Alexandre Lacazette: 2019/20 Performances

[MikelHadADream]

I think we have discussed this enough time in this thread. He has scored against big teams to consider his performance last season very good. And he never went missing in those matches where he didn't score. He did help a lot with our defense because our defense and midfield were pathetic in away matches and stats do support his defensive contributions.

Fans voted him player of the season and now the same fans are asking him to be sold. I don't see him being given any slack.

I'm new to this forum so apologies if I am bringing up a topic that has already been discussed.

I massively disagree with this statement, and the fact that anyone can defend his away performances during his time at the club is clear evidence of the slack he is given. Just imagine if Giroud had a record like that...

He cost the club between 50-55m quid and has scored something like 7 away goals in 3 seasons, that should be the end of the story for me.

 

[Hleb's Sirush]

Fans voted him player of the season and now the same fans are asking him to be sold. I don't see him being given any slack.

I think ultimately this is a good test to see if people never liked him full stop or were evaluating his performances objectively. That is to say when he was decent to good and winning player of the year awards, at times clearly standing out amidst the other dross on the field, yet he he would get same rating as now, when his form has clearly fallen off the cliff.

I think your opinion that you believe he was good (relative to where we are as a team) for us before this season and that subsequently his performances this season has been gash, is far more closer to the truth than the view that he was gash all his time here. In a way he is in similar situation with Bellerin. Good at one point (without ever being world class) but right now doesn't deserve to be anywhere near the team.

 

[MikelHadADream]

I think ultimately this is a good test to see if people never liked him full stop or were evaluating his performances objectively. That is to say when he was decent to good and winning player of the year awards, at times clearly standing out amidst the other dross on the field, yet he he would get same rating as now, when his form has clearly fallen off the cliff.

I think your opinion that you believe he was good (relative to where we are as a team) for us before this season and that subsequently his performances this season has been gash, is far more closer to the truth than the view that he was gash all his time here. In a way he is in similar situation with Bellerin. Good at one point (without ever being world class) but right now doesn't deserve to be anywhere near the team.

Looking at it objectively, he was poor in his first season, decent (at home) in his second, and atrocious in his third season. I think the people that actually have judged him fairly over his time at the club are the ones that haven't made excuses for him and rightfully realise he isn't good enough.

For the record, I've never been a fan, I was against his signing for at the time. A 5'9 centre forward with no pace or exceptional skill would never have cut it at a top Premier league club. To pay 50ish million for him at the time was just another example of how inept Gazdis/Wenger had become.

 

[Football Manager]

Sell both Auba and Laca

Buy Gouiri

Play Martinelle and John Jules instead of Nketiah

Need all players to be highly technical especially the attacking players and play beautiful entertaining football.

You do realise that we are not playing U21 football next season

Selling Auba and bringing in a kid with 1 league appearance as a replacement, we'd be worse than we are this season ffs.

You know Gouiri is amazing with his crazy dribbling ability (that auba and laca could only dream of having), combination play, and passing. He can get past 2-3 defenders with ease, very talented player.

Ability has nothing to do with age, if you are good enough, you are good enough. If it was mbappe who’s joining, you wouldn’t care, right?

When can we have some flair and talent back in our striker position (Bergkamp/van Persie)? I just want to watch entertaining football. I am fed up with years of Giroud, Walcott, auba, laca, and now nketiah that plays straight forward boring football.

If we could play like 02 Brazil, 07 Arsenal, 10 Spain, 10 Barcelona, or recent Man City would be a dream coming true. Luckily we have Arteta who seems to have everything guardiola believes and slowly changing the team for the better.

It seems you prefer to have more experienced player. In this case Zaha would be a good addition.

We do have a lot of young talented wingers/inside forwards so we don't need Douglas Costa (thauvin would be good too, and I also like coman/mahrez/chukwueze/gnabry) plus he is getting old so we couldn't generate resell value.

 

[RacingPhoton]

I'm new to this forum so apologies if I am bringing up a topic that has already been discussed.

I massively disagree with this statement, and the fact that anyone can defend his away performances during his time at the club is clear evidence of the slack he is given. Just imagine if Giroud had a record like that...

He cost the club between 50-55m quid and has scored something like 7 away goals in 3 seasons, that should be the end of the story for me.

It is a valid argument to say that he was not worth the money he was bought for.
Giroud played in front of prime Özil and Cazorla. People were frustrated with Giroud because we watched the matches and saw Giroud missing so many chances given in platter to him. But in case of Lacazette, that was not the case. We were not even creating that many chances last season in the away matches. And if you look at the heatmap and stats, you could see he was spending most of the time in our own half and helping with the defense.
I don't even see a reason why he needed to be given slack. If fans were giving him slack, there would be fans supporting him now too. Most fans have been asking him to be sold for a vast majority of this season. So they majority of fans were looking at his performances objectively.

 

[Riou]

Laca was quality last year, anyone saying differently has an agenda (if people use this as a valid excuse with Xhaka, then it certainly is valid here) he has been basically crap this year to avoid me being called an agenda merchant.

As for the away goals thing...

The percentage of his goals scored away from home was 32% last season, Thierry's was 38% in 03/04...need I say more.

 

[MikelHadADream]

It is a valid argument to say that he was not worth the money he was bought for.
Giroud played in front of prime Özil and Cazorla. People were frustrated with Giroud because we watched the matches and saw Giroud missing so many chances given in platter to him. But in case of Lacazette, that was not the case. We were not even creating that many chances last season in the away matches. And if you look at the heatmap and stats, you could see he was spending most of the time in our own half and helping with the defense.
I don't even see a reason why he needed to be given slack. If fans were giving him slack, there would be fans supporting him now too. Most fans have been asking him to be sold for a vast majority of this season. So they majority of fans were looking at his performances objectively.

Lacazette has missed as many if not more big chances than Giroud when you compare the two of them.

Even though I don't agree with your point about him helping the defence, let's say he did do that last season. What about his first season and this season?

Also, since when was it a strikers job to help the defence? Now I know Emery was very defensive, but I don't believe he asked Lacazette to go out there and concentrate on his 'defending'. The whole argument just reeks of excuse making to me.

I'm new to this forum so don't really know the general opinion, but from Arsenal fans I know in person as well as what I've seen on social media, even this season, he doesn't get anywhere near the level of stick that say Luiz or Xhaka have got in the past, despite being worse than the pair of them. That's what rubs me the wrong way with this guy.

 

[MikelHadADream]

Laca was quality last year, anyone saying differently has an agenda (if people use this as a valid excuse with Xhaka, then it certainly is valid here) he has been basically crap this year to avoid me being called an agenda merchant.

As for the away goals thing...

He scored 4 Premier league away goals last season, and 3 the season prior.

To me a quality Arsenal centre forward is Henry/Adebayor,/Van Persie/Aubamayeng. That is the level for this club.

 

[RacingPhoton]

Lacazette has missed as many if not more big chances than Giroud when you compare the two of them.

Even though I don't agree with your point about him helping the defence, let's say he did do that last season. What about his first season and this season?

Also, since when was it a strikers job to help the defence? Now I know Emery was very defensive, but I don't believe he asked Lacazette to go out there and concentrate on his 'defending'. The whole argument just reeks of excuse making to me.

I'm new to this forum so don't really know the general opinion, but from Arsenal fans I know in person as well as what I've seen on social media, even this season, he doesn't get anywhere near the level of stick that say Luiz or Xhaka have got in the past, despite being worse than the pair of them. That's what rubs me the wrong way with this guy.

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/big_chance_missed
Big chances missed in first two seasons of Giroud - 19 and 20 - Second highest and the highest by any premier league player in those seasons.
Big chances missed by Lacazette in his first two seasons - 13 and 13
Most of Laca's goals have been either equalisers or winning goals which obviously will stay in minds of fans. When the midfield and defense are not capable of moving the ball forward, you can either stand in the front and wait for the impossible to happen or go back and contribute in some way. Laca chose the latter.
Xhaka has the record for most errors leading to goal. How can anyone be worse?

 

[Football Manager]

He scored 4 Premier league away goals last season, and 3 the season prior.

To me a quality Arsenal centre forward is Henry/Adebayor,/Van Persie/Aubamayeng. That is the level for this club.

Adebayor missed a lot of sitters. We created ridiculous amount of chances for him. He wasted a lot.

 

[Riou]

He scored 4 Premier league away goals last season, and 3 the season prior.

To me a quality Arsenal centre forward is Henry/Adebayor,/Van Persie/Aubamayeng. That is the level for this club.

Laca has never really been our main outlet for goals, it's pretty much always been Auba first (a brief six month run with Sanchez aside) Laca is our secondary goal threat...compare him to other secondary goal threats in our previous teams.

For example in 03/04 Henry got 39 goals and Pires 19 goals, primary and secondary top scorers respectively...in 18/19 Auba got 31 goals and Laca 19, so the numbers kinda match up...obviously they are different player playing different positions, but teams don't always play the same way...Firmino never outscores Salah or Mane despite being the actual centre forward, cause Liverpool are set up that way (not saying Laca is as good as Roberto, don't want to start that again!)

And the team has been poor away from home from around Jan 2017, for a variety of reasons...yes I would like more away goals, but few our our players really perform away from home the last few years...and until we sort out our defence and midfield, Laca will always struggle...as his style of play is doing the grunt work for others, and until we can start dominating away from home again, he will be ploughing away without much reward.

I was happy with Laca for the previous 2 seasons, as I felt his all round play was good...while I have been unhappy this year, as I feel he has been poor in general play, nevermind the goals.

Laca isn't a top striker, but I will defend him on here as I feel he does get a hard time.

 

[MikelHadADream]

https://www.premierleague.com/stats/top/players/big_chance_missed
Big chances missed in first two seasons of Giroud - 19 and 20 - Second highest and the highest by any premier league player in those seasons.
Big chances missed by Lacazette in his first two seasons - 13 and 13
Most of Laca's goals have been either equalisers or winning goals which obviously will stay in minds of fans. When the midfield and defense are not capable of moving the ball forward, you can either stand in the front and wait for the impossible to happen or go back and contribute in some way. Laca chose the latter.
Xhaka has the record for most errors leading to goal. How can anyone be worse?

Lacazette cost 55million pounds, Giroud cost 12million pounds, I hold one to a higher standard. Giroud also scored goals away from home, and improved throughout his time at the club.

I don't like viewing football through stats and I'm not Xhaka's biggest fan, but look at our record with him in the team.

Lacazette contributes to this problem massively, when the defence and midfield are under pressure, he doesn't have the physical ability to run the channels, and when he does receive the ball a lot of the time he often gets bullied off it. No team, other than maybe Man city, can move the ball up the pitch perfectly every game. This is a big reason why our away form has plummeted since he has become the starting 9 (as well as other factors).

He just isn't a striker for Arsenal or the Premier league.

 

[MikelHadADream]

Laca has never really been our main outlet for goals, it's pretty much always been Auba first (a brief six month run with Sanchez aside) Laca is our secondary goal threat...compare him to other secondary goal threats in our previous teams.

For example in 03/04 Henry got 39 goals and Pires 19 goals, primary and secondary top scorers respectively...in 18/19 Auba got 31 goals and Laca 19, so the numbers kinda match up...obviously they are different player playing different positions, but teams don't always play the same way...Firmino never outscores Salah or Mane despite being the actual centre forward, cause Liverpool are set up that way (not saying Laca is as good as Roberto, don't want to start that again!)

And the team has been poor away from home from around Jan 2017, for a variety of reasons...yes I would like more away goals, but few our our players really perform away from home the last few years...and until we sort out our defence and midfield, Laca will always struggle...as his style of play is doing the grunt work for others, and until we can start dominating away from home again, he will be ploughing away without much reward.

I was happy with Laca for the previous 2 seasons, as I felt his all round play was good...while I have been unhappy this year, as I feel he has been poor in general play, nevermind the goals.

Laca isn't a top striker, but I will defend him on here as I feel he does get a hard time.

God, don't get me started on the Firmino comparison (you can probably tell what I think of it based on the tone of my previous posts ).

I respect peoples opinions on the player but for me, we have to get rid this summer, I'm hoping he still has some market value.

 

[Maybe]

Lacazette cost 55million pounds, Giroud cost 12million pounds, I hold one to a higher standard. Giroud also scored goals away from home, and improved throughout his time at the club.

Giroud was a really effective player from a financial point of view. Laca had 2 good seasons with us, and for 55m + salary he is on, that's definitely not enough.
We were also able to sell Giroud, something we won't be able with Laca, which makes things even worse for him when comparing the two. The financial loss with Laca will be huge for the club.

Saying that, at their best, Laca would be a better player, but Giroud managed to have a long successful career unlike Laca

 

[MikelHadADream]

Giroud was a really effective player from a financial point of view. Laca had 2 good seasons with us, and for 55m + salary he is on, that's definitely not enough.
We were also able to sell Giroud, something we won't be able with Laca, which makes things even worse for him when comparing the two. The financial loss with Laca will be huge for the club.

Saying that, at their best, Laca would be a better player, but Giroud managed to have a long successful career unlike Laca

He was poor in his first season in my opinion. Lacazette would be best in a slower paced league where he played with a strike partner in my opinion. Hopefully Inter or Atletico come in for him.

 

[RacingPhoton]

Lacazette cost 55million pounds, Giroud cost 12million pounds, I hold one to a higher standard. Giroud also scored goals away from home, and improved throughout his time at the club.

I don't like viewing football through stats and I'm not Xhaka's biggest fan, but look at our record with him in the team.

Lacazette contributes to this problem massively, when the defence and midfield are under pressure, he doesn't have the physical ability to run the channels, and when he does receive the ball a lot of the time he often gets bullied off it. No team, other than maybe Man city, can move the ball up the pitch perfectly every game. This is a big reason why our away form has plummeted since he has become the starting 9 (as well as other factors).

He just isn't a striker for Arsenal or the Premier league.

I agree that Laca was overpriced at that time. But Giroud had the advantage of being in prime form.
You are just looking at the wrong stats. Just because we won when a player is in the team, it doesn't mean that player is a good player. This season, the matches we played without Xhaka includes two matches against City, one against Chelsea, Wolves and Leicester. I don't think Xhaka would have made a difference there. And if you really want to think in that angle, we never progressed to CL ever since Xhaka joined.

How can Laca be contributing to defensive and midfield problems? Auba is brilliant goal scorer. There have been times when just stands in the front without any service from behind. Mind you, there are some posters who were bashing Auba for having disappeared from the game.
Our away form plummeted ever since our defense and midfield became a joke. Prior to that, strategies of mid-table and relegation teams were simple - Park the bus and hit Arsenal on the counter. Ever since we got players who are not good at handling press, even low level clubs have started pressing high when we are playing away.

Remember the times when we were very much frustrated because it was hard to break the defense of teams that were parking the bus and we suddenly give away a goal which would be their only shot on target for the match? And we moved from there to a state where we were giving away over 10 shots on target. Our away form has nothing to do with Laca last season. More to do with the pathetic defense and midfield we had.

 

[Erlis]

He had a good game yesterday, unfortunately what he lacks are goals. Hope they ll come soon.

 

[MikelHadADream]

I agree that Laca was overpriced at that time. But Giroud had the advantage of being in prime form.
You are just looking at the wrong stats. Just because we won when a player is in the team, it doesn't mean that player is a good player. This season, the matches we played without Xhaka includes two matches against City, one against Chelsea, Wolves and Leicester. I don't think Xhaka would have made a difference there. And if you really want to think in that angle, we never progressed to CL ever since Xhaka joined.

How can Laca be contributing to defensive and midfield problems? Auba is brilliant goal scorer. There have been times when just stands in the front without any service from behind. Mind you, there are some posters who were bashing Auba for having disappeared from the game.
Our away form plummeted ever since our defense and midfield became a joke. Prior to that, strategies of mid-table and relegation teams were simple - Park the bus and hit Arsenal on the counter. Ever since we got players who are not good at handling press, even low level clubs have started pressing high when we are playing away.

Remember the times when we were very much frustrated because it was hard to break the defense of teams that were parking the bus and we suddenly give away a goal which would be their only shot on target for the match? And we moved from there to a state where we were giving away over 10 shots on target. Our away form has nothing to do with Laca last season. More to do with the pathetic defense and midfield we had.

I agree that Laca was overpriced at that time. But Giroud had the advantage of being in prime form.
You are just looking at the wrong stats. Just because we won when a player is in the team, it doesn't mean that player is a good player. This season, the matches we played without Xhaka includes two matches against City, one against Chelsea, Wolves and Leicester. I don't think Xhaka would have made a difference there. And if you really want to think in that angle, we never progressed to CL ever since Xhaka joined.

How can Laca be contributing to defensive and midfield problems? Auba is brilliant goal scorer. There have been times when just stands in the front without any service from behind. Mind you, there are some posters who were bashing Auba for having disappeared from the game.
Our away form plummeted ever since our defense and midfield became a joke. Prior to that, strategies of mid-table and relegation teams were simple - Park the bus and hit Arsenal on the counter. Ever since we got players who are not good at handling press, even low level clubs have started pressing high when we are playing away.

Remember the times when we were very much frustrated because it was hard to break the defense of teams that were parking the bus and we suddenly give away a goal which would be their only shot on target for the match? And we moved from there to a state where we were giving away over 10 shots on target. Our away form has nothing to do with Laca last season. More to do with the pathetic defense and midfield we had.

Giroud had the advantage of being prime form what does this even mean lol.

I said other factors were involved, Xhaka being one of them. All areas of the team has declined massively, the centre forward position, which has been occupied by Lacazette, is no exception. The problem is centre forward is arguably the most important outfield position. If your striker cant take chances, you have no chance.

He contributes to the defensive problems because he has no pace or physical presence, so teams are extremely comfortable pushing up the pitch and attacking our weak defence.

I'm not talking about last season, I'm talking our away form since he has been at the club.

There is a reason that no top club has ever been in for this guy, and why we will likely struggle to find a buyer for him.

 

[RacingPhoton]

Giroud had the advantage of being prime form what does this even mean lol.

I said other factors were involved, Xhaka being one of them. All areas of the team has declined massively, the centre forward position, which has been occupied by Lacazette, is no exception. The problem is centre forward is arguably the most important outfield position. If your striker cant take chances, you have no chance.

He contributes to the defensive problems because he has no pace or physical presence, so teams are extremely comfortable pushing up the pitch and attacking our weak defence.

I'm not talking about last season, I'm talking our away form since he has been at the club.

There is a reason that no top club has ever been in for this guy, and why we will likely struggle to find a buyer for him.

Our away form had been crap ever since we bought Mustafi and Xhaka. Laca though not worth the money was still an upgrade to Giroud. If you look at goals and assists per minute played in the first two seasons, Laca was ahead of Giroud.
Every position in a football is equally important in a game. Are you saying that the central striker position is so important that even the opponent's shots an target are Laca's fault? Seriously, how? Playerd are pressing our defenders and midfielders because Laca is weak? What's kind of logic is that?

 

[BigPoppaPump]

@MikelHadADream with elite level posting in here, saying everything I was saying a year ago. Unfortunately the Lacazette fanboys like @RacingPhoton won't ever give up on him.

Even that one dumbass I can't even say his name comparing Lacazette to Henry, pathetic posting.