already played 52 through balls in just 76 matches while Xhaka has just 35 through balls in 136 matches.
    Xhaka has more accurate long balls though. But as we have discussed multiple times before, none of them have ever created goal scoring chances for us. The fact that Jorginho has created more big chances with much less long balls shows you that through balls in the middle are much more effective than the long balls Xhaka plays.
    Jorginho already has 134 interceptions while Xhaka has just 135 interceptions.

    This is just comparing him with Jorginho and I don't even rate Jorginho.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2020
    Ash10, Big Poppa, Godwin1 and 2 others like this.
  8. Red London

    Red London Well-Known Member

    I dont think he's as good as you say at dictating the tempo. He doesnt take a game by the scruff of the neck. When we talk about high IQ game management our manager was great at it when he played for us. A lot of people remember the ageing Arteta that retired in the PL but in his prime he was one of our most important players. Santi also did it fantastically in a different way when he was playing CM for us.

    I like registas to be a bit more mobile, good with both feet, and good dribblers. Xhaka is like a truck when he turns/dribbles with his back to the opposition, and he is nowhere near as press resistant as top DLPs or registas. Elneny is more press resistant.
     
    tcahill likes this.
  9. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    The 2 best reigstas I can remember; Pirlo and Alonso, were just as slow if not slower and lacked dribbling skills, espescially so in Pirlo’s case.
     
  10. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    I can’t agree. There is a huge tactical importance to long balls and the ability to switch the play, more so than playing through balls down the middle. Xhaka particularly excels at stats related to “positive passages of play”, look it up.
     
  11. Red London

    Red London Well-Known Member

    They were comfortable when being pressed. They were better passers too.
     
  12. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    Hard to compare, because pressing wasn’t as emphasised as it is now. They did pass backwards and sideways. Xhaka doesn’t struggle with being pressed anymore. I remember Pirlo often being given a lot of space. Xhaka doesn’t have that luxury, but when he does he’s effective.
     
  13. Red London

    Red London Well-Known Member

    So maybe he would be more effective in a different league.
     
  14. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    He would. Xhaka in Italy would blow the competition out of the water. But he remains a huge asset to us. He used to struggle against the press. I think it’s the one particular area he has improved in. He’s quicker at releasing passes. Arteta needs to give him more creative freedom; by liming his role so much he’s not making use of Xhaka’s potential.
     
  15. RunTheTrap

    RunTheTrap Well-Known Member

    I disagree, Premier League fans have called Thiago the signing of the summer and he's a midfielder that gets no goals, assists or a strong tackler. A lot of fans have spoken of how much a player like Partey is what Arsenal have missed for a long time. I doubt he'll be scoring or assisting any time soon. I could go on Modric, Scholes, Carrick, Xabi Alonso, Fernandinho etc. They're all rated highly. You're problem is that you have a prejudiced view on what the typical Premier League fan has that what you're saying actually outdated. Just because Xhaka plays similar to those names does not mean he's any where near that level of midfielder.
     
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  16. Wryer

    Wryer Well-Known Member

    Neither do they get themselves any where near a sticky situation. Xhaka still has loads to learn in that respect. Some improvements this season to be fair.

    And when they spot a killer pass, they go for it. Xhaka doesn't do that anywhere near regularly enough despite his passing qualities.

    Comparing Xhaka to Pirlo/Alonso is just miles off in my opinion.
     
    Makingtrax and RunTheTrap like this.
  17. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    Scholes didn’t used to receive much praise until foreign players and managers did it. I don’t recall many singing Carrick’s praises. What you’re saying happens in foreign leagues. Premier league fans have a different mindset. They see goals, assists, dribbles and strong tackles. They pay no attention to the tiny details and intricacies of the game.
     
  18. RunTheTrap

    RunTheTrap Well-Known Member

    @Manberg on the internet we call that a 'L'. You took a massive L, right there. This is why @RacingPhoton will always be my boy. Nobody comes harder with the facts than this guy.
     
    Godwin1 and RacingPhoton like this.
  19. Manberg

    Manberg Predator

    Too many agenda merchants here. I’m done wasting my time. You all know nothing.
     
  20. DanDare

    DanDare Emoji Merchant and Believer-In-Chief

    [​IMG]
     
    Riou likes this.

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