PL: Arsenal vs Everton | 28/10/06

[bazza_afc]

For those who were there, waht did you think of the atmosphere? Thought it was pretty bad but a lot better in the 2nd half.

 

[GuNNerZ4LiFe]

If we win our game in hand we will be 4 points behind the leaders. Thats not too bad considering our poor start really. It could have been worse you know if our players didnt react faster.

Aliadire looks very pacey and ready for action. I reckon maybe he should get an EPL start alongside Henry soon???

 

[goonerJA]

but van perise has been in good form also, so i don't think that Ali will get a start

 

[marco]

for the game yesterday read boro and villa games
concede stupid goals at home is costing us, yesterday it was toure, boro it was gallas.

stupid mistakes and then you are chasing the game, and we cant break these teams down

 

[Alfonso]

Henry had 55'000 critics at the game yesterday apparently:

News of the World (Antony Kastrinakis) report:
Quote:
Time and time again Henry has delivered. But when after 66 minutes yesterday the Emirates crowd voiced their dismay at their captain's failure to drive the team, Wenger must have worried. Henry had just given away possession for the umpteenth time, spoiling a wonderful run by Rosicky. And that was enough to make his adoring fans boo him. Yes, you read that right. Gunners fans yesterday booed Thierry Henry. Wenger refused to elaborate afterwards. He simply said: "I wouldn't like to go on to individual performance. When you don't score, the strikers get critics." Yesterday, Henry got about 55,000 critics.

 

[number_0]

I think the major reason in our poor proformance was injuries...
how many players do we have who are injured or not fit? seven?

We are a few players short of playing or reserve team in preimeship games.
maybe thats the reason henry looked scared in air chalanges..

come to think of it lehman also looked scared of claiming the ball when cahill charged at in for the goal

 

[Gurgen]

i'd argue senderos has the worst concentration of the lot as we'v seen time and time again at international and domestic level.

Yeah his concentration is terrible, that's why we never concede from set pieces with him in the team.

But no point in talking to biased people. You don't rate Phil and nothing I say will change that.

 

[patrick42uk]

i'd argue senderos has the worst concentration of the lot as we'v seen time and time again at international and domestic level.

Yeah his concentration is terrible, that's why we never concede from set pieces with him in the team.

But no point in talking to biased people. You don't rate Phil and nothing I say will change that.

true. although when i talk about lack of concentration i mean his 'one mistake per game' ratio rather than what he does on set-pieces.

 

[patrick42uk]

Henry had 55'000 critics at the game yesterday apparently:

News of the World (Antony Kastrinakis) report:
Quote:
Time and time again Henry has delivered. But when after 66 minutes yesterday the Emirates crowd voiced their dismay at their captain's failure to drive the team, Wenger must have worried. Henry had just given away possession for the umpteenth time, spoiling a wonderful run by Rosicky. And that was enough to make his adoring fans boo him. Yes, you read that right. Gunners fans yesterday booed Thierry Henry. Wenger refused to elaborate afterwards. He simply said: "I wouldn't like to go on to individual performance. When you don't score, the strikers get critics." Yesterday, Henry got about 55,000 critics.

LOL> bit over the top i think. it was a groan when he gave away the all. perfectly natural reaction because we needed a goal and a move broke. it would have hppened to anybody.

'gave way the ball for the umpeenth time'? silly attempt to sensationalise.

 

[Jkreffer]

Henry had 55'000 critics at the game yesterday apparently:

News of the World (Antony Kastrinakis) report:
Quote:
Time and time again Henry has delivered. But when after 66 minutes yesterday the Emirates crowd voiced their dismay at their captain's failure to drive the team, Wenger must have worried. Henry had just given away possession for the umpteenth time, spoiling a wonderful run by Rosicky. And that was enough to make his adoring fans boo him. Yes, you read that right. Gunners fans yesterday booed Thierry Henry. Wenger refused to elaborate afterwards. He simply said: "I wouldn't like to go on to individual performance. When you don't score, the strikers get critics." Yesterday, Henry got about 55,000 critics.

That is just plain wrong. No one booed Thierry Henry. There was the typical "move breaking down groan" but that was it. I am not quite sure how the media have come up with this, but then again it is the NOTW.

 

[Tony Montana]

i'd argue senderos has the worst concentration of the lot as we'v seen time and time again at international and domestic level.

Yeah his concentration is terrible, that's why we never concede from set pieces with him in the team.

But no point in talking to biased people. You don't rate Phil and nothing I say will change that.

Aren't you biased to Senderos though?

We might not have conceded from set pieces with Senderos in the team but it doesn't mean it will never happen. What happens if it does in the future? Do we then label Senderos as having the concentration levels of a banana and buy a new defender? Senderos concedes goals in other ways as has been mentioned by me before. There is no guarantee that Everton would not have scored in those ways had Senderos been playing. Again, Senderos will not be a panacea for our attacking problems.

 

[Gurgen]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin **** Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

 

[Don Pacifico]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

Agree with that. We allow far too many chances to occur even against really poor sides. If we want to be a title contender we need to be more convincing at the back. If we truly consider ourselves to be strong at the back, we should not be allowing multiple shots on goal from inside the area on a weekly basis
Many of these chances come from set pieces, especially corners were often the opposition win chances when we are unable to head the ball away due to lack of height. For all their strengths, Kolo and Gallas are not tall and added with Cesc in central midfield, we have next to no defenders in our first team with height. The only way we are going to combat this weakness is by changing Gilbertos role or putting height into the teams. This is especially important against the more physical teams who play long balls.

What are the options though?

Sendy or Johann to replace one of our CBs? Unlikely.

Diaby in the centre on special occasions? Perhaps.

More emphasis on Gilberto's defensive duties on set pieces? Would help.

The aquistion of Gallas would suggest that height will have to come from somewhere else. But whether Wenger actually agrees there is a problem, is a different matter.

 

[Alfonso]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

exactly. Thats why Sol Campbell and Senderoes was such a rubbish partnership. They were both the same type of defender.

In recent years I think Gallas and Terry has been the best example of the kind of effective centre back partnership Gurgen is going on about.

But what about Cannavaro and Nesta? They had a good centre back partnership, and werent they similar type of defenders?

 

[dublingunner]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

And I'm really getting tired of your over-simplistic ideas being presented like it's "obvious." You talk like you're living in a computer game - "ok one's good in the air, one's good at tackling, therefore perfect defence". It's this type of banana-fuelled thinking that I suspect makes people question your idea, not because of any bias against Senderos.

And as I suggested before but you probably didn't read because I don't meet your status requirements, defending set-pieces isn't about just one or two players, it's about the whole team. Do you think Senderos is the only one to ever head out a corner or free kick?

 

[Don Pacifico]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

exactly. Thats why Sol Campbell and Senderoes was such a rubbish partnership. They were both the same type of defender.

In recent years I think Gallas and Terry has been the best example of the kind of effective centre back partnership Gurgen is going on about.

But what about Cannavaro and Nesta? They had a good centre back partnership, and werent they similar type of defenders?

Well there is certainly a big difference in height.

Nesta is 187 cm (6 foot 2 inches)
Cannavaro is 176 cm (5 foot 9.5 inches)

So one would assume they have slightly different roles and therefore compliment each other.

 

[Tony Montana]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

So when we had a Toure-Senderos partnership last season and we still conceded goals what was the problem then? We didn't concede many but we conceded nonetheless and many were stupid goals. And i can't see why no one brought this up before the goal was conceded.

 

[Don Pacifico]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

And I'm really getting tired of your over-simplistic ideas being presented like it's "obvious." You talk like you're living in a computer game - "ok one's good in the air, one's good at tackling, therefore perfect defence". It's this type of banana-fuelled thinking that I suspect makes people question your idea, not because of any bias against Senderos.

And as I suggested before but you probably didn't read because I don't meet your status requirements, defending set-pieces isn't about just one or two players, it's about the whole team. Do you think Senderos is the only one to ever head out a corner or free kick?

We should ideally have 3 'taller' players for defensive purposes in our first team. Excluding Lehmann I would say that we currently have 2 (Gilberto and Henry) and we lose a large proportion of headers unsurprinsingly at set pieces. Therefore the natural area to change players (considering we are discussing defensive duties) would be in the back line. This is especially true considering Cesc is pretty much a staple in the team.

 

[dublingunner]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

So when we had a Toure-Senderos partnership last season and we still conceded goals what was the problem then? We didn't concede many but we conceded nonetheless and many were stupid goals. And i can't see why no one brought this up before the goal was conceded.

Exactly. Yes Toure missed the header but that does not automatically mean it's certain that if Senderos was there it wouldn't have happened.

 

[Don Pacifico]

I'm really getting tired of explaining the obvious but I'll try again.

No friggin s**t Senderos could concede goals in other ways. The point is that he and Toure complement each other. You need different players to do different things. One of those things includes someone who is good in the air and can organize the team on set pieces. When you don't have you will concede goals from set pieces, more than usual.

That's why I believe it would be beneficial to have Phil back in the team, because his weakesses are compensated by Toure's strengths and vice versa.

So when we had a Toure-Senderos partnership last season and we still conceded goals what was the problem then? We didn't concede many but we conceded nonetheless and many were stupid goals. And i can't see why no one brought this up before the goal was conceded.

In fairness I have noticed this problem in all the matches we have played this season. We allow to many chances on set pieces. One example was Marlon King's sitter that he missed against us in the first half.