Country: Iceland
Maybe Arteta really wants to play Rice in that Xhaka role and not as a true DMC and thats where Paulinha comes in.
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Joao Palhinha
- Thread starter Yousif Arsenal
- Start date
- Replies 116
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Country: Iceland
BennyBlanco
New Member
Country: Canada
Around 8:30 or so within the video, he talks about how Arteta might be considering Palinha as a center-back. Drawing from Arteta's uses with players like White, Havertz, Xhaka, Timber, and Partey (using him as a RB), there could be some credibility to this idea. If Arteta is genuinely contemplating this move, Palinha might serve various roles: 1) partnering with Rice as a number 6 in challenging away matches, 2) acting as a backup to Rice, and 3) providing cover for Gabi or Saliba.
The idea of signing Paulinha to play CB makes a lot of sense especially if the plan is to use him how City use John Stones. He plays as a CB when we're out of possession and as a midfielder in possession.
This would make us less dependent on Zinchenko inverting from LB and that could improve us defensively. This could result in a back four of White, Saliba, Paulinha, and Gabriel that turns into a back three of White, Saliba, and Gabriel when Paulinha moves into midfield.
Rasmi
Negative Nancy
Country: England
Yeah we have to copy everything city does because that’s only way to play football. To sign one of the top central midfielders in the league to play as cb is as dumb as signing one of the best young cbs in the world and play him as lb like pep is doing
grange
Losing my brain cells 🥸
Country: USA
Player:Havertz
We've signed 3 CBs just to play them out wide. Ben White, Tomi, and Kiwior.
Frankly, when Pep moved Stones into midfield when in possession, he was copying us.
Arteta's decision to have Zinchenko invert from LB and move into central midfield with the freedom to move into the right side of the field completely caught Pep and the rest of the EPL by surprise. Having Stones push up into midfield was Pep's only way to mimic our tactics based off of his personnel.
It is obvious that Pep was copying us because he used to have Zinchenko on his team and never thought about playing him in that position, and Pep only allowed Joao Cancelo to move into the half-spaces. Pep and Cancelo even had a falling out that resulted in Cancelo leaving for Bayern because Pep was experimenting with his defenders and trying to find one who could play like Zinchenko. Cancelo couldn't play this position so he left the team because he didn't want to ride the bench.
During the season, Pep started playing Rico Lewis ahead of Kyle Walker because Lewis could invert into midfield, but that experiment failed because Lewis basically wasn't ready to be a starter. Pep even tried Bernardo Silva at LB, and that also failed. Pep also said that Kyle Walker didn't have the technical ability to invert.
After trying and failing to invert his fullbacks and Bernardo Silva, he then decided to push Stones into midfield and that's when everything clicked. Pep was using our tactics.
Already this season, Arteta has played Partey as an inverting RB and Timber as an inverting LB, and the reason for this, is so that we are less dependent on Zinchenko. Our tactics are that we move a defender into midfield to help retain possession and stop counter attacks. If that defender is a LB, RB, or CB the tactics are still the same.
Signing Palhinha as a CB/DM makes more sense than signing him to just be Rice's backup. And if we do this, we'd just be continuing our tactics from the start of last season, and not copying Pep. Pep copied us.
Well Pep signed Mascherano and played him as a CB
Vinci
The Sultan of Unai
Country: Netherlands
Dude, you never watched Pep at Bayern?
He was the first to do it with Lahm. Arteta didn't do anything new, and it certainly didn't catch him by surprise.
Hmmm didn’t Lahm’s actual position change though? There was also an actual right back playing, the white Brazilian guy forgot his name (Rafinha I think). I don’t remember him playing right back as his starting position and inverting into CM in possession, he was just always there. I could be wrong though.
Kobi
I Know Who You Are
Actually Rinus Michels was the first to do it with Ruud Krol, Guardiola didn’t do anything new either, all ‘his ideas’ came from Cruyff.
Whose ideas came from Michels.
Kobi
I Know Who You Are
The issue with Paulinha as a centre back stepping into midfield is it would probably mean Gabriel at LCB/LB which I’m not overly sure about, we saw with Kiwior and Gvardiol that the more traditionally built centre backs aren’t the most ideally suited to that role.
You want more of a centre back, full back hybrid, Tomiyasu is perfect, if he can stay fit.
Ake as well is ideal, centre backs with speed and agility of a fullback, Cruyff used to play Guardiola in that hybrid CB/CDM position but they only had one other centre back/sweeper (Koeman) and the other two were short full backs (Sergi and Ferrer).
Also if you have Paulinha next to Rice in possession, it‘s pretty restricted and you lose Zinchenko’s control/passing. If you play Zinchenko as a six then you have Rice as a eight, which again, I’m not sure.
Given the age and price tag I would rather go for more of an all rounder, Luiz, DeJong, maybe Barella.
You want more of a centre back, full back hybrid, Tomiyasu is perfect, if he can stay fit.
Ake as well is ideal, centre backs with speed and agility of a fullback, Cruyff used to play Guardiola in that hybrid CB/CDM position but they only had one other centre back/sweeper (Koeman) and the other two were short full backs (Sergi and Ferrer).
Also if you have Paulinha next to Rice in possession, it‘s pretty restricted and you lose Zinchenko’s control/passing. If you play Zinchenko as a six then you have Rice as a eight, which again, I’m not sure.
Given the age and price tag I would rather go for more of an all rounder, Luiz, DeJong, maybe Barella.
Rasmi
Negative Nancy
Country: England
You not gonna get luiz, de Jong or barella in January. We haven’t won a league in 20 years and if in January we are top. We have to strengthen instead of thinking oh that player may block us in the future. We desperately need a title
I really really like Palinha. Think he’s a fantastic Premier League no6. However, we don’t need him, Rice is in his best position at DM as pure quality there is very hard to find. Also, Rice + Palhinha is over kill.
In my opinion it’s quite clear what we need in midfield, we need a proper box to box player or a No8. Someone who has an engine, who is rugged, but still technical and can truly connect the midfield and attack.
The perfect profile which comes to mind is Barella, and another good example is Paqueta. Those are the kind of midfielders our team needs and is lacking.
In my opinion it’s quite clear what we need in midfield, we need a proper box to box player or a No8. Someone who has an engine, who is rugged, but still technical and can truly connect the midfield and attack.
The perfect profile which comes to mind is Barella, and another good example is Paqueta. Those are the kind of midfielders our team needs and is lacking.
I hold 2 opinions:
1. Pahlinha coming in doesn’t mean he becomes a guaranteed starter so there’s no real need to worry about him coming in meaning we’ll always play him and Rice together.
2. We (fans) need to stop thinking one window at a time and consider that a player signing in one window isn’t the end of the squad building process.
I believe January and Summer are going to be a revamp of the midfield. And not the top layer (the main 3 starters - Rice, Ode and Havertz) but the supplementary layer beneath them (Partey, Jorginho, Elneny, ESR and Vieira)
I think that Pahlinha is the first step in retooling the rotation layer into something more suitable for the progress we’ve made. I don’t think it’s going to be all 5 out and a new 5 in, but it would not shock me if 3-4 of those 5 aren’t with us come the start of next season.
Thats what I think this is, and I think some of us are just thinking too short term when considering where so and so would fit and who such and such might play with.
1. Pahlinha coming in doesn’t mean he becomes a guaranteed starter so there’s no real need to worry about him coming in meaning we’ll always play him and Rice together.
2. We (fans) need to stop thinking one window at a time and consider that a player signing in one window isn’t the end of the squad building process.
I believe January and Summer are going to be a revamp of the midfield. And not the top layer (the main 3 starters - Rice, Ode and Havertz) but the supplementary layer beneath them (Partey, Jorginho, Elneny, ESR and Vieira)
I think that Pahlinha is the first step in retooling the rotation layer into something more suitable for the progress we’ve made. I don’t think it’s going to be all 5 out and a new 5 in, but it would not shock me if 3-4 of those 5 aren’t with us come the start of next season.
Thats what I think this is, and I think some of us are just thinking too short term when considering where so and so would fit and who such and such might play with.
At Bayern, Pep moved Lahm into midfield and Rafinha played RB instead. Lahm wasn't an inverted RB. He was a RB who was converted to a midfielder and could play either position.
Lowe with the German national team copied these tactics and played Lahm as a DM too.
Converting a fullback into a DM is completely different than playing with an inverted FB.
Pretty much this. Sometimes transfers come down to timing and opportunity, best example of this would be us signing Raya when the opportunity presented itself.
Going forward we need a player like Pahlinha, in January may the only or best opportunity to do so whilst also improving us for the run home.
Also I think we're due to a traditional full back signing so in the event that does happen then a Rice/Pahlinha midfield is more likely to work.
