jeromelee
Well-Known Member
celestis said:
But for 1.75mil pounds? Taking a piss more like it
-
! ! ! IMPORTANT MESSAGE ! ! !
Discussions about police investigations
In light of recent developments about a player from Premier League being arrested and until there is an official announcement, ALL users should refrain from discussing or speculating about situations around personal off-pitch matters related to any Arsenal player. This is to protect you and the forum.
Users who disregard this reminder will be issued warnings and their posts will get deleted from public.
Lucas Neill
- Thread starter GoonerGurjit
- Start date
- Replies 63
- Views 3,839
But for 1.75mil pounds? Taking a piss more like it
asajoseph
Established Member
Ziontrain said:
Yes, you got me. In fact, I've only started supporting Arsenal this season.
Same old nonsense from you, I'm afraid. About the only thing correct in your post was the date. I was just wondering though - were you referring to the same unbeaten season in which we conceded 4 fewer goals than anyone else and had the best defence in the league? And, because I missed it, I was wondering if you could tell me how many league games Lauren played that year?
Could you perhaps demonstrate somehow, just for my benefit as someone that doesn't actually watch football, how the league's got significantly better in that time, since we had the top defence in the league? Perhaps you could also point out, for the uneducated, which areas of Lauren's game (those that you keep referring to) have got worse in the time since then, as you claim? And could you finally clarify, what exactly did you think was sloppy about our defence that year? I might buy the DVD and watch that season, but to save me the trouble, maybe you could enlighten me?
I don't quite know what's motivating this fixation with Lauren on your behalf - perhaps he ran over your cat, I don't know. But, as a rule of thumb, I tend not to make sweeping unsubstantiated generalisations about players, and then accuse others of not watching the game. I find it makes one look rather stupid.
_scorpion_
Established Member
Lucas Neil would be a step up from Cygan and is versitle enough to play RB/CB. I'd have no problems with it but it wont happen.
On a side note Sagnol is almost certian to leave Bayern. Juve and Madrid are after him. I'll leave you in no doubt, Sagnol is a step up from Lauren from a defense point of view - He is world class!
They are different players though. Lauren is much more attack minded whereas with Sagnol you get a defender that knows how to defend.
So when you look at it I can't see Wenger moving for him because we all know Wenger prefers attacking football.
If were looking at attacking right backs, you would be hard pressed to find a more complete option than Lauren. I don'tt hink Cicinhio is better than Lauren. I have seen him on many occasions and he is a right winger playing in the right back position - not positionally sound at all!
On a side note Sagnol is almost certian to leave Bayern. Juve and Madrid are after him. I'll leave you in no doubt, Sagnol is a step up from Lauren from a defense point of view - He is world class!
They are different players though. Lauren is much more attack minded whereas with Sagnol you get a defender that knows how to defend.
So when you look at it I can't see Wenger moving for him because we all know Wenger prefers attacking football.
If were looking at attacking right backs, you would be hard pressed to find a more complete option than Lauren. I don'tt hink Cicinhio is better than Lauren. I have seen him on many occasions and he is a right winger playing in the right back position - not positionally sound at all!
Mr. Hotshot
Established Member
I dont mind if Sagnol comes. He's proven time and time again why he is world class.
asajoseph
Established Member
Is Neill willing to play oin Cygan's role though? And considering that Lauren is probably the most consistently fit player we have, his versatility is pretty much useless to us, as Lauren's not really likely to be missing too many games...
asajoseph said:
I take it you're referring to youself there. I'd point you to the posts above which apparently you haven't read. Obviously been following the thead with about as much focus as the games where you missed the sloppy defence we've been playing for two years.
We outscored Chelsea last season and didn't have a prayer of winning the league so obviously what improvement we are needing from the defense is NOT attacking skills. I'll let you figure it out. Might take a while, given that you are unable to identify the relevance of a defender giving away cheap corners, on a team that was struggling to defend set plays!
_scorpion_ said:
Neill could in a pinch but I'd think that you really want to have a backup CD with enough expertise to play that position regulary if someone goes down. Kolo will be off to the ANC and Sol's fitness is basically knockng on wood every week.
Also Hoyte continues to emerge, he could be that replacement for Cygan. He has seen some playing time and it seems that Wenger rates him. So maybe Hoyte could also emerge as the pure defensive alternative at the RB position. I would that that is the way Wenger will go.
asajoseph
Established Member
****, nothing gets past you, does it!
Or did you actually miss the irony?
Of course! You've hit the nail on the head! How on earth could I miss it at the time - it was never the fault of Kolo Toure not being able to track a man or the extended periods of reliance on Pascal Cygan that cost us last season, it was Lauren giving away too many corners (an oppinion for which we're relying on your expert judgement)!
Honestly, keep digging, you're only doing me favours.
Chelsea conceded 15 goals last season. If you think replacing Lauren will close that gap (we conceded 36), you're deluded. The season before, we conceded 26 goals, and Lauren played 32 league games. Perhaps you could provide a substantive argument as to why Lauren's supposed decline in performance had anything whatsoever to do that, because all I'm hearing from you at the moment is foaming at the mouth.
Perhaps you could also explain why, given the fact that we have 3 senior central midfielders, one of whom's a teenager (Fabregas) and another the epitome of average (Flamini), three legitimate strikers, a 36 year old goalkeeper and no legitimate backup, and only four senior CB's one being injury prone and two error prone to various degrees, replacing Lauren with mediocrity like Lucas Neill is a good idea? You haven't managed it yet, but seeing as you obviously watch so much football I'm sure it won't be a problem.
Seeing as you've failed to back your arguments up at any point, whilst consistently avoided answering any of the challenges to your 'theory', I really don't see the point in having a discussion with you any further. I would tell you to have the last word, just to make you feel better, but ultimately that will fall to Arsène Wenger. And, as far as I can tell, he doesn't feel the same pathological hatred towards Lauren as you do.
So go ahead, have the last word. It might be therapeutic. But ultimately, you're raging at the wind.
asajoseph said:
This would be the same guy who persists in playing Cygan? Thank you: I think you just underlined Wenger's only weak spot: too much loyalty. Fergie or Mourinho would have upgraded Lauren's position a long time ago - ask Wayne Bridge or O'Shea if you have any doubts. Hell, ask Ryan Giggs...
asajoseph
Established Member
As a first choice?
Though I guess he persists about as much as you can with a 4th choice CB...
brianfrance
Established Member
Lauren was our second top passer last season, with over 80% success rate. You dont find reliable passer at RB very often! Most of them would piss their pants playing our passing game, and would spend their whole ****ing time crossing at the 3rd post, in the stand, or straight at the keeper. I feel people still blame lauren for his bad game against manure at higbury - he was ****, true. But he proved in recent years that he's reliable and one of the best in the league. For me hes an arsenal legend, comitted and humble. The loyalty argument is wrong, lauren had a bad spell last season, he was left on the bench with kolo playing on the right. So...
Neills just a The Sun idea, nothing more I believe.
Neills just a The Sun idea, nothing more I believe.
Gurgen
Established Member
Yes, Lauren is a good passer. Back to Kolo or Gilberto/Cesc that is. How many times do you see him putting in real creative passes? Or any decent crosses for that matter? Sp**s away last season and Sunderland at home this season are the only ones that come to mind.
And Asa, you can't deny he can be very clumsy and give away needless free kicks and corners. I've seen him trying to see the ball out and then accidentally knock it out for a corner countless times.
Don't get me wrong, Ralph is one of my favourite players and I love his attitude, fire and commitment, but we can do a lot better.
And Asa, you can't deny he can be very clumsy and give away needless free kicks and corners. I've seen him trying to see the ball out and then accidentally knock it out for a corner countless times.
Don't get me wrong, Ralph is one of my favourite players and I love his attitude, fire and commitment, but we can do a lot better.
asajoseph
Established Member
It's true - Lauren does appear to give away corners a little too easily at times. My question however is whether or not it's genuinely statistically the case that he gives away more corners than others - it might not be, but I really don't know. However, I certainly do feel that blaming our defensive weaknesses over the last year or so on Lauren giving away too many corners (which none of our defenders were particularly able to defend) is ridiculous. Regardless of whether or not he did give away those set-piece opportunities, making him the scapegoat and ignoring the obvious positional failings of our CBs in those situations is grossly unfair.
As for putting in real, creative passes, he does his fair share for a full-back I reckon. Not huge amounts, but he does his bit. He holds the ball well, and keeps possession, which is something that I feel is often a little under-rated if a player's not the sort to ping 50 yard passes every five minutes.
Furthermore, I'm not denying that there are perhaps better fullbacks out there than Lauren. Not as many as the press seem to think, and certainly not Lucas Neill. But Lauren's a good player who does a good job, and at a time when we have limited resources (although it's unclear what that limit is) and other, far more pressing needs, wasting time and money at this stage trying to bring in someone like Neill seems like a comlpete waste.
As for putting in real, creative passes, he does his fair share for a full-back I reckon. Not huge amounts, but he does his bit. He holds the ball well, and keeps possession, which is something that I feel is often a little under-rated if a player's not the sort to ping 50 yard passes every five minutes.
Furthermore, I'm not denying that there are perhaps better fullbacks out there than Lauren. Not as many as the press seem to think, and certainly not Lucas Neill. But Lauren's a good player who does a good job, and at a time when we have limited resources (although it's unclear what that limit is) and other, far more pressing needs, wasting time and money at this stage trying to bring in someone like Neill seems like a comlpete waste.
Buhry
Established Member
Country: Norway
Lauren was acutally the 11th best passer in Europe last seasons, when it came to completed passes. 89 %.
But then again, Puyol was the 'best ' passer in Europe, according to that same piece of statistics..
IMO, Lauren is quality, and we should'nt sell him. Unless we get a very nice fee, wich i doubt we would. If we sold him, then we would have had to find a worthy sucsessor, and i highly doubt there is anyone out there as good as lauren avaliable.
But then again, Puyol was the 'best ' passer in Europe, according to that same piece of statistics..
IMO, Lauren is quality, and we should'nt sell him. Unless we get a very nice fee, wich i doubt we would. If we sold him, then we would have had to find a worthy sucsessor, and i highly doubt there is anyone out there as good as lauren avaliable.
I think Lauren has been very good this season. He certainly has improved his offensive game. Besides Reveillere I dont see any RB being much better. He's definetly PL best RB (along with ferreira). Come to think about it, there arent many WC players playing RB, LB. Maybe Sagnol and that idiot cole (he's good no denying that).
I do think Eboue will be great.
I do think Eboue will be great.
Chips&CurrySauce
Well-Known Member
I can't believe Lauren gets so much stick.. He is a quality player!!! There are very few full backs that has his composure and good touch.. His touch I think is oone of his main assets, as a footballer he is actually quite talented.. He is committed, goes in strong and overlaps on the right.. I honestly can't think of that many full backs that are significantly bettet than him..
We have far more serious and urgent problems to solve, like the midfield, than to worry about Lauren, who is very consistent and in the main reliable!
We have far more serious and urgent problems to solve, like the midfield, than to worry about Lauren, who is very consistent and in the main reliable!
Sammer
Established Member
Chips&CurrySauce said:
The only interesting improvement I can think of is Willy Sagnol. Sagnols passing accuary is pure class, as is his defending.
But like Chips&Currysauce said - we have far more serious problems to solve.
Lauren remains a class player.
asajoseph
Established Member
On the other hand, Trabelsi is a guy who offers what Lauren does and a little more. He's a great player. Indeed, I believe there's a thread about it already...
_scorpion_
Established Member
The only real option I'd consider as a replacement for Lauren would be Sagnol.
Trabelsi does not impress me.
Trabelsi does not impress me.
